SP vs. MP

[jkp1187]

Originally posted by snoopy369


We prefer all humans, but if we can't get >4 humans we will throw in some AIs. 4 player or less is not fun unless it's very balanced in player ability, unfortunately.

Do you ever try handicapping the stronger players, making them play at a higher level, say?

[Krill]

How would you go about that without making the game contain more early warfare?

[Krill]

And more to the point if you are going to handicap good players, then what is the point in learning how to play the game in the first place?

[jkp1187]

Originally posted by Krill
And more to the point if you are going to handicap good players, then what is the point in learning how to play the game in the first place?

Same reason you do it in Golf. To make the game a challenge for people of all skill levels. I would gladly spot someone a few difficulty levels if I thought it would make the game interesting.

[Krill]

Get a bad start in MP and unless your nearest neighbours are totals retards, winning the game will be a challenge. Balance everything such as land, resources, traits etc and then you can balance difficulty for handicaps.

[jkp1187]

Originally posted by Krill
Get a bad start in MP and unless your nearest neighbours are totals retards, winning the game will be a challenge. Balance everything such as land, resources, traits etc and then you can balance difficulty for handicaps.

Sure, but I really hate playing on maps that force "balanced" start positions. Dealing with a bad start is part of the game, in my opinion.

[Vampgelus]

Originally posted by jkp1187


Sure, but I really hate playing on maps that force "balanced" start positions. Dealing with a bad start is part of the game, in my opinion.

I agree

A friend of mine is VERY selective about starting locations and we often regen several maps before we begin to play. Most of the time i'm simply taking what i have when he is satisfied, and i have always been lucky so far ^^.

(We play together with no other human players, so i don't mind regenerating maps several times. We mostly play on Monarch difficulty, without teaming from the beginning, but we cooperate all the game long against a bunch of AI).

[Krill]

Originally posted by jkp1187


Sure, but I really hate playing on maps that force "balanced" start positions. Dealing with a bad start is part of the game, in my opinion.

But a bad player doesn't know how to deal with bad land, so we'll just make the people who know how to deal with bad land play on a different difficulty...

double standards and inconsistancies

[jkp1187]

Originally posted by Krill


But a bad player doesn't know how to deal with bad land, so we'll just make the people who know how to deal with bad land play on a different difficulty...

double standards and inconsistancies

Sigh. How is that a "double standard" or inconsistent to suggest that players of different skill levels should play at different difficulty levels so that all can have a challenging game?

Sounds to me that you'd prefer to romp over noobs -- is that what you're saying?

[rah]

NO, i don't think so.
I just think he's saying that if the land and starts were more even, that handicapping would make more sense.

I don't know if I totally agree with that but I can understand it.

[Krill]

The simple version is what RAH said. You can't try to balance something if there is still a large random element to the game. It is one of the reasons why civilization is always going to be a very hard game to balance.

And question what sorts of games I play, by all means, but from what you're saying it sounds like you need help just to compete with a normal player.

[Aeson]

The difference is the S&M

[Ming]

While I'm a mid level player in the Friday/Saturday night IP games, I wouldn't want to handicap the better players. On a good night, if I get decent land and no real bad luck, I know I can compete. On other nights, I get rolled over... but either way, I continue to learn from the better players. And unless it's one of those games where you get knocked out before you can even build a warrior, I always enjoy them, win or lose.

The best way to learn MP is to keep playing. And if you lose, learn from your experiences. The trick it to enjoy playing... and I don't see how handicaping the better players is going to help their enjoyment of the game

[snoopy369]

Originally posted by Vampgelus


I agree

A friend of mine is VERY selective about starting locations and we often regen several maps before we begin to play. Most of the time i'm simply taking what i have when he is satisfied, and i have always been lucky so far ^^.

(We play together with no other human players, so i don't mind regenerating maps several times. We mostly play on Monarch difficulty, without teaming from the beginning, but we cooperate all the game long against a bunch of AI).

Good lord, i'd refuse to play with that person. Play with what you get or don't play in MP...

[Ming]

Half the fun of MP is dealing with those crappy starting positions and playing civs you might not normally play.

If I'm playing SP, I will usually regenerate a start if it's absolute crap. In MP, you don't get that choice. Some of my favorite games are makeing up for a terrible starting position.