Great Artefacts....

[molly bloom]

As I was idly thumbing through an encyclopaedia the other day (Larousse's something or other, I forget exactly), I suddenly thought why can't Civ 4 or an expansion pack have something similar to what happens in Alpha Centauri when if you take or invade someone else's city, you can make off with an Alien Artefact ?

As opposed to just stealing or acquiring knowledge or money say.

Because if you think about it, there are cities around the world boasting sculptures, scientific instruments, whole gateways, obelisks, religious icons, manuscripts and paintings looted from other civilizations and cultures.

And of course it's been going on for thousands of years, but there are notable instances such as the Venetian Republic's wholesale looting of Byzantium, Napoleon decorating his palaces with 'acquired' goodies, Viking raids on monasteries, Zheng He supposedly making off with Buddha's tooth, and the Sassanid Empire abducting the True Cross as a gift for the emperor's Nestorian Christian wife.


Such thefts could result in a loss of culture or religious cohesion or income or combinations of all of these.

Whaddya think ?


Some Byzantine swag in Venice :

[Snotty]

like a cultural vampit type effect?

[Nugog]

Good idea.

Game mechanics wise, how do you see it working?

So you invade the city, with the Great Artefacts, then how do you transport them to other cities?

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by nugog


Good idea.

Game mechanics wise, how do you see it working?

So you invade the city, with the Great Artefacts, then how do you transport them to other cities?

I'd imagine that like in Alpha Centauri, they're 'instantly' transported to your closest base.

It would make smash and grab raids (amphibious or overland) more tempting for neighbouring or piratically inclined Civs...


Some loot in the British Museum:

This brass plaque shows the Oba (ruler) of Benin surrounded by his attendants, two of whom are holding up their shields in a formal protective stance. Only the Oba was allowed to be shaded in this way within the city. There are over 900 of these plaques in various British museums, collected during the British Punitive Expedition in 1897

[Nugog]

Originally posted by molly bloom
It would make smash and grab raids (amphibious or overland) more tempting for neighbouring or piratically inclined Civs...

So it would not involve completely taking over the city? (Never played SMAC).

Would it not be more interesting to have to "transport" the artefact through hostile territory etc?

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by nugog


So it would not involve completely taking over the city? (Never played SMAC).

Would it not be more interesting to have to "transport" the artefact through hostile territory etc?

Yes, you can just invade a city in SMAC and grab an artefact.


But definitely I agree that transporting the stolen items might prove fun....


The Ishtar Gate:

[johnmcd]

yep, it would be cool.

It could be that when a building gets to the 2000 year old mark (or whatever it is that double's cultural production) or when a Great Artist produces a great work the city gains a great artefact. In the case of a library it might be that the library continues to produce 2 culture and the artefact starts to produce 2 culture.

To support that though I think you'd need to put in some sort of degrees of capture, razing, looting, taking. It might only be that on taking the city (and producing the lowest amounts of gold) that it's possible to capture artefacts.

It would be cool if later in the game goodie huts stopped giving you tech but started giving you artefacts instead.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by johnmcd
yep, it would be cool.

It could be that when a building gets to the 2000 year old mark (or whatever it is that double's cultural production) or when a Great Artist produces a great work the city gains a great artefact.

I like that idea.

Michaelangelo, the David in Florence or the Pieta in Rome.

Shakespeare's Folio's or Chaucer's 'The Canterbury Tales' in London, Heron of Alexandria's inventions or writings, Bihzad's miniatures in Herat, Adam Smith's 'The Wealth of Nations'....

...exciting. Just beware the Mongol hordes.

[Xorbon]

This sounds like a good idea. And it would add another purpose to going to war - without having to capture enemy cities. The fun part would be transporting the artifact(s) back out of the territory - and this would give the other side a chance to retrieve the object before you brought it back.

Once in your capital, you could have several options for what to do with the artifact: you could keep it for culture per turn in one of your cities; or sell/destroy it for gold, hammers, or science; etc. Artifacts from cities with more culture would be more valuable, or those cities could contain more artifacts.

Sounds like it would make an interesting mod!

[patcon]

I haven't gotten Warlords yet, but isn't this something like a part of the Vikings scenario?

[CarnalCanaan]

My ex upon hearing that I was visiting London for the first time: "Ooh! Go see the museums! Those Brits know how to steal some cool stuff!"



(And for the record, the Deutschies hold their own in the time-honored Eurotradition of antiquities plunderin'[see Ishtar Gate above].)

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by molly bloom
I'd imagine that like in Alpha Centauri, they're 'instantly' transported to your closest base.

In Alpha Centauri you need to move an alien artifact back to a base of yours. While you are doing that someone else could ambush your convoy and make away with the thing himself.

This is definitely a more fun way.

[Nugog]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
This is definitely a more fun way.

It also makes sense - how would a 500 ton stone gate, for example, instantly make it's way back to your cities?

You would need to plan the "extraction" quite carefully.