Announcement

**LzPrst** · January 24, 2008, 07:00

I'm using this post to summarize all contact info.

Please post yours in the Organization thread, and I'll summarize them here.

America -
Carpathia -
France -
Inca -
Holland -
Mali -
Mongolia -
Ottoman -
Russia -

**Diplo Inca** · January 24, 2008, 10:57

Let there be light!

They say that it was at night and that there he the Creator made the Sun and Moon and Stars, and that he ordered the Sun and Moon and Stars to go to the Island of Titicaca that is near there, and from there they rose to the sky. And at that time, the Sun who wanted to rise in figure of a very flamboyant man called to the Inca and to Manco Capac, as their superior and said: You and your descendants will be Lords and will subjugate many nations; take me as our father…and at that point he ordered the Sun, Moon, and Stars to rise to the sky and put each one in their place.

Following either a period of darkness or a major flood, the Sun God sent his two children Manco Capac and Mama Ocllo to lake Titicaca. He placed them in such a way that they were seen emerging from behind a great rock. The two children were instructed to travel from the island, with a golden rod, in search of a place to settle. The two were told to travel to a place where the rod could be sunken completely in the ground. At this location, the two were to establish their settlement. However, along the way they were also to teach man how to live in a civilized and productive manner. It was said that before they were living in a barbaric and brutish way. When they reached Cuzco, the rod was consumed by earth. Just as their father had commanded, the two founded the capitol of the Incan empire in that place.

**Diplo America** · January 24, 2008, 11:21

The Story of Britannia and Liberty...

In the begining the tribes were separate and all spoke different languages. Despite this, peace prevailed as the tribes would hold great feasts in honor of the mother goddess and her benevolence for her people; the flora bore great quantities of fruit, and the fauna provided an endless supply of meat. For centuries things went along this way and things went well. This prosperty begat increase in the tribal numbers, however this was not to be equal and the food supply became strained over time. Of these tribes the Yorkees hadd the most warriors, were the heartiest of people, and outlived the others. The Yorkees had, for years, been the protectors of the tribal plains, in exchange for this the smaller and more shortlived of the tribes, the Yankees, provided food to the Yorkees in exchange for protection against barbarians and animals.

This situation was to change as the game began to dwindle, as the lush natural gardens grew bare, and as the flowing rivers dried up. The Yorkees began to force the other tribes from their lands, and in some cases forced them into slavery as the young Yorkee workforce was employed in battle. The mother goddess was nowhere to be found, and men began to committ heresy against her. Not the Yankees though; they continued to provide her with sacrafice and song, for she had never forgot them, they remained fed and happy. The Yorkees knew that their survival depended on the food gathered by the Yankees, however a young Yorkee warlord named George fell for the beauty of the Yankee princess; Liberty. George tried many times to win her favor, but Yankee belief provided that the princess remain a virgin until a suitor was chosen, and her father Richard the Yankee declined. He feared that the Yorkees would take his people and subject them to slavery as they had done with the others.

This did not deter young George as he took a band of warriors into a Yankee camp and took Liberty by force. He then brought her into his tent and took her, against her will. Liberty would not accept his love for she said it was based solely upon her beauty and not the content of her heart, so he ordered his men to take her to bed as well, she was humiliated and her father infuriated. "Oh great godess!" he bemoaned "I would give my life, and all of the Yankees and their lands for vengeance!" There was no response from the heavens.

This did not deter Richard, he summoned as many Yankee men as he could and vowed to kill George. A great war erupted, and many were slaughtered. The peace that had been provided by the goddess was finally at an end. The Yankees were unable to overcome the advantage enjoyed by the Yorkish armies and Richard the Yankee was killed, George was killed, and many others fell in the great struggle. The Yorkee armies prevailed, setting the Yankee prarie ablaze in revenge. Liberty was able to assemble a large party to search for a new and safe home; the trek would be difficult though - she was pregnant. In her dream a beautiful woman appeared before her, "Liberty of the Yankees" she said "in this time of peril shall come a rebirth, you shall collect the remnants of the old tribes and find a new land. Your son, a half-breed shall be this land's new lord."

Liberty was astonished, she searched around her tent, nobody awoke, her guards didn't react at all. She tried stirring one, but he would not react.

"Liberty!" the woman cried "They will not wake, I am the mother goddess Britannia, I will not allow them to awake. You must lead these people a great distance, and found a city. If you do not the Yorkish armies will again molest your people. I shall show you how to create your own food from the ground, and to take fish from the sea for nourishment, I will teach your people the ways of civilization."

"Where will I go Britannia?" Liberty asked "I know nothing of the lands beyond these plains."

"You shall go to America my child" the goddess replied.

"I've never heard of it" Liberty cried "You must tell me where it is!"

"It is a land of amber waves of grain, of purple mountains majestically standing among the heavens, of the soaring eagle proud in his flight. You will find America Liberty, and there shall your people prosper."

With that Britannia was gone...

**Diplo America** · January 24, 2008, 14:36

In Search of Britannia and Ancient York...

The following comes from the 1989 textbook; In Search of Britannia and Ancient York....

thus the validity of this myth has always been challenged by contemporary archeologists. The lack of proof of an ancient city of York has been debated for at least two centuries as a hot-button issue due to the feelings of patriotism and in many ways religious belief that hinder real scientific research. The fact that many in this country have taken the term "Yorkee or Yorker" to be used to describe racial supremists also lends difficulties to a true and open discussion on this issue. In general though, the tale has always been thought of as a myth and the debate hasn't been over its authenticity, but its basis. If one looks at it from a literary perspective, its easy to determine that the story is imaginative; the fact that the princess in this case has the name 'Liberty' which is a word used in current American to mean freedom of action implies that this was more a fable than an historical account. The very nature of the 'Yankee' (or ancient American) population, which was one of a humble and diminutive farming race, lends credence to the argument that this was an invented story. Others, however, point out that there are many coincidences stacked against the argument that this was a simple patriotic tale. they point out that the city of Richmond must have gained its name from the fabled Chieftan Richard the Yankee, others point out that the name Virginia (the first recognized American kingdom) refers to the virginity taken from Liberty by George of York. The name of New York, which has no obvious or apparent 'old' predecessor is also used to support this theory, however many say that the name New York itself was created simply based on this tale.

The best evidence supporters can muster, however, is the preponderance of "fertility statues" found in the region surrounding modern-day Washington. These statues have always been assumed to be fertility statues, but the ancient mythos of the Americans seems to have no strong ties to a fertility goddess, and the only renowned pregnant woman in American mythology is Liberty herself, pregnant with the half Yorkish half Yankee son of George of York himself. It is going to be difficult to find the ancient York for many reasons, the biggest of them though is that there is no indication in the tale or any of its variations as to where the Yankees came from, or where York could have been other than the constant mention of 'the plain' or 'the plains,' implying that York existed in some flat area which lacked trees...

...As for her first leader, the Yankee tribes that comprised America decided around the year 4,000 bc that their people needed one leader. Prior to this the American tribes were separated into smaller and distinct states containing separate yet nominally united Yankee clans or 'states.' History is confused as to why this occured, the best guess is that there seems to have been some sort of contact with another group and this may have led the Americans to determine that they needed some form of central negotiating authority. Whatever the reason electors were chosen from the various states to decide upon a Chieftan. This is where the tale of Britannia becomes muddled in contraversey; the chieftan chosen was Samuel the Yankee, who not only was the Chief of Virginia, but also claimed descendecy from Richard the Yankee and Liberty herself (this would also imply a Yorkish background as well, which allowed Samuel to claim strength and acumen as a warrior). In fact, the first account of Liberty, Richard, or even Britannia seems to have originated around this time, although this is from a cave drawing and has only been interpreted to be the tale of Liberty. Regardless of its reasons, the College of Electors chose Samuel the Yankee as their first chief, and ushered into history a new federation of the Yankees into the modern concept of America....

**OzzyKP** · January 25, 2008, 00:22

In the beginning Ozzy created the heavens and the earth.

Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of Ozzy was hovering over the waters.

And Ozzy said, "Let there be light," and the world builder was opened. Ozzy saw that the light was good, and He separated the light from the darkness. Ozzy called the light "revealed tiles," and the darkness he called "fog of war." And there was drinking, and there was snacking—the first hour.

And Ozzy said, "Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water." So Ozzy made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. Ozzy called the expanse "sky." And there was IMing, and there was surfing—the second hour.

And Ozzy said, "Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear." And it was so. Ozzy called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And Ozzy saw that it was good. And 'lo a faint voice was heard and beckoned Ozzy to create less sea. Ozzy said, "Very well n00bs, let more dry ground appear." And it was so. Ozzy called this "low sea level." And Ozzy saw that it was less good.

Then Ozzy said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds and separated among the many corners of the world to create competition for resources. And Ozzy saw that it was good and balanced. And there was Apolyton, and there was CFC—the third hour.

And Ozzy said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, and let them carry on as if a great marathon, and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." And it was so. Ozzy made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. Ozzy set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And Ozzy saw that it was good. And there was MySpace, and there was Facebook—the fourth hour.

And Ozzy said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky." So Ozzy created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And Ozzy saw that it was good. Ozzy blessed them and said, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth." And there was youth rights, and there was work—the fifth hour.

And Ozzy said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. Ozzy made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And Ozzy saw that it was good.

Then Ozzy said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

So Ozzy created man in his own image,
in the image of Ozzy he created him;
male and female he created them.

Ozzy blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

Then Ozzy said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food. I give you this world with all these things. This earth is contained in a RARe package, so watch over it well and change the capitalization of the file name if needed." And it was so.

And Ozzy commanded the man, "You are free to adjust settings at any time; but you must not peak at the map of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you peak at it you will surely die."

Ozzy saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth hour.

Attached Files

hotw xii map.rar (32.3 KB, 156 views)

**Diplo France** · January 25, 2008, 03:36

Prehistoric French Mythology

Religion and Philosophy in French History

Chapter 2: :
French pre-Heroic Age Mythos: A brief summary

(10,000-3500BC)

“Long before cities, long before the lands took form. Before the plow, before the forge before the hunt, there was the Sun god. And the Francophone tribes were his children, and for a time it was good.”
-Songs of ye old troubadours, first verse first book by Pseudo-William

Early portrayal of the sun god.

As can be seen the pagan Sun God was sometimes regarded as a benevolent deity as late as the early middle ages, artist wishful of the legendary time when “the souls of men lived in the heavens” and “bodies had not yet been made”. Extensive sources can be found in the first millennia BC, these are clearly distorted since his worshipers finally died out centuries before. They had dwindled long before this, as can be seen in the creation myth that can be dated with some accuracy to the fifth millennium BC.

“The francophone’s cried out: Sun God let us live in the world the Ozzy created! But he was jealous and refused to do so. Man found his way into the world, he solved the problem of connectivity with his moral form. But not before in rage his children, all the people of Terra, stole fire from the Sun.”

~a written account of local legends dating to the 2000's BC

“For this I curse man, fire he shall have, and fire shall consume him!”

~ the Sun God

The sun god on his chariot.

This curse, may have helped the Sun God, being corrupted, by lingual mistakes, into the Fire God, whose cult spawned in the early Bronze Age amongst the workers of metal. It was also conductive to later religions personifying the “Fire God” or “Light Bringer” as an evil malicious entity.
It may also be the source of the Ragnarok myth, since the classical god Lz-press (known as Prst to the Northern warrior tribes) gives no reason as to why the doomsday takes place. More likely it is merely a variation of the myth, since such prophecies were common in Neolithic warrior cultures across the globe.

“He is strong! If I die, I have to go before him, and he will ask me, “What is the riddle of youth rights?” If I don’t know it, he will cast me out of Valhalla and laugh at me.”… “That’s Ozzy, strong on his mountain peak.”

~ a response to a ritual question amongst the ancient FranCeltic clans

The fierce clans.

Note: The picture of the clansmen shows beautiful examples of early French shields. These afforded cover from arrow fire and served as symbols of status among the nobles and warriors.

“The Sun rides on its chariot far higher than the mountain peak, my God laughs at Ozzy!”

~Local Sun shaman living in the Northern French jungles 2100BC, recorded by a classical writer.

The Ozzy divinity most likely began as a agricultural god. Others claim he was a god of music, but this is disputed. His successful competition with the earlier Terra-Mother Goddess may explain why no artifacts of her follower are found in ancient France after 7000BC. After her defeat he may have taken on other characteristics such as connection to the adolescent stage of life. And much later, the act of creation of the material world. He clearly competed with the Sun god, as a viable supreme deity. We can not surely say which of the two was older, for like the Sun God clear evidence of him is only found at the end of the fifth millennium BC.

Ozzy with simbolic eye protection of and the light of Ragnarok behind him.

The afterlife in Valhalla was a optimistic one: Brave and honorable leaders would feast, have the company of young maidens and play game which original name is lost to history, but we can safely say it was supposed to prepare them for the battle of Ragnarok and that it was turn-based.

**Diplo Mongolia** · January 25, 2008, 06:15

Good morning students, for those of you who don't know me, I'm Professor Randall and I will be your main lecturer in this 301: Mongolian History and Culture Class. My assistant Ms. Summers will take care of study groups. If there are any organizational questions feel free to ask her. And before you bring your own calamities upon yourself and ask her, yes, she is part Mongol.

Now as you should know this is an introductory lecture only, so I won't be going into the details or the specifics, but instead some interesting tidbits and facts and other trivia as well as a little background information.

It is uncertain when the Mongols first settled down, but it is suspected to be somewhere around the time of the rise of the great city states in other parts of the world, around 4-3000 bc. Some of my fellow researchers have claimed that it was not until what we refert to as the late renaissance that the Mongols truly settled as we think of it. Instead, the Mongols would live out in the surrounding lands and come only sparingly and occasionally into what has now become Mongolian cities. In some parts this is still the norm.

Early Mongolian "cities" were in fact mere trading posts for a vast surrounding expanse of land. In addition to being a center for trade, the "cities" as we will refer to them as simply because it is the term with which we are accustomed to, were also centres of culture and politics. Ms. Summers will get back to you on Mongolian Culture in a later lecture. Mongolian politics were and still to a large extent are, related to the clans and blood ties of different families.

The earliest Mongolian politics consisted mainly in arranging marriages between suitable children, ages ranged from 8-12 at time of arrangement, which would then be followed through some years later when said children were reaching adulthood. It was a tradition that once a marriage had been arranged, the boy would go and reside with his future father in law to better learn the customs of his soon to be extended family, and to get to know his future wife. From this exceedingly complicated system of marriages and blood ties, grew the seeds of Mongolian political philosophy. Or as some would say, the lack of...

When the Mongols began encountering other tribes, they were often considered extremely savage and crude, because of their disrespect for human life. Do not draw the wrong conclusions, they were not barbarians. As my friend in the Russian literary department often jokes, Civilization is but a means to distance ourselves from the slavering jaws of nature. The Mongols had no such luxury as civilization in the traditional sense, nature was everpresent and deadly. It is no coincidence that a majority of the worlds most dangerous snakes, insects and large mammal predators are found in Mongolian lands. An insensitivity to human life became a necessity. For some reason the Mongols chose instead of building cities that kept nature out, they stayed in nature and kept cities out. Which possibly is the basis for their extreme physical and martial prowess.

The Ottoman scholar of the 7th century Ibn Khaldun speaks of the "cycles of civilization" where a city state would become weak and decadent only to be conquered by the aroundlaying nomadic cultures who lived in the harsh lands outside the city. The nomads could defeat the technologically superior cities because they had better cohesion and lived more phyiscally strenous lives, valuing skills like riding and fighting far more than city people. Once the nomads had conquered a city, they themselves eventually became city people, became decadent and weak and were in turn conquered by nomadic cultures in a few generations. Ibn Khaldun believed this process repeated itself every 80 years or so. Roughly every 3-4 generations. The Mongols never settled. There were no cities to conquer or settle in, the Mongols lived a permanent nomadic life. Sharpening their skills to uncomparable levels.

I see now that my time is running out, but I'll see you all again on Monday, when we will go into detail of the first sources we have of Mongol History.

**Diplo Carpathia** · January 26, 2008, 13:21

The Dawn of Man

"And from the monkey leapt forth man."- Carpathia State Issued Guide to History (2004 ed.)

**Diplo Carpathia** · January 26, 2008, 13:32

The Carpathians

Professional opinions vary, however most agree that evidence found at various archelogical digs suggests the Carpathian Empire began between 4500 BC and 3900 BC. The site locations indicates that various tribes seemed to band together during this time period to form a single tribe. In fact, all of the dig sites dated prior 3900 BC are located within the modern day capital of Târgoviste.

From various artifacts we know the early Carpathians were mystics, as well as accomplished hunters. A diet high in protein no doubt helping the advancement of the human mind.

One technique utilized widely was running the game into wooden spears buried in the ground. The cave painting below depicts this and has been dated to roughly 4000 BC.

**Diplo Mongolia** · January 26, 2008, 13:45

Yawn of man? oh, you put in some text and pics.
Short, simple, illustrative. I like it

**Diplo Mali** · January 27, 2008, 09:49

The Mali Chronicles Pt 1. Beginnings

How Mansa wished the grumbling would stop....

He didn't necessarily blame his tribe for complaining, given how much they had suffered over the years, its just that it didn't really do them any good.

It was nearly 15 years ago that Mansa had uprooted his tribe from their idyllic, semi-nomadic life on the beach & led them into the interior. During that time they had traversed the almost intractable Jungles of Despair-a journey which had cost dozens of lives. Even more of his tribe perished in the snow-covered passes of the Endless Mountain Ranges, & still there seemed to be no end to their journey-& so his people complained & wished that they were back on the sea-shore.

Just when Mansa thought he could no longer hold his tribe to his will, his forward scouts returned with news.

"Great Chief", said the leader of the group "we are nearly at the top of the pass, & below the pass is an amazing sight-you really must come & see." So, with just a small retinue, Mansa went with the scouts to the top of the pass, & what he saw below took his breath away.

A vast river valley lay below, bounded by mountains straight ahead & by jungles to the right. The valley itself was the meeting point no less then 3 different rivers. Where the rivers cut a path the land seemed lush & verdant. The plain was dotted with slightly yellowish hills & on the plains roamed strange looking beasts which Mansa could barely make out with his naked eye.

Mansa returned & spoke to his tribe "My people, you have suffered through innumerable hardships these past years, but have remained true & faithful, now that faith will be rewarded-for we have found our Promised Land!"

Mansa led his people over the mountain pass & down into the lush river valley below. After fording one of the shallower rivers, they chose to settle in a section of land which laid nestled between what would later be known as the Niger & Ghana rivers.

Here, the people built rudimentary homes out of stone mined from the surrounding hills-which would later be known as the "Yellow Hills". In the process, they found what gave the hills their yellow appearance. An amazing yellow metal ore that never faded or grew old, yet could easily be melded into beautiful object d'art. Little did the Mali at this point realise how this "yellow ore" would change their fortunes.

To their north, the Mali discovered herds of wild, woolly beasts which they learned could be harvested for meat, milk & fiber for clothing. At first they unsuccessfully tried to hunt these beasts, before finally choosing to capture some of their young & raising them themselves. In time, this process led to a domesticated stock of "sheep" which could be interbred & harvested at will.

So, after a long & dangerous journey, the Malinese people had found a place to call home-& the people who once grumbled & groaned now hailed Mansa as their saviour.

The age of the Mali had arrived.....

**Diplo Mongolia** · January 27, 2008, 10:09

The earliest Mongolian civilization.

Welcome back to our lecture on Mongolian History and Culture. Today we will be dealing with two sections of ancient Mongolian history. Pre-Bronze Working times and the Bronze Age, or as Mongol scholars refer to it, early to mid Equestrian Age.

The Mongol tribes were long spread out over a small area known as Runan'Gee where the River Onon splits into Orhon and Shilgan. The etymology of the word is uncertain, but believed to mean something like "Stargazers Home", illustrating the importance of the night sky in Mongolian culture. Runan'Gee has been Francofied into Ao-Nonjeux, and from that Dutchified into Maon'gjoj, later transcribed into the current form, Mongol. The Mongols did not see themselves as a unified tribe at the time, there were dozens of tribes, clans and families living across the plains, but their common trading centre was at the river confluence, and this created the basis for their common culture.

For those of you who are not overly familiar with distant lands' geography, Mongolia lies on the vast dry flatlands known as the Mongolian Plain, beginning southeast of the foothills of the Khentii Mountain range. Starting in the eastern Khentii Mountains the icy river Onon flows through the middle of the plains, creating a fertile basin where it forks into the Shilgan river, flowing south out into lake Akhitnur. The other fork of the river, the Orhon, runs south and east, continuing for a vast stretch to where it together with the Frozen Flow runs into the Great Eastern Ocean, forming the famous tourist attraction, the Horseshoe Waterfalls.

From the southern Khentii mountains the Khalkha River runs straight south, and meets with the Incan river Khalkynalaka and empties into the bay of Akhit. This river was the ancient historical border between Inca and Mongol lands. North and east of the central river Onon lies French Mongolia, so named because of the proximity to the French border. Across the Khentii Mountains, lies the Ottoman Empire.

**Diplo Mongolia** · January 27, 2008, 10:11

We have very few sources from early Mongolian times. The Mongols themselves have never cared overly for the written word, a man is only as good as his actions it is said in a Mongol proverb, and writing is not an act for a man. Now allow me to stress most strongly that does not mean that they do not care for storytelling, poetry, rhetoric, drama or any other form of expression which we traditionally view as belonging to the domain of writing. On the contrary, as you know, Mongolian culture is wildly vibrant and widespread, but to an extreme extent it is based on oral memorization techniques instead of writing. Also important, it does not mean that the Mongolians do not read, they are one of the greatest consumers of literature in the world per capita, but most of their own productions are in non-written form. It may seem difficult for us who live in a written and visual culture to imagine keeping a whole novel in your head, but for example, Ms. Summers' grandmother whom I had the pleasure of meeting last time I visited Mongolia, knows among other texts, the full works of Shakespeare by heart. Impossible you say, as did I, but the old lady could recite every line, stanza and verse, perfectly. I had to use a copy of the book to check. Obviously, I'm not as smart as an 74 year old dairy maid.
*Laughter*

So, as I was saying, most of the earliest historical sources of Mongol civilization are from its neighbours. The Incas have some clay tablets denoting land divisions, France has some ancient pictographic carvings seeming to indicate what can only be interpreted as Mongolian Chariots. We know this about the Mongols of the pre-bronze age, that they spread rapidly and roamed great distances from their central trading post Runan'Gee. Apparently the very first practical application of the Wheel was the Mongolian Chariot. A formidable weapon of the time, an open wagon drawn by horses and manned with spearmen, axemen or archers.

The Mongols dominated the vast flatlands with these mobile weapons and were very hostile to any foreigners who would wander onto the plains east of Khalkyn river and south of the Orleanic hills, which are the only elevated landmark on the whole northeastern plains. Keeping the peace some clans came to dominance, this would be relevant into the Bronze Age, which is why we know their names. Subutai the Merciless as Ottoman and Incan sources describe them, dominating the western plain, and Hulegu the Swift, masters of the northeastern plain, described in French sources. These were originally individual names, but came to be titles as the original 'Wheelmasters' as they called themselves died in battle or old age.

It is around this time that the Mongols discovered Bronze Working, according to archeologists, this discovery happened in Mongolia and France at exactly the same time. It is believed that a group of metalworkers living on the northeastern plain shared the knowledge with both peoples since it is unlikely that it was invented simultaneously in different locations, but a colleague of mine is aiming to prove otherwise by studying the remarkable dissimilarity of the earliest French and Mongolian Bronze items. Soon after this Slavery became part of French and Mongolian social structure. Possibly to control the metalworkers from spreading the knowledge further, and to make sure that only those already in power had metal weapons. Each of the strong clans had their own slavebound metalworkers, and none other might smelt bronze.

Following the discovery of Bronze Working the French as one of the first cultures began to write, which is why most of our sources on Mongolian history of the time are in pre-alphabetic French. Great fun to learn, I assure you.
*Chuckles*

Ok, it is time for a break and following that I will talk about interaction with other nations and tribes of the area in the bronze age.

**Diplo Mongolia** · January 27, 2008, 10:19

In diplogames you cannot play past the last turn of the save. it is considered cheating! you could theoretically explore unexplored lands, take screens of it, see when religions are invented, see when wonders are built and all kinds of other stuff that could then be applied during the next session. You could play to the industrial age and see where all the oil is!!! It is not allowed! And that goes for everyone!! You can go in and take screens, provided you do NOT advance the turn. It is strictly forbidden!!

and showing us what you are researching is nice, but is that really wise? maybe I'll speed up my own teching of mono to get it before you....

now that this has been resolved, I'll shrink it down a bit. but I do have a question.... I'll post it further down the line.

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