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To expand or not to expand....

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  • To expand or not to expand....

    ....that is the question

    What I can say with some surety is that what resources you land depends on how bold you are at grabbing land. Not every resource is going to necessarily fall into your hands, but by expanding as much as is possible without becoming militarily and economically weak, you have better odds.

    There is a risk of course that a land-grab strategy will net you nothing of value as far as resources go. However, it does set you up with a number of cities and a lot of territory, which may give you an edge you can use.

    In my last win, I had occupied most of a continent and there were still gaps (though my culture stretched over nearly the entire land mass) in which I could have placed more cities if I had needed to. I ended up winning on culture, but I could easily have picked another route.



    It isn't generally a good idea to go nuts building cities far away from the capital, but on this particular map the nearest deposits of copper and stone were some distance away from my capital. Not having those might have made my cultural win a little more difficult though, so I took a calculated risk and set up the two outposts (Marseilles, Tours) anyway.

    When my nearest neighbour (Catherine, or Russia) decided that I was becoming too much of a threat, I didn't have a problem fending her off, because while I didn't have an impressive army, I was quickly able to draft one. Three units a turn (Rifleman at the time) doesn't sound like much of an army, but it was enough for me to stave off the units which crossed the border seeking to pillage the land near Chartres, and buy time for me to train a more diverse fighting force. If I hadn't taken the initiative in securing land, I would have been in a much less favourable position.

    Indeed, when I uncovered Coal, Oil, Uranium and Aluminium, I found I had done well for myself.
    O'Neill: I'm telling you Teal'c, if we don't find a way out of this soon, I'm gonna lose it.

    Lose it. It means, Go crazy. Nuts. Insane. Bonzo. No longer in possession of one's faculties. Three fries short of a Happy Meal. WACKO!

  • #2
    In Civ III expand expand expand was the great cry. Less so in Civ IV. For sure such a strategy can still work as you have admirably shown. Civ IV is however less foregiving of the rush to land grab, and can be quite brutal in its response. In Civ III - usually - at worst far away cities had production of one, and life went on - they were a pain, but u could live with it. In Civ IV often you find that you are hit badly on the economic front by such cities or have large culture problems. Various ways to mitigate it of course, but now in IV you can play through with much fewer Cities, if thats your style.

    A subtle change that has had far reaching effects, and a clever move by Sid which makes it more playable - less blunt "one fix solves all " solutions

    Regards
    Zy

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    • #3
      I don't agree with a non-expand strategy. I always expand my empire in order to CUT the supply lines of my neighbours in case of war. If you position your cities covering access to sea or small "gates" to other parts of the same continent. In this way, the other empires ALWAYS depend on your generosity to grow. Besides, you never know where you are gonna find some resources. Therefore, I think expansion is crucial.

      Roy

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      • #4
        One game, not to long ago...

        I had started on a continent next to tokagawa, so i quickly settled on hills towards him to give my capital a buffer and give me nice defensible cities when he gets antsy. So i turned my vision the other direction and began exploring. What i found was a HUGE continent completely devoid of other civs. Well, isnt that special. Build a couple more settlers and secure a copper and build another hill city to defend against the soon to come barbarian horde.

        I begin military buildup, as Japan on 1 side and barbarians on the other leaves no choice. Japan stays isolationist but non agresive. I send my troops into the wild. Behold barbarian cities have popped up! ATTACK!

        I am forced, in a quest for peace, to conquer the entire landmass and civilize it. some 20+ towns about the time my research discovers the wonders of construction and catapults. 40% tax rate. 50% tax rate. 60% tax rate! will this never end? Must research code of laws.

        So far away, i must find another way...

        WORKERS! Ahah so simple it must work. all cities begin worker construction, must of had 20 of the little bastards after 10 turns or so, my first 5 cities were doin well but all these barb cities needed help bad, Uh ohhh a dark FOW spot just spawned another axemen, You build a settler! as if i needed another city.

        Cottages begin coming online, and slowly the tax rate can be dropped. 50%. 40%. CODE OF LAWS finally! all cities begin construction on those courthouses! Oh isnt that nifty. A new religion has spread to my land. Hmmm what to research next. Oh harbors are nice money makers.

        courthouses begin to come on line, 30% tax rate. now thats respectable. Alas i can build harbors, that should increase trade with... myself hmmm... I better meet somebody new fast, Japan absolutly refuses to open up his borders. optics. well that gives me a boat able to get me off this rock.

        My first Caravel is produced. now lets meet the world.

        "Tokagawa has declared war!" well is about time... Hey dont sink that! whew, It lived. catapults and crossbows make short work of that pesky japanese horde. In the mean time my caravels meet the russians, the persians, the indians etc... Hmmm I better make the most of this, lets get, I know alphabet, maybe i can trade code of laws for some techs i must be lacking. worse case i have to give them civil service to catch up.

        Alphabet comes, ok what do you have for me ghandi? Nothing? hmmm.. ok Cyrus. again nothing? Cathrine? nothing? what the?


        In my quest to make peace and sacrafice tech for land (wich would be quite nice for the UN victory) I actually still out teched the ai's just out of shear volume. all 21 cities combined at 50% or even 40% research still produced more beakers then all the other AI's could manage. I should have realized when i was killing tokagawa's swordsmen with my crossbows.

        The moral is, dont rule out expand expand expand...
        --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        The phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid, aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoatnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. Amzanig huh?...So with that said: if you can not read my post because of spelling, then who is really the stupid one?...

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        • #5
          true, but to do this is to, as gandalf put it, "walk along the edge of a very sharp sword" (or somethin like that) if you dont manage it right you'll become completely bogged down in maintenace that AI will shoot ahead of you and squelch you.

          just a counter-counter-point.

          p.s. i think i'll try an expand game, just to see what it's like.

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