Exact opposite of CS Slingshot

[LzPrst]

-Kataphraktoi
I tend to avoid the Financial Trait because I feel it is the trait with the least flavor and it gives too much of an advantage. Games are almost too easy with financial (on Prince where I play at least)

I also lately have been greatly revamping my strategy as I realized from a rather abnormal game that the Cottagespam is not necessarily the only way (though likely the overall best). Focusing on GP and eventually production through workshops\castesystem\guilds and so on gives a vast production allowing for more improvements (but you get less from each) and producing research and wealth as needed. Perhaps I should make a course for it...

[ZargonX]

Ok, I've almost got the course finalized.

Students will be playing as the Ethiopians in a race to expand! CRE/ORG traits should provide some good leverage in beating out your neighbors (some of whom are royal jerks ). A preview of the start location...

The full course should be up tomorrow afternoon.

[Arrian]

Heh. A "no CS Slingshot" course with marble available at the start.

-Arrian

[ZargonX]

Heh. A "no CS Slingshot" course with marble available at the start.

[PhotiTheMalfeas]

Ethiopia starts w/hunting and mining. UB is the stele, replaces monument, additionally gives +25% culture. UU is oromo warrior, replaces musketmen, starts w/Drill I&II.

Settling in place gives 3 grassland hills w/irrigatable wheat (5F1H). Fog gazing, looks like there might be a chance at a plains hill 2W of the settler. Alternatively, maybe those are some floodplains to the west of those hills. In any case, the hills to the NW will provide for a fine production center given the right food.

I think I will settle place, although i am also thinking about 1NE to get the marble in the BFC, as i thnk settling in place gets the marble on the 3rd border pop. Marble w/quarry on plains gives 1F3H2C), so better than a G. Hill, but settling 1NE of settler's current spot only guarantees the marble and one G. hill, which would suck for the capital's production. I will probably move my scout SEasterly to see what is revealed and then make that decision. getting the marble in the BFC frees up the 2nd city to grab a different spot.

I have not started w/hunting in a while, so I think i will build a scout first then a worker as the parameters of the game demand good knowledge of the surrounding terrain, plus a second scout still has a good chance at getting some goody huts. I will prob tech agriculture, bronze, the wheel, pottery, masonry. Cottage spam in the capital w/all those river tiles seems like a given.

Do we choose difficulty setting, or is that pre-determined? Also, what's the map-type? I may play a practice game today if i get a chance.

[Asmodeous]

Forgive my noobage. What is "cs slingshot"?

Me.

[PhotiTheMalfeas]

i take that back, 2W of the settler couldn't be a hill otherwise i think we could see it.

[PhotiTheMalfeas]

Originally posted by Asmodeous
Forgive my noobage. What is "cs slingshot"?

Me.

Using an ordered tech path and building the Oracle to obtain Civil Service, a relatively expensive tech, at a much earlier date than normal. This allows the Bureaucracy civic, giving a powerful advantage over your rivals.

[EPW]

I think I'll try this course out

[ZargonX]

The difficulty level is selectable. The map is a Pangaea, but the details can be discovered through play

[Arrian]

So, if one were to play this, is it against our house rules to even build the Oracle? Or is it just "no cs sling" ?

Because, I mean... marble. It's right there. Nice wonder. Pretty wonder...

-Arrian

[Asmodeous]

From what I'm getting the importance is not attacking other people's cities, which makes "CS slingshot" somewhat moot, because even if you DO slingshot to CS (now that I know what it means, hehehe) you can't use those fancy-dancy macemen you just got to take over enemy cities.

That's what I'm getting from it, anyway.

Me.

[PhotiTheMalfeas]

actually, the macemen at civil service is new to bts, iirc. what made this slingshot famous, and what spawned this thread to begin with, was that Oracled CS gave early bureaucracy which fueled a vertical growth strategy. the purpose of this course is to learn about horizontal growth strategy, which is characterized by aggressive REX, and so my *guess* is that oracle would be allowed, just not for CS. However, given that the parameters of this game do not allow for the taking of cities by brute force, chasing wonders in the early game will put a damper on the REX. and so that is the trade-off, early wonders mean fewer cities for the rest of the game. if you are to choose wonders and that choice is limited, is the oracle a good enough wonder at the expense of the other early marble wonders, like the parthanon, the ToA or the GLib? some of that question will depend on circumstances, if it is relatively easy to block off land grab competitors with culture, no open borders and few well placed cities, then the expansion can afford to slow down to get more of those wonders. also, if another city location can be found in the beginning that will produce settlers quickly, then the capital has more leeway to pursue wonder building, as early on the cap is usu the best producer all around.

[joncnunn]

I would guess if we are really to be doing the anti slingshot we shouldn't be starting to construct any wonder until we've finished building the last settler we are ever going to be building and should strictly rely on the creative traight for culture during the settler phase.

In a normal game, I'd probably be building all kinds of ancient Marble wonders in lieu of the settlers with Marble that close.

Originally posted by Arrian
So, if one were to play this, is it against our house rules to even build the Oracle? Or is it just "no cs sling" ?

Because, I mean... marble. It's right there. Nice wonder. Pretty wonder...

-Arrian

[Nyghtfyr]

Originally posted by PhotiTheMalfeas
actually, the macemen at civil service is new to bts, iirc. what made this slingshot famous, and what spawned this thread to begin with, was that Oracled CS gave early bureaucracy which fueled a vertical growth strategy. the purpose of this course is to learn about horizontal growth strategy, which is characterized by aggressive REX, and so my *guess* is that oracle would be allowed, just not for CS. However, given that the parameters of this game do not allow for the taking of cities by brute force, chasing wonders in the early game will put a damper on the REX. and so that is the trade-off, early wonders mean fewer cities for the rest of the game. if you are to choose wonders and that choice is limited, is the oracle a good enough wonder at the expense of the other early marble wonders, like the parthanon, the ToA or the GLib? some of that question will depend on circumstances, if it is relatively easy to block off land grab competitors with culture, no open borders and few well placed cities, then the expansion can afford to slow down to get more of those wonders. also, if another city location can be found in the beginning that will produce settlers quickly, then the capital has more leeway to pursue wonder building, as early on the cap is usu the best producer all around.

Macemen have always been available at CS, haven't they? I associate CS with them more than with Bureaucracy and Irrigation, and I just now acquired BtS...

Anyway, I love the Oracle strategy, although in the past I used it to get Metal Casting and chop up the Colossus if I had a good coastal city. If I'm in the interior, I can see CS being more valuable and I've clearly underutilized Bureaucracy, but how often does another civilization get the oracle first? It seems like somewhat of a gamble to stake your early strategy on getting Civil Service, but if you're all talking about it like an established strategy, it must work most of the time...