Very disappointed

[Andrew_RT]

I wonder if someone can send Sid Meier this video-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iMmvu9eMrg

it is the ultimate explanation on what religion is, basically it is institutionalized superstition and how the notion of god/magic sky fairy is ridiculous from logical, philosophical, ethical and scientific perspective.

Yet in Civ 4 there are quotes about god/magic sky fairy all the time, even from the Bible which is the dumbest book ever-

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/

The entire technology/civic/government tree is completely linear and historically based thus revealing the lack of basic understanding of anthropology, sociology and social psychology. It should have been broken down to basic elements, not randomly created historical notions-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oj9rDCrKSHw

And why do all units of all the races look exactly the same?!
This is the main flaw of the game, it invalidates any feeling of having your own unique civilization.

[ybrevo]

Andrew...

In a way I understand your frustrations about this game, but it IS a game based on known history, culture and religions. It is a GAME, not an issue of what is right and wrong concerning what has happened during the many years.

And when it comes to your choice of civilizations, you still have unique units that surely can make a difference when it comes to strategy. Fast workers or great war mongers - you have a good option there

ybrevo

[sorinache]

Andrew, other people may think differently than you about religion. Question your values : do you believe in, for instance, democracy ? The root credo of democracy is that the vote (and hence the opinion) of one person, rich or poor, smart or dumb, is worth exactly the same as that of another person. If you extend that thinking, you might come to realize that it is perfectly ok for other people to hold different beliefs than you do about religion. It is your choice to engage with them by, let's say, playing a game in which religion is portrayed in a way different than you'd do it, or to not engage with them by not playing the game.

Now on a more practical level, you might want to give a try to the Wolfshanze mod which changes the appearance of the units thus increasing the feeling that you have your own unique civ.

[Andrew_RT]

Andrew, other people may think differently than you about religion.

How is that relevant?
If this would be a part of school curriculum they wouldn't be-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iMmvu9eMrg

It's called education, and I expected that a mainstream game such as Civilization 4 is conformed to the goal of education.

And I never use mods in any game, either it is or it isn't.

[slnz]

And why do all units of all the races look exactly the same?!
This is the main flaw of the game, it invalidates any feeling of having your own unique civilization.

Have you actually played the game? Feel free to take a look at, for example, an Incan, a Japanese and a German swordsman and tell if they look alike. Obviously every civ does not have unique graphics as this would serve no real purpose and even hinder gameplay by obscuring the unit types.

As for the religion, as other people already said, this game is based on REAL WORLD HISTORY, not hypothetical theories. You can question the usefulness of religions and the existence of god, that is your opinion. However, you can't deny that religions have had immense influence on historical events throughout history, and thus excluding them from a game that simulates history would be stupid.

I also find it ironic that you claim that using real history as a basis for sociological notions is a bad idea. In my opinion world history is the largest sociological experiment ever done

[Felch]

It's called education, and I expected that a mainstream game such as Civilization 4 is conformed to the goal of education.

LOL wat?

[Andrew_RT]

Anyway, is this forum viewed by the people who made the game?

P.S.

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2009/07/every_religion_has_its_insane.php#comments

[Felch]

They come by and check things out, but I doubt they care that some hard-core atheist wants them to whitewash religion from human history.

I like how you're bothered by quotes from the Bible, but not from murderous dictators. Or is Ecclesiastes more offensive than Hitler?

Ecclesiastes by the way, is actually a pretty interesting book. If you gave it a chance, you might enjoy some of it. Orwell used the KJ translation as an example of clear and forceful writing in his essay Politics and the English Language.

[Murg]

How is that relevant?
If this would be a part of school curriculum they wouldn't be-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iMmvu9eMrg

It's called education, and I expected that a mainstream game such as Civilization 4 is conformed to the goal of education.

And I never use mods in any game, either it is or it isn't.

Civilization is a game based on history. Religion is a part of history so it is a fair part of the game. Despite your personal feelings about religion you must admit that religion does exist and has been a significant factor in the history of the human race.

Also note that Civilization doesn't model God, nor does it make any statement about the existence of God. It does imply that religion exists, which Im sure you would agree with.

If you would like Civilization to exclude elements that you find unappealing then wouldn't you rather see slavery or war removed?

Also to your point about why the units for various civs look alike. I tend to agree with you that it would be ideal if they did look differently. And I lead a project to produce a scenario for Beyond the Sword that made the unit art more unique (the scenario got canceled because Firaxis checked all our art into the main game). But there are two reasons why all the unit art isn't unique:

1. It takes a lot of time and effort to create all that art.
2. Its confusing for casual players to have 30 different variations of warriors, scouts, etc. The purpose of art is to model the gameplay elements in a way that makes them quickly understood, unit diversity conflicts with that.

Generally I think that value of unique unit art overrides point number 2. But point number 1. In a world with an unlimited budget and art resources I think Firaxis would make all the unit art unique for each civ.

ps. Play some mods, they are awesome

[Heraclitus]

And why do all units of all the races look exactly the same?!
This is the main flaw of the game, it invalidates any feeling of having your own unique civilization.

Dude what are you talking about... oh wait you are playing vanilla.

Well Civ4 BtS basically did what you asked for here.

[Felch]

He has BtS but can't patch it. That's his other thread.

[Heraclitus]

LOL wat?

+1

This is the same game series that had a frikking BLACK CLEOPATRA! They also made Alexander a blond.

(talking about Civilization Revolutions)

[Andrew_RT]

Also it is BCE(before common era), not BC
and it is CE(common era), not AD

No dumb pagan superstition stuff necessary...

[redstar1]

Also it is BCE(before common era), not BC
and it is CE(common era), not AD

No dumb pagan superstition stuff necessary...

Some people might suggest you are denying the historical basis for the dating system. At any rate, whichever way you want to date it (AD/CE) is correct.

I may agree with your beleifs but forcing them on others makes you no better than those you would seek to oppose.

Anyway, this is all irrelevant on a computer game forum. There are plenty of other places on the web you can argue Athiesm v Theism.

[redstar1]

No dumb pagan superstition stuff necessary...

Actually I do feel obliged to point out that 'Common Era' notation is probably a construct of non Christian religions and is in wide use within Judaism to name but one.

So use BCE by all means but don't be surprised when someone mistakes you for a religious fanatic