I am trying to bring back Diplogames...

[bumout]

Hey everyone, I don't know if any of you remember me or not (or are even the same people), but I am the Capo from the Diplogames.

The reason I am using this name is because my other one was deactivated and there is some strange process I have to go through and didn't feel like doing at one in the morning.

I want to try and get together some guys who are willing to play in a Diplogame using Civilization IV. The last one I was in was HOTW2. That game was pretty amazing up until the end when everyone started arguing and it ended in a mess, but deity remembers it (hopefully fondly), and commented to me that Civ IV is pretty good for a Diplogame right out of the box. So if any of you are interested in setting one up, or want to know exaclty what a Diplogame entails please respond here. If you don't give a **** just ignore this, thanks.

[deity]

Good one Capo.

Get Frank & ozzy in the loop and see what we can come up with. Maybe a scenario - still playing with the settings so maybe we need a little time to work out the best for diplos. I think Trev would be interested too if he gets his comp working And a few other Aussies like Mike might be in too.

USA Sat night (Aussie Sundays) would work best I reckon.

[OzzyKP]

Well I've no longer got a social life, so that means my schedule is free for a game. I think we should strike while the fire is hot and while interest in the game is high but people haven't settled into any familiar patterns yet.

Lets introduce this new/old style of playing to them and see if we can spark a whole new generation of diplogamers.

USA Sat nights work just fine for me.

btw, anyone reading this thread who is curious what a diplogame is, check out this thread: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...hreadid=101988

So who've we got?

Deity - China
Ozzy - Indians
Capo - Romans
Ljube - Russians
Frank Johnson - Mongols
Trev - Mali
Deity Dude
.....[your name here]

[OzzyKP]

As resident diplogame map guru, I checked out the prepackaged world map for Civ4, and I really like it, but its way too big for our purposes. Seven or even 10 civs on a map that size is going to leave a helluva lot of empty space.

I'll see what I can find.

I'm thinking of being either the Indians or Chinese. I made a nice map for Civ3 and was all geared up for our first Civ3 diplogame a year ago as the Indians, but it didn't work out, so it'd be nice to give them a shot.

Edit: Well its too early for there to be any maps available yet, so I started working on one a bit myself. My plan was to take a screen shot of the default world map, drop it in photoshop and then color code all the terran features so I can convert it back into a map with smaller dimensions.

Then I realized that Rhye (the guy who designed the world map) probably still has all his .bmp files from it. If he could send me those I could build the map MUCH easier. Or he could just do it himself.

So I asked him, I'll let you know when I hear back from him.


edit2: He said he is taking a break from civ so isn't doing any more maps right now, and he can't give out the bitmaps cause they are copyright or something.. meh. I'll get on making one myself, its just gonna take some work.

[Deity Dude]

I'd be interested probably but I have to get the game working first

[OzzyKP]

Hurry up!

Anyone see Rasputin these days?

[Capo di tutti Capi]

My logins will change for a bit until I get "The Capo" back...

This all sounds good to me so far, but I'd like a little time to familiarize myself with the game before I start playing again.

I just got it the other day, and I have a broken arm right now that will be healed in about two more weeks. Its my rotator cuff. I'm basically asking for about two weeks before we start, then we can figure out scheduling issues. Also I think having a large map may be a good thing if there's a way we can delay the progress of the game (i.e. technology, years per turn etc.).

I have only played it for around twenty minutes so far actually and I haven't really been around the game too much (including right now), so I'd like to at least slightly improve and develop a better understanding before I play a good Diplogame.

By the way everyone, sorry for my absence, it was long and I missed playing MP during that time. I've been playing a lot of Civ3 though, which I really didn't like at first but it grows on you after a while.

Peace.

[Akaoz]

Pardon my ignorance: What's a Diplo game? Diplomacy ported to CIV?

[Capo di tutti Capi]

A diplogame is...

This question is more difficult for me to answer now than it was when we first started diplogaming.

If you want an in depth answer visit the Civ2 Multiplaying forums, Ozzy put together a good reference guide for anyone who wants to get involved in diplogames or simply learn what they are all about.

For a short answer though; a diplogame is one in which the normal civilization achievments are replaced with attempting to achieve a realistically diplomatic game. This involved a lot of "diplomacy" (treaties formulized by the game's players, propoganda, power-treaties etc.), its an attempt to recreate real-life diplomatic situations rather than basing them purely on Civilization game engines.

Its a little hard to explain.

They're fun to play, but I must warn anyone who wants to try it out for the first time; its very time consuming and involves a lot of attention.

Sorry I couldn't get into it more, but my arm's broken so it sucks to type a lot.

[OzzyKP]

Its like a civ role-playing game. We don't just play, we act out our characters and leaders and develop intricate stories for each one (and write those stories out on the forum). So we behave like real leaders do (or try to).

As Capo said, check out the Diplogame FAQ, I posted a link to it above. Also for a good example of how one of these games looks, check out the History of the World 2 game that is saved in the DiploFAQ.

We always welcome new players.

btw Capo, 2 weeks is fine, I'm sure it'll take that long to get players confirmed, decide on settings, get the map created, etc. Plus I'm going out of town for much of this week.

[OzzyKP]

Someone made a smaller map (whew, saved me some effort), I still need to check it out and test whether it is suitable for us. And then clean it up a bit (to fit to my exacting attention to detail). But I think we've got a real good lead. If not, then I've got the .bmp files that I can use to resize it if need be. I'll check it out today.

[Capo di tutti Capi]

Damn log-in...

I'm still trying to fix my log-in problems, but alas...

Ozzy I just want you to know that you should do whatever you need to do, usually your maps have been superb and I don't see any reason why that should change now.

I would also like to ask whether or not its too premature to call the Romans as my tribe?

Anyone have a problem with this?

[OzzyKP]

Not too premature. You might want to take a look at the map though, Italy is rather small. Of course you'd have access to the rest of Europe which is pretty nice. But yea, I've been working on the map for way longer than I should have today considering I'm flying to California tomorrow. But its nearly done.

I just need to place the strategic resources and it should be ready to go. Civ4 has one buttload of resources, so that takes a lot of balancing for a perfectionist like me.

The size is perfect. The look of it was a bit shabby in some places when I got it (Europe looked TERRIBLE), but I've done my best. Europe still looks a bit misshapen, but its MUCH better than it did. Terran and such is pretty good now. Food and Lux resources have been placed. Just about to finish strategic and then I'll place the civs.

When I finish I'll give a complete overview of the map and post it. I can customize it further with more balancing once I know who everyone wants to be. I think I'm going to just decide to be India.

I put you down for Rome, and I'm keeping a tally above.

[OzzyKP]

Ok, I've customized the game for 7 players. I think if we have more or less players then that, it'll be fine.

I played arond with the resources forever, so you all had better be damn appreciative. I've done my best to balance per region based on historical accuracy and playability. I've also tried to keep the number of resources down. I like the idea of scarce resources because that drives competition. Some I've made more common than others. So here is the full list of how many of each resource there are (assuming I can count properly and didn't forget to delete some from the earlier version, which is entirely posisble):

FOOD:

Wheat - 7
Corn - 6
Rice - 6

The three staples are divided up by region. Rice is in the orient, corn is only in the Americas, and wheat is in Europe, Africa and Mid-east.

Cow - 10
Pig - 10
Sheep - 10
Deer - 10

Livestock is also roughly regional, though not as strictly as the crops. The Americas don't have any livestock except for a few deer. Pig are more in the orient, cows are more in Europe and Africa, sheep are more in the Mid-East.

Fish - 15
Clam - 15
Crab - 15

Seafood is fairly well spread out and easy to come by.

Fruit - 5

South Asia, Oceana, and South America.

LUXURIES:

Dye - 12
Fur - 12
Whale - 12

I made these the more common resources and are better spread out than the others.

Silver - 8
Gold - 7
Incense - 7
Sugar - 7

Medium rarity, everyone (assuming 7 players) can get one, but you might have to hunt for them. They are generally spread out.

Ivory - 4
Silk - 4
Spices - 4
Wine - 4
Gems - 4

The ultra-rare luxuries. Not everyone can get one. Are concentrated in one or two areas.

STRATEGIC:

Stone - 7
Marble - 7

These are spread out, there is enough for everyone, but they might not always be next to you. Each player should have easy access to at least one. Some spots have easy access to both. Most spots have access to both with a little effort. I figure there should be one for everyone in theory, but since they aren't necessarily essential, I don't feel bad if not everyone can get them easily.

Iron - 10
Copper - 10
Horses - 10

I consider these staples for having a decent military. So I've concentrated them in the Old World (where players will start), and everyone should have access to horses and either copper or iron, sometimes both.

Coal - 7
Oil - 7

Industrial age resources that everyone needs to be competitive, so there is one for everyone, but they aren't necessarily easy to get. There will be some imbalance here. So this could be a critical time for the game. Some regions may have more than their share in a certain one. Some players may have to hunt for harder to find ones, or make deals for them.

Uranium - 7
Aluminum - 7

Modern age resources for the space race and nuclear weapons. Again, they are important, so there is one for everyone, but these are NOT going to be easy to get. I've thrown these in very out of the way, inaccessable places around the globe. Those with colonial empires will be rewarded at this stage.

If/when I post the map, I'd prefer you guys didn't open it up and hunt out every resource I've placed so you can know ahead of time and plan for it. I think that'll be part of the fun of the game. I've given you some hints above, and you know how many of each so when you explore you can count them and know how many more you need to find. That should be enough, please don't peek.

Does this give me an unfair advantage? Heh, with as poor as my memory is, I'm not going to remember where I put anything two weeks from now when we start the game. Crap, some of them I have trouble remembering now.

[Frank Johnson]

Sounds real interesting! It looks like you're doing you're best also to place the resources where they were historically while still keeping some kind of game balance too. I'd be a little disappointed if I got to the south of france and didn't find wine, or in the california valley etc. And so on, finding them in the far away lands is half the fun.

The only other thing I can think of as far as the resources is that some of the technologies required to harvest some of the resources come much later than most. For example, wine requires monarchy, and anything that requires a plantation needs calander.

Because of that those resources, spices, fruit, silk, dye, incense and sugar (plus wine, although I dont think monarchy is as far as calander) might be better suited to the "rare and far flung" catigory than the others that are near by and can be harvested early.

Its probably not a big deal, but its possible to end up with what "looks" like a good starting location, but most of the resources can't be harvested for a few thousand years.