Unable to win on noble

[TonyUK]

Have been playing vanilla version for at least 3 months continously, trying various strategies, leaders and tactics and start well but then sink down to the bottom of the points table. always try to build near rivers and coast near fish with cities not to far apart due to maintenance. no matter what I do I cannot come close to winning even by attempting to specialise. today tried investing in more workers but this had no affect as I thought I never use enough of these. Usually build around 4 cities ASAP and careful not to over expand.
Just noticed that other civs points go up a little at a time and mine mostly when I reasearch a tech or gain a wonder - why is this?

TheAI must be cheating to some extent. I recall trying BTS and starting out teching mysticism and someone got hold of polytheism before I even got mysticism - LOL.
This must be a cheat.

Started playing on a smaller map - but still cannot get any better result. I connect all my resources and cities soonest so I really dont know what else I can do. whenever I reach a point when results are a little better I get attacked by 2 civs. Grrrh - this game is the most frustrating I have ever played and I waste enormous amount of time despite reading walkthroughs/srategy guides!

Maybe I should stop playing and try SettlersVI when it comes out or go back to IL2 1946, blitzkreig,,HOI2 or AOE III!!!

[Indalecio]

Re: Unable to win on noble

Originally posted by TonyUK
Usually build around 4 cities ASAP and careful not to over expand.

I think that might be your problem. You're trying to keep the science slider at 100%, and so you're limiting your expansion.
This shouldn't be a goal, you should try to expand as much as possible.

[Swiss Pauli]

I suggest that you post up a start and then play until 1AD (on normal speed) and report your results. The community here is pretty generous with helpful advice (and low on flaming/mocking), so this should help you see where you're going wrong.

PS: ignore score. Demographics is the best place to check progress.

[TonyUK]

Indalecio

Usually the science level drops down to around 50% and I am lucky if this averages 70%. Maybe I should drop this before it auto drops.

What level do you suggest assuming I have drama and the culture slider too?

[Kinjiru]

As Swiss Pauli said, you need to see how other players would act in the same situation.

I would suggest you join the Tri-League tournament here. http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...hreadid=169815

You could join either the Novice or INtermediate game. Keep good notes of when you do things and why you are doing them. Then, after the game closes and people start talking about it, you can compare you're thinking with those of other players.

Some general tips:
Pay attention to which tiles are being worked in your cities. Your complaint about another civ reaching Poly before you finish mysticism is not due to cheating but due to judicious tile working. Remember that your science is driven by your commerce. With a size 3 city, say, allocating your worked tiles to favor commerce can have a several turn impact on research time.

The above point also carries over into your expansion. Favor food to grow your cities when you want them to grow, hammers if you need to warriors/archers/axemen, commerce the rest of hte time.

You are chopping/whipping right? This isn't required at Noble level, but it sure helps!

Don't neglect your military. Early on (if you are not being a warmonger) you want to be right in the middle of the military pile (check the Demographics screen, Soldiers line item).

Good luck!

[TonyUK]

Swiss Pauli

Sorry-dont know how to post a start! Tell me how.

[Indalecio]

When you post a reply to this thread, there should be 'Attach File' option below this box. Attach the save, which should be under...'My Documents/My Games/Single', I think, not sure.

[TonyUK]

Ok I know where saved file is but how do you replay the moves say to 1AD?

[Indalecio]

Just start a new game, and play till you reach 1AD. That should be enough.

[Swiss Pauli]

Post the starting file then make some notes as you play, and write a report on why you made the major calls - tech, cities, religion, and so forth. See the Apolyton University for tips on how to structure a report.

[Nugog]

Yes - save your 4000BC turn, then play up to about 1AD - save the game - and in two serperate posts attach the saves here - then people can take a look and offer advice.

[Arrian]

The AI has certain advantages, even at noble (vanilla CIV), but at noble they are very small.

I recall trying BTS and starting out teching mysticism and someone got hold of polytheism before I even got mysticism - LOL.
This must be a cheat.

Not really. What probably happened is that an AI civ that starts with Mysticism (say, for instance, Huyana Capac of the Inca) simply researched polytheism, and maybe had a nifty river start that provided a little extra commerce (or maybe even an oasis tile, which is a monster for a financial civ early in the game).

The best thing to do is to do as other suggest: post a start save, then play - taking some notes along the way. Save the game at several intervals (1000bc, 0AD, etc) and post those. Then people can comment specifically on what you're doing wrong (and right!).

-Arrian

[Nugog]

Re: Unable to win on noble

Originally posted by TonyUK
TheAI must be cheating to some extent. I recall trying BTS and starting out teching mysticism and someone got hold of polytheism before I even got mysticism - LOL.
This must be a cheat.

The AI does not cheat. However if the AI starts with mysticism, and a good commerce start (ie gems in radius, or has mysticism and fishing etc) then this is possible.

Started playing on a smaller map

To be honest - I find larger maps easier - and if you start via the custom game option - you can reduce the number of AI you are facing - which can make things easier.

Maybe I should stop playing

Please don't. Post your saves here - let us take a look - you will get some very good advice. To post a save use the "Post Reply" option - then at the bottom of the screen you will see an "Attach File" section. If you have any problems PM me and I will send you some screenshots etc.

I know I found the game very frustrating when I first started playing - but with some of the advice I was given from other 'Poly members - things got better!

Also - do not get hung up over what level you are playing on - maybe go down one level - get comfortable there - then move up one level - or turn Aggressive AI on - both options can change the game quite dramatically!

I would suggest you join the Tri-League tournament here.

A most excellent Suggestion!

[Ingot]

Helpful Hints for players that reach Plateau

First of all, the game is much more complex than a lot of players expect at first.
I am still learning it's complexity after playing for quite some time and after many
single and multiplayer games.

What I recommend to everyone that feels they have hit a plateau in their playing is:

A. Don't be afraid to completely scrap your current strategy or style of play.

B. Experiment with new tactics and suggestions that you hear or read about.

C. Play online with others and pay attention to what winners are doing.

D. As Leonard Nimoy put it, "Learn well what moves you forward AND what holds you back"


Here are a few points that you may benefit from and that might respark your interest in the game.

1. If your research is falling behind as you expand, be sure to compensate with more commerce

a) Build cottages early because they take time to mature.
b) Work improvements that allow your populations to grow and produce more.
c) Learn how to control the governor to keep control over your population and chosen city output.
d) Learn what keeps cities from growing and what makes them max out.


2. Be sure that you are working tiles appropriatly

a) Cottages are nice on floodplains.
b) Mines on multi-hammer hills.
c) Farms on plains with 1 food + 1 hammer + 1 coin.
(so you get a 2 food plot that can supply 1 pop point and also the hammer and coin with it)
d) Windmills on 1 food + 1 hammer hills.
(so you get a pop point from it also)
e) Your choices here can vary based on the available tiles but, be sure to use them all wisely.


3. Learn to use city specialization

a) A city with high hammers will make more troops, buildings and wonders.
b) A city with high coins will make more science and cash.
c) A city with higher food will make more population and Great People.


4. Use forest chopping to gain early production advantages

a) Instead of impeding city growth while making settlers or workers, chop them to get them done faster.
(you can maximize this further by not starting a non-growth unit until the chop is on it's last turn)
b) Chop important wonders.
c) Chop forests that give the enemy a strategic advantage.
(Defensive bonus next to your capitol or other places the enemy can occupy)


5. Be sure that you have enough workers working to ensure faster growth than the opponents


6. Place your cities strategically

a) Take advantage of available resources.
b) Don't over extend beyond your current commerce.
c) Be mindful of what your cultural borders may encompass while placing cities.
d) Sometimes blocking an opponent from expanding further with one of your cities can be a good strategy.


7. Citizens will stop working when cities reach a certain population if they are undefended

a) Be sure to keep at least one troop in each city if you want them to grow beyond
the maximum undefended population for the difficulty level.
b) You can increase city sizes with hereditary rule and more troops but, be sure
that you have enough health available for that extra happiness so that you are
not wasting commerce with unuseful troops.
c) Your army size is limited by your income so, be sure that you maximize your
commerce and pay attention to what your army does to your income.


8. Know your Civ and Leader and leverage their traits

a) Civs have set starting techs and, not all are the same.
(This may affect your initial goals)
b) Learn how each Leaders trait can be used to your benefit.


9. Your enemies will benefit from war

a) Warring early and often can control the growth of opponents and supplement your expansion.
(Taking mature cities far outweighs the efforts and time invested into developing one of your own)
b) Isolationists will rarely emerge into world powers.
c) Offense is most usually the best defense.
d) The enemy is NOT afraid of your hidden stack of troops that is eating up your research monies.
e) While you are sitting on your hands thinking you have enough land to win the game, your opponent
is conquering pre-developed lands or, He is getting ready to.


I hope this does what it was intended to for you and anyone else that reads it . Also, I hope to see you online sometime.

??

[TonyUK]

Great response chaps

I really thank you for all you helpful replies. Afraid to play on line as I really want to win against AI first, but will give it a try soon. Sometimes I put the City gov on auto and alter if necessary.

Cheers
Tony