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BtS - Good AI? Silly AI? Cheating AI? Frustrating AI!

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  • BtS - Good AI? Silly AI? Cheating AI? Frustrating AI!

    I have started a few games of BtS in the past two weeks, but I never get far beyond the middle ages because the way the AI plays kills all my fun by then, because I like to play mostly peaceful yet they know nothing but war, cheating and betrayal.

    First, the silly diplomacy. They constantly demand tribute from me even though I am superior to their puny little nations in every way imagineable. And when I deny it, they get mad at me! To top it off, when I do the same to them, they ALSO get mad at me because I made an unreasonable demand! Where is the logic? And in many cases I cannot even demand, all I get for options is 'Will you share this for a good friend'...
    So even though I really do nothing that should seriously upset them, everyone gets mad at me except for those few I can get to share my religion.

    Then, the frequent wars. Now I can understand it if Boudica declares war on me because shes totally lunatic and aggressive. But when I seriously smack her down afterwards, she just keeps on trying. Eventually others get the same ideas. And always against me. Even if there are three foreign nations between someone elses territory and mine, and all the nations inbetween are weaker than me, they still go after me.

    Then, the war does not seem to hurt the AI, yet it totally messes up me. I switch production to units and only units pretty much to stop the ridiculous AI stacks. There is no way to maintain infrastructure production. Yet the warring AI keeps on building wonders, overtakes me in research AND sends ever more units after me. How is that freaking possible without the AI completely and utterly cheating? It feels like for every shield I get, the AI gets two...
    Also, the AI spams cities like there is no tomorrow, something I always hated about ALL civ games. Does it not get the same penalties for number of cities the player gets? I tend to like to place my cities as efficiently as possible with no shared plots, but this seems to be infinitely inferior to placing cities as closely as possible, usually with 4 or more plots shared by two cities...

    And then what is usually the last straw for me, the few AIs that I have managed to keep friendly to also start going after me. I am not even leading the point race anymore (the first war against me usually puts the laughing third civ quite a way ahead while tossing me and the silly idiot who started the war down the drain), I have a very strong military, yet everyone always goes after me, not after much better targets. There is virtually no fighting among the AI civs unless it is a war inspired by me asking one of my allies to declare on a pissant attacker.

    And all this only on Prince difficulty, Standard or large sized Terran map and marathon speed.

    So am I missing something, or is the only way to play relatively peaceful to simply annihilate everone that attacks you or play on Archipelago maps?

    The former solution would put me way too far ahead of the other civs I am afraid (I lose interest in games where I am too far ahead as well), and Archipelagos usually don't offer a 'New World' to explore and settle later in the game...

    And yes I know about the 'Always peace' option, but I don't want no war, I just want less of it and for it to be slightly more logical.

  • #2
    Well, first off, you're playing on Prince, which means the AI gets a production bonus over you.

    Secondly- excessive amounts of units is a problem with the game. Playing on Marathon makes it worse.

    Thirdly- some AI's are insane and will attack someone no matter way- like your Ragnars, Isabellas, and Montys.

    Suggestion: play on Noble, and Epic or normal speed. THe speed change might be enough.

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    • #3
      I have been playing prince and the AI hasnt been behaving like that-infact after crushing a civ and leaving them with a few cities they stayed at peace the rest of the game. I find after eliminating their main stack they ussualy accept peace
      if you want to stop terrorism; stop participating in it

      ''Oh,Commissar,if we could put the potatoes in one pile,they would reach the foot of God''.But,replied the commissar,''This is the Soviet Union.There is no God''.''Thats all right'' said the worker,''There are no potatoes''

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      • #4
        Looks like you need to change your civ strategies, I find the BTS AI challenging, but actually less threatening on Monarch+ levels since some of their bonuses have been eliminated. On large continent games at Prince+ levels, expect the AI to build monster armies and navies in later era. So it's better for you to go after them than the other way around. I always play with the intention to dominate and to conquer.

        We won't know how to address your specific problems unless we see your save game.

        I would avoid Marathon games.

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        • #5
          I´ve now played several games with agressive A.I on Monarch difficulty and I´m generaly pleased with the A.I

          Sometimes the A.I is a little bit too over-optimistic when declaring war and sometimes A.I civs vote stupidly at Apostolic palace elections, but other than that I have not been able to detect any major flaws.
          Even with agressive A.I turned on, there is no constant warmongering.

          I also have not noticed any A.I city spamming, nor would that be a wise strategy, as that would ruin the A.I economy.
          GOWIEHOWIE! Uh...does that
          even mean anything?

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          • #6
            I've seen city spamming from many AI's, sometimes 14+ cities when I have 5-6, I got the hang of expanding at the rate the warlods AI expanded, but they expand much faster now.

            Using longer game speeds just encourages more wars.
            On epic, there are many occasions where I have nothing to build but more units, it's too long between techs, same for the AI.
            On Marathon, things are even worse.
            Also units in a way move faster due to everything else taking longer.
            Drop to Normal speed, I find it makes things more fun. You get stacks of enemies, but what I would call 'normal' size stacks (3-4 cats, 3 swordsmen, 2 axemen, 2 horsemen for example).

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            • #7
              I had an annoying little tad this morning.

              I just started a custom cont game and pulled in a teammate (still a n00b)

              I play on Noble I believe.
              I pick Japan
              I give him Japan
              We're on the same contin as Shaka and Wang.

              Shaka takes out Wang pretty early then it's just Shaka, Tok and myself. I start to get attacked by Shaka and my teammate doesn't come to my aid, he doesn't attack I never see his units leave his control borders.

              I was a bit curious at that.

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              • #8
                Well I really don't want to change game speed. I love the pace of marathon, even Epic is too fast for my taste and I especially hate how 2 years per turn kicks in so very late in epic. I would probably thoroughly hate normal, because the game would finish too fast and I would never get to use some specific advance for a seriously long time.

                I am trying a new game now where I try to match the AI city spam, build specialized smaller cities rather than large ones that do everything, keep one city dedicated to building only units, and spread my religion well early on.

                Maybe that helps. I guess if it does not I will have to scale the difficulty down, I though that Prince being in the middle meant that it would be the highest one without cheating AI, where it seems to actually be the lowest one with cheating AI.

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                • #9
                  Marathon
                  Huge Marathon

                  Faster speeds



                  --
                  @krait, for you to try to play peacefully is to be commended, but for you to expect to have no wars IS NOT! For you to expect the AI (in BtS) to play "fair" or "reasonable" is NOT! For you to expect the AI to try to mess with you, throw you off balance IS. Even at Noble difficulty.

                  Yes, the "no (or minimal, anyway) AI bonus" difficulty level is Noble. May be better to do well there first.
                  Last edited by Jaybe; August 20, 2007, 13:49.

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                  • #10
                    I'd check the power graph too. If the AI is making demands of you or declaring war, that probably means they think they have a military advantage (numerically anyway). And if they refuse your demands that's a sign too...

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jaybe
                      Marathon
                      Huge Marathon

                      Faster speeds
                      18 AI CIvs
                      Graffiti in a public toilet
                      Do not require skill or wit
                      Among the **** we all are poets
                      Among the poets we are ****.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Me Too

                        I had posted the other day as to how anyone wins. I have this issue as well. This game I decided to play on Warlord and I was so far ahead in tech - like military tradition to seeing no knights. The AI had so many cities and stacks of units. I took 2 cities and did a feint where I went for his capital and after he moved all his troops in I went to another city. I had 0 defense and cats to soften the AI plus cavs and some mace guys and low & behold I got creamed again. And within a short period of time all the other civs caught me and passed me in techs because my $ went way down and I had to go to 10%. Before BTS I used to win once in awhile...

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