Pitboss Diplomacy Game

[Robert]

Won't pick any of those traits anyway, no matter if I'm a top player or not
Unless there's not much choise left over of course!

[Vampgelus]

I don't consider myself a top-player at all, but i didn't project to pick any of those traits...i believe it's a matter of taste.

[deity]

Well, if a top player has Ind and or Fin they can easily build the majority of the Wonders. This has happened in some games and is most unfair for the other players I think.

[deity]

BTW Cyber is a top player too. AND a Wonder hoarder

[Vampgelus]

My last weeks in SP were focussed on playing intentionally without building wonders (exept a few when there is really nothing left to do and i have the ressource for it).

Frustrating thing is, that everytime i start a game with that type of game in mind, i begin with stone and marble available in my capital or second city . And it's hard to control yourself when barbs are pillaging your territory and GW would only take 12 turns...

[OzzyKP]

Originally posted by deity
I suggest that the recognised top players NOT pick any civs/leaders with the financial or industrial trait.

Maybe nominate yourself as being in this category.

ozzy, deity and Toni are most definitely in this category.

I definitely agree.

Originally posted by deity
BTW Cyber is a top player too. AND a Wonder hoarder

Is he? Generally he kinda sucks in the games I've seen...


He is a good vassal though.

[OzzyKP]

vamp, bamf226, and the rest of you new comers, I highly recommend getting your feet wet in a diplogame before jumping into this one head first.

The best way to do so is to sub for a session in an ongoing diplogame. History of the World XII plays Sat/Sun from 12 am - 3 am US EDT (-5 GMT). This week there are three civs that need subs. It'd be great if people volunteered to sub.

The Mali, French, and Carpathians need subs.

[Pinchak]

I'll throw my 22 cents in...

First off, thanks to all those who support me in creating the map. I plan on putting alot of time into it (with the huge setting I don't think I have a choice). So far I am thinking of emulating earth. Not in the aspect of the shapes of the contenants, but more to do with the variety of landforms and terrain that is seen on earth, while keeping gameplay in mind. The biggest question at this point is... do we have a defined old world/new world in which civs from each would not meet until compass... OR, do we have everything connectable by galley? Personally, I don't see the need to keep everything connected, expecially with this many players. Of course noone should be isolated either.

As far as double leaders/double civs, I am in favor of no doubles. I am also opposed to unrestricted leaders, meaning no Mansa leading the Chinese. Call me old fashioned I guess...

Regarding fantacy civs, I don't have a problem with it as long as it isn't too goofy. For instance, in HOTW12 someone turned Holy Rome into Carpathia and is doing a wonderful job of keeping it in line with realism. Something really out of left field would detract from the game IMO. But to be clear, I wouldn't mind the example Ozzy used of a "baseball leaders" civ, as long as they didn't go into battle with baseball bats. It is a fine line between what is fantacy and what is just goofy. I personally would be fine with it as long as it "fits" with the rest of what is going on.

As far as banning or restricting certain civs, it would be nice to see a game (diplo or otherwise) without the Inca. I think people gravitate toward certain civs because they have a percived (although minimal)advantage. It is helpful to remember however that how you do in a diplogame is most likely 70% your civ4 ability, 29% your diplomacy ability, and 1% the civ you are using.

Regarding the NEXT WAR MOD... It IS an offical mod that came with BTS. Ever notice how the BTS box has a mech unit on it that doesn't appear in the game? That is the Next War mod. I myself actually don't like mods for many of the reasons others stated... BUT what is good about THIS mod is that it doesn't change anything about the gameplay AT ALL until the very last stages of the game. All it does is extend the game to a "future era". The units, buildings, and techs of this future era are pretty simple to understand. Before giving a quick "I hate mods" response, do yourselfs a favor and check it out. It isn't nearly as game altering as you are picturing, and would essentially take the game to a new level with almost no learning curve.

[Vampgelus]

Next war mod is nice but, for a reason that i don't understand, it raises research costs for all techs.

In addition, the very late units are unbalanced, since you will need at least the same unit to stop them.

Space race doesn't fit into that mod because it would come to early.

And seriously, the extra era would mean a couple of month longer game. Next war seems great for SP, or for standard MP, but for pitboss... in a diplogame ? (most of the techs are military)

[Heraclitus]

As to the map, I vote seperated new world/old world (reachable only with compass). The old world should have more civs (10 vs. 8) and should also contain an nearby contient reachable by galleys (you can make it the starting site of two or three civs, it would be kind of like Africa).

Originally posted by Pinchak

Regarding fantacy civs, I don't have a problem with it as long as it isn't too goofy. For instance, in HOTW12 someone turned Holy Rome into Carpathia and is doing a wonderful job of keeping it in line with realism. Something really out of left field would detract from the game IMO. But to be clear, I wouldn't mind the example Ozzy used of a "baseball leaders" civ, as long as they didn't go into battle with baseball bats. It is a fine line between what is fantacy and what is just goofy. I personally would be fine with it as long as it "fits" with the rest of what is going on.

I totally agree with this. I don't mind and in fact would like to see a "Carpathia" or two. For my personal taste a baseball civ is a bit much, but if you want to be the king of Rohan be my guest.

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by Pinchak

Regarding the NEXT WAR MOD... It IS an offical mod that came with BTS. Ever notice how the BTS box has a mech unit on it that doesn't appear in the game? That is the Next War mod. I myself actually don't like mods for many of the reasons others stated... BUT what is good about THIS mod is that it doesn't change anything about the gameplay AT ALL until the very last stages of the game. All it does is extend the game to a "future era". The units, buildings, and techs of this future era are pretty simple to understand. Before giving a quick "I hate mods" response, do yourselfs a favor and check it out. It isn't nearly as game altering as you are picturing, and would essentially take the game to a new level with almost no learning curve.

I would love this. The modern era is soo dull in civ4. It came with the game and would not change the game balance untill the very last stages of the game.


I vote YES, we should play with it.

[classical_hero]

I will join this game. That is making this 18 players.

[Heraclitus]

Yay.

[Vampgelus]

Originally posted by classical_hero
I will join this game. That is making this 18 players.

17... or did i miss someone ?

I'm not completely against Next War. I just don't know if it's a good idea for the reasons i gave.

[Pinchak]

for a reason that i don't understand, it raises research costs for all techs.

Was not aware of that... weird.

Space race doesn't fit into that mod because it would come to early.

Maybe if we decide to use the mod we nix the space victory. I always considered it a bit odd anyway that the game would end as soon as someone gets into space.

HOWEVER, this could throw an interesting spin on the late game. Civs would have to decide to go space or war. Since there is a lag time between researching the ship techs and building them, another civ could forgo the space option and build death machines to destroy the space civs. Something to think about.


We can discuss the pros and cons of many issues here, but I still think we should have a vote for some things, including the old/new world issue and using the Next War mod.