Slingshot in v208

[Akaoz]

What's the best, or at least, good build order/strategy, to perform a Civil Service Slingshot on Prince in v208?

Also, where can I find articles on opening strats for v208?

[Quillan]

I'm not certain the CS slingshot is possible on that difficulty level anymore, since they made Mathematics a prerequisite for Civil Service. The Oracle will almost certainly be built by someone before you can research all the techs needed. You might be able to get Math, use the Oracle on Code of Laws and then research CS, but I'd be shocked if you can research both of those prereq techs and still complete the oracle to get CS as a freebie.

[Akaoz]

I was afraid of that.

[Arrian]

I do it often on Prince v2.08. There is a higher chance of failure than pre-2.08, but I can still pull it off most of the time with a good start. Given a so-so start (particularly one with low commerce potential), the failure rate rises.

The AI doesn't seem to build the Oracle as fast as it used to. IIRC, pre-2.08 if I didn't get the Oracle done by 1000bc, I was screwed. Aside from the occasional fluke (AI starts with marble in cap radius), I can build it in ~800bc and be fine.

I'm addicted to it, but as to whether or not it's the smart play, well, that can be argued.

-Arrian

[rah]

I too have noticed that Oracle gets built a little later.

Quite a few times I've put a city to build it, just to get the money early to fuel supporting the 3rd and 4th city. And am surpirsed when I get it.

[Arrian]

Give me a river start with some food and I'll have a good shot at the CS-sling on Prince. Give me a floodplains river start and I've got a really good shot at it.

Financial civs have an advantage if you have a river start and can get some cottages up quickly - floodplains starts are great for that. Mansa Musa comes to mind...

Creative civs have an advantage too, b/c of the 1/2 cost library.

IND is obvious, though it's more about research speed than wonder-building speed. Still, with an IND civ you can devote some of those hammers to something else (library, another worker).

-Arrian

[DrSpike]

The change has certainly shifted the balance, and CS sling was overused before anyway. Basically the way to think of this is that Oracle is nearly always worth it if you can get it, but don't compromise your expansion just to make sure it yields CS if you do get it.

[Arrian]

That's a good way of looking at it. At least get CoL, though

-Arrian

[rah]

I find myself using oracle for Metal Working now. Especially in MP games where your army is a tad more criticial.

[Blake]

The only somewhat reliable way to CS Slingshot is by using a philo leader and getting a Great Scientist to lightbulb Mathematics. This is usually very doable because running scientists speeds up your research to Code of Laws.

The problem with this is by using a GS in such manner you forgo an early academy or lightbulbing Philosophy, not worth it IMO.

[kiky]

Philo Sling is easier to pull than CS sling on 2.08 and it is very good too.

Getting Philosophy early enable pacifism to get GreatPerson. also founding two religions is not bad too.

do search on Philo Slingshot for more infos.

[Common Sensei]

These days I usually use the Oracle for Theology, especially when warmongering, or Metal Casting if Industrious.

[joncnunn]

I agree 100% with Kiky; did so with good results in my last game even without Marble. Especally because my most productive city (and thus the one building the Oracle) was the first non-capital city and much larger than the other non-capital cities and so both Confucism and Taoism were founded there.

[Arrian]

Mmm, double-holy city Always tasty.

-Arrian

[Leifmk]

Originally posted by Quillan
I'm not certain the CS slingshot is possible on that difficulty level anymore, since they made Mathematics a prerequisite for Civil Service.

I've done it on Monarch after the 2.08 patch, but it does take a lot more luck now. On the upside, access to marble isn't as important anymore since you'll have to wait longer before completing the Oracle if you're set on the CS slingshot. I lean more toward using it for Metal Casting instead, that's a very nice tech for just about any kind of game.