A question of Honor

[Beta]

Think Survivor. Yes, that reality TV show. It is still one of the best parallel's for a MP civ game.

So yes, IMHO, the attack from player B should have been predictable, and is perfectly honourable.

(with honour being spelled properly.... )

[MinorAnnoyance]

Ten turns!?! Who do they think they are?

[freakmon]

The 'Whiner'

This was a game in which I, the whiner, clearly was non-aggressive to humans while RAH (with his obvious clan of half-wits) began claiming the ground around him. Person 'B' could/should/would have attacked RAH had he been any other person except his 'boss' or 'real life friend'. No, this was a clear and evident gang bang as the Friday night games have become. "Invite someone to the game to attack while the rest of you take up the AI's land and resources". Simple and to the point: this 'game' consumed time and energy I now have returned to my business which has already rebounded within 2 weeks of returning attention to it. The scenario is: In the previous 3 games, I showed I was the 1st/2nd strongest player and the only way to prevent my victories was to hit me while I'm in the middle of attacking. 'If' I were to ever play this group again, it would be by bypassing any and all AI and simply taking out who was obviously much weaker (by power, land, resources) human opponent. This style of vulture game play is reminiscent of a band of thugs taking turns on a single opponent in a dark alley. I prefer to play games of wit and chivalry; of warrior strength and gladiator fortitude; not games where each of the other players are real life friends and business associates and it is clear they will not attack each other until reducing their single other human opponent through cowardice attacks. RAH/Ming/whoever else runs this site now, you can say, do, post whatever. You can remove the account, you can write any number of 'scenarios' for others to ***** and moan about 'the whiner', but what you cannot do is contend that these actions were a sign of true valor from a valiant warrior mind executing a tactical battle in open field. Weak, pathetic, and the sign of a coward. That's what this was and it shows the true nature and character of the other player(s) in said game. I have more intelligent and profitable endeavors to pursue. Enjoy your little fantasy worlds.

[Krill]

So you're complaining about getting attacked at a bad time for you:

N00B

[Ming]

Yeah... snoopy has NEVER attacked me, or rah, or anybody else in a game first... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA
I'll keep that in mind the next time he takes me out early, something he has done often enough to me in the past.
Hell, even my twin brother has knocked me out of games... When it makes sense, people take their friends out.

The secret to winning MP is to beat people. And if somebody is silly enough to leave their border with me empty while they go attack an AI, I will try to gut them.

You blame everybody for your own silly mistake, not securing your own borders when off on campaign.

When I started this thread, I was interested to see if anybody would agree with your opinion. I didn't want to slam you so I named the players A and B. I saw no need to make this personal, but I was interested to see if others would view it the same as you. Obviously, from the response to the thread so far, I have my answer.

And your response is anything but Valor and Honor.

[freakmon]

Bu11 Sh1t, Ming. You didn't want to 'see' if an opinion was shared. You wanted to air out load and gain fodder. Don't expect another response. I will say one last time. Enjoy your fantasies.

[deity]

It's important to protect your borders, yes, particularly when on the attack.

I think it would be good however if Ming and Rah dissipated the 'perception' that they support each other. I've not played with them much for quite a while and I don't have a complaint but if I was in a game with my brother I would be scrupulously careful about this.

Most players I know wouldn't attack another civ while it was attacking elsewhere but you should always be prepared for it - it happened to me recently

[Berzerker]

slick move (I'll be watching you), painful for the freakmon

we understand

but how was Rah in on it?

[Robert]

Don't cross your eastern border if you can't protect your western border.

[Ming]

Bu11 Sh1t, Ming. You didn't want to 'see' if an opinion was shared. You wanted to air out load and gain fodder. Don't expect another response. I will say one last time. Enjoy your fantasies.

If I had wanted to trash you, I would have named you and pointed abuse at you. But I didin't. I really wanted to see if your argument had any validiy. You were the one that made it personal. So you are the one that should be enjoying whatever fantasy you live in. Because frankly, you are the one that looks bad here. The comments posted by others sum up that you were the one that made the error.

So enjoy

I guess I'm used to playing war games with friends. We don't take it personal if a buddy attacks us. Because that's the way the game is played. If you can't deal with it, there is always SP for you.
But even then, the best of relations will attack you if you leave your borders wide open.

I leave it to the community to judge reality here

[Asmodeous]

In a friendly game I can completely see where he's coming from, but in a friendly game there's a pre-existing agreement that people are either going to gang up on AI or generally not take advantage of a mistake (for instance a learning game, where the vet player would instead of attacking say "You realize that you just left it open for me to stomp you, right?")

But in a typical online game against a random pug? No way. You leave yourself open and you're inviting the pain train.

Me.

[Ming]

In our games, you make deals with your neighbors, and most of the time, they actually keep them
I guess many of us older gamers all grew up playing war games long before the interent even existed. You played all your games face to face, and unless you were in some tournament, you were playing with your friends and people you knew. So attacking your friends and buddies was the only way to win a game. Nobody took it personal unless you violated an agreed deal. Try playing a game of Risk or Diplomacy without attacking your buddies... the games take forever and nobody wins

So again, unless you have a deal with somebody not to attack you, you should always be prepared for somebody to take advantage of you when you are out of position. That's how the game is played and won.

Next time Snoopy or Rah take me out early because I did something stupid, I won't stomp off and claim I will never play again. I'll just learn from my mistake and make sure I don't do it again.

[Berzerker]

Don't cross your eastern border if you can't protect your western border.

or as Patton said, attack in both directions

[Berzerker]

Try playing a game of Risk or Diplomacy without attacking your buddies... the games take forever and nobody wins

Did you play Diplomacy by Avalon Hill? Nasty game even nastier in person

We had a Diplomacy league here a while back with close to 20 people

[Ming]

We played Diplomacy in our college gaming club. We played face to face. It was brutal and fun, especially since everybody was good friends and drinking buddies. Did you ever try a game called "Junta"... another great back stabbing game.