What's the weakest unit a tank can lose to in 1.61?

[Badtz Maru]

Before 1.61, a damaged tank unit could lose to any kind of unit, if it was in bad enough shape. Now the strength of a unit is an average of it's current strength and it's maximum strength, so a tank unit at 0.1 would still be unbeatable by most primitive units - so how strong would a unit have to be to defeat a tank unit on the verge of being destroyed?

I personally never had any realism objections to the way it was before - a tank unit reduced to that low of a strength would probably represent a tank division where nearly all the tanks are destroyed or disabled, and a few thousand archers could probably finish off a shattered tank division while they were awaiting reinforcements under certain circumstances.

[iapetus556]

Re: What's the weakest unit a tank can lose to in 1.61?

Originally posted by Badtz Maru
I personally never had any realism objections to the way it was before - a tank unit reduced to that low of a strength would probably represent a tank division where nearly all the tanks are destroyed or disabled, and a few thousand archers could probably finish off a shattered tank division while they were awaiting reinforcements under certain circumstances.

You might not even need that.

If the sole surviving tank was badly damaged, or almost out of ammunition, or the crew were wounded or exhausted, or a combination of all three, then a small but well-organised group of warriors might well be able to ambush the tank, and stab the crew through an opening, or drag them out and club them to death.

[Tokyo Sexwale]

What.....? People in tanks have firearms, how the heck would someone with a spear or sword get close enough to stab them?

[axisworks]

People in tanks have firearms, how the heck would someone with a spear or sword get close enough to stab them?

I love these debates.

[Badtz Maru]

Originally posted by Tokyo Sexwale
What.....? People in tanks have firearms, how the heck would someone with a spear or sword get close enough to stab them?

We're talking about a full-strength primitive unit - thousands of guys with spears/swords/bananas. The defenders will run out of bullets eventually. Also, the small arms carried by tank crews are usually not very long-range weapons, so hundreds of archers with terrain advantage could get close enough to rain arrows on the tank crews with little danger to themselves.

[Kuciwalker]

The answer is any unit with a non-zero strength.

[Badtz Maru]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
The answer is any unit with a non-zero strength.

That was the case before 1.61, but not anymore. If one side has a strength significantly higher than the other, there is a 100% chance of winning - I just don't know how close you'd have to be to have a chance of winning.

I can't remember what the strength is for the first tanks, but I remember that Modern Armor has a strength of 40. Before 1.61, a Modern Armor unit with it's strength reduced to 5 would probably lose to longbows, but since 1.61 that Modern Armor unit's effective strength would be the average of 5 and 40 - 22.5. The lowest possible strenght for modern armor would be a bit over 20. This would give a Modern Armor unit a 100% chance of winning against any pre-gunpowder unit, no matter how weakened it was.

[Blake]

You don't understand how combat works. There is no such thing as a 100% chance, ever.
Also, while a tank reduced to 0.02 still has 20 firepower, it only has 1 hitpoint so if it loses ANY combat round it will die.

[Solver]

The weakest unit a tank can lose to is indeed a Scout, of strength 1. Theoretically. Odds are odds. Yes, a tank in 1.61 will have, even if very badly damaged, winning odds over 99.9%. But still...

There's no 100% chance in the game. But obviously the interface won't show 99.999% chance, it just shows 100%.

[Prussia]

And THAT'S REALISM for you.

There is never a 100% chance you will win a battle, EVER.

What if all of the tank drivers were stoned, and thought the trees were impending enemies? All you'd have were a bunch of victorious guys with clubs, a few dead soldiers and blown up tanks, and a whole lot of dead trees.

SAVE THE ENVIROMENT!

[Dauphin]

I thought they deliberately did round the apparent 100% to an actual 100%.

I ask the question, has anyone here lost a battle where the odds stated were 100%, but clearly weren't?

[Dis]

I lost to a tank to a war elephant the other day.

I'm still pissed about that.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Dauphin
I thought they deliberately did round the apparent 100% to an actual 100%.

I ask the question, has anyone here lost a battle where the odds stated were 100%, but clearly weren't?

I've never had 100% odds. You guys might be playing a difficulty level too low for you.

[Solver]

Difficulty levels only affect odds vs. Barbarians. And 100% odds happen all the time to me, when I'm finishing off badly wounded enemy units. Such as I attack an Archer in the field with a Horse Archer, get unlucky and lose, with the AI Archer down to 0.1 health. Then my next unit displays as 100% odds.

[Dis]

what I meant was you guys are facing such weak AI units, that means you are way far ahead of them in tech, and thus playing a difficulty level too high for you.

I find the AI is much better at upgrading units in Civ4 than in past incarnations, and I rarely face weak units. So I have never seen 100% odds.