Guns, Germs, and Steel

[Pinchak]

Not sure how many of you are familar with this book. It was a Pulitzer prize winner a few years back when I was inclined to read it for a college course.

I just recently rented the National Geographic movie adeptation of it from my local library.

AWESOME film. Many of the concepts they discuss run parallel to Civ game concepts.

If you are into Civ (and I would assume most of you are ), do yourselfs a favor and rent this film for yourself.

The book is good too, however the movie is better, (rare for the film adeptation to exceed the book it was based on, but it is the case here at least IMO).

[mkorin]

Pinchak,

I thought about buying the book, but as I remembered the back cover seemed to put a very liberal slant on history as opposed to a 'true' history or at least one slanted more to my liking. Other than that, it looked like a good book. Which brings me to my point. If can honestly say that my impression was incorrect, I may just go back and get the book.

BTW I now keep the Warlords soundtrack in my car just in case.

Thanks
Mike

[Pinchak]

very liberal slant on history

The main argument the book/film makes is that more than anything else, guns, germs, steel, and geography are what lead to white european global domination.

Being a scientist as opposed to a historian by trade, the author approches the subject from a very objective angle IMO.

As embarrassed as I am to say it today, back in my freshman year of college I wrote an essay on how history proved europeans genetic superiority to other races based on the whole "survival of the fittest" theme. Needless to say I was in over my head, but my logic was simple... Europe and the US have prospered while other parts of the world struggle. I aluded to facts such as Africa having a several thousand year head start as far as humans go, and dispite this they still live in squaller for the most part. I also pointed out that although all homo sapians share the same core genetic code, it is ludicrice to assume we are "all the same" on the inside just as it would be ludicrice to say a Boarder Collie has the same tempermant as a Pit Bull.

The very next semester, like a slap in the face, I had to read "Guns, Germs, and Steel" for another class. Now if ANYONE was going to be critical of the argument made in this book it would have been me during this time.

I could find no flaws in his assessment.

[mkorin]

I'll have to give it a shot. I see it in the cheapie bins at book stores now.


Mike

[Nikolai]

It's a great book. I began reading it last autumn. Unfortunately I got too much to do with school before I could finish it, so I lack the two last chapters, but I will come around to finishing it. It's incredibly interesting!

[MightyTiny]

It's a book that's been on my "to be read" list for years... just never got around to it, despite many people recommending it.

Got to remember to order that book, so that I'll finally get around to reading it.

[Pinchak]

Well, like i said in my first post... National Geographic has made a very good film adaptation if you don't have the time to read the book.

The actual author, Jarad Diamond, is the main actor/narriator. And since NGS filmed it, you know it's quality.

[Dominae]

Re: Guns, Germs, and Steel

Originally posted by Pinchak
Many of the concepts they discuss run parallel to Civ game concepts.

I read the book recently, and couldn't help but think about Civ4 the whole time. That early access to Food sources is a deciding factor in the success of a Civ is incredibly realistic! (According to the book at any rate.)

A shame he didn't cover rushes against poorly-defended neighbors...

[Dominae]

Jared Diamond.

[Brutus66]

Old news I am afraid.
I remember when I originally read this thread , I was turned on to Peter Watson's "Ideas: A History of Thought and Invention" , which to this day is one of my civilization-related favorites.

I may be only ranked "warlord", but I pay attention

[Pinchak]

Thanks for pointing that out.

Interesting to read peoples opinions on the work.

[Jonny]

I read it a couple of years back... good stuff, I recall.

[Kuciwalker]

Any parallels with Civ4 are almost certainly coincidence. Civ4's economic model is completely unrealistic. (This is a good thing.)

[Pinchak]

Any parallels with Civ4 are almost certainly coincidence.

The parallels exist for the simple fact that Civ4 is about the rise of civilization, and the book is about the rise of civilization... or more specificly, why some civilizations rose and others stagnented.

Some of the factors the author points to for the rise of great civilizations are; wheat, corn, rice, animal domestication (sheep, cattle, pigs and horses to be specific), grainarys, food surplus leading to specialization of labor, forges, writing... all emphisized aspects of Civ4.

It's just funny to hear the author say something like, "once they discovered pottery and built the first grainerys, their villages could grow to much larger sizes."

Or...

"A surplus of food ment that some of the labor force could now specialize, which lead to new discoverys."

Sometimes it sounds as if he is reading from the Civ4 instruction manual.

[Jaybe]

"A surplus of food ment that some of the labor force could now specialize, which lead to new discoverys."

Sure, but not until a library is built.

I find it staggering that even in the days of Caesar the city of Rome didn't have a public library. All of their libraries must have been private!