Caravel: no room for settlers

[HaplessHorde]

Anybody have an idea why a caravel can't carry a settler? Or better yet, know where to tweak the xml to change that restriction? It seems senseless to me, unless it breaks gameplay in some way that I can't conceive.

[stevesk]

I am against caravel not being able to carry settlers. If galleys are able (at least I THINK they are, correct me if I'm wrong), why wouldn't caravels be? I don't like changing the game .xml files, maybe it could be a suggestion for some patch.

[HaplessHorde]

Yeah, galleys can carry settlers. If the Polynesians could found a new settlement using a boat made out of grass, I should be able to do it using any wooden hulled ship.

I agree about tweaking the code, seems like cheating, but I wanted to see if I could do it (so far haven't found the right place to change it,) to see how it affected gameplay.

What time is it where you are?

[stevesk]

I'm in GMT -3 which means 23:15min now :P . Going bed soon. Not immediately, but soon.

[Rook]

I understand the "Why" civilization's caravels can't carry settlers, I just don't like the implimentation. The game is set to prevent expansion too fast. If they don't do it this way, then the entire world will be colonized very quickly. I prefer Civ III's method of having Coast, Sea and Ocean tiles with ships having percentages of being lost.

[stevesk]

Well, historically, America was colonized with caravel-like ships. And just with the maintance costs of far-away cities, I don't think that early colonization would be a problem.

[Urban Ranger]

Yeah, I don't like that either. There are all sorts of troubles putting a lone settler on a distant land somewhere over there. Not having a garrison is a big problem, esp. with raging barbarians.

[johnmcd]

America wasn't really colonised using caravels, it was discovered, but until much larger ships were used the colonies were only a few hundred strong and generally one bad summer or winter away from being wiped out (see: Thanksgiving).

[Ijuin]

I think that the inability to send a garrison along with the settlers is enough to balance the benefit of being able to send them in a Caraval--you basically are expanding at your own risk and have to bite your nails for the several turns it takes to found a city and build a Longbowman in it.

[Overcast32]

Well - you could always send out a couple Caravels with some extra units - even a scout will work as basic city defense to start - and you could ferry a worker as well to speed that process greatly.

Still - I agree that it would be a good thing for the Caravels to be able to carry settlers. I can't think of any reason for it - other than game mechanics.

Of course - one could always say that the 'settler' unit is actually a number of people needed to found a city and that the Caravel isn't a large enough ship to transport them all.

I'd suspect - if Caravels could carry settlers, you would see the AI expand a bit quicker, however.

[Solver]

The idea is to be unable to colonize overseas until Astronomy.

[amicus curiae]

Agreed. I like the fact that oversees colonization is impossible before astronomy. I like the late colonization especially on terra maps.

[Gherald]

I think caravels would be fine the way they are if there was an option that would:

1) Allow galley ocean travel.
2) Ocean trading with optics.

This would be particularly nice for multiplayer games.

[Yosho]

Well, it's good that it's possible to have missionaries/scouts/explorers/great merchants explore most of the world long before it's possible to really plant large colonies a great distance from your homeland do so in large numbers (Think Marco Polo, for example.) The ships are pretty much just abstractions for how that works.

The only thing I regret is that there's no way to beeline for a real navy earlier, though some kind of extreme research effort.

[Gherald]

Originally posted by Yosho
Well, it's good that it's possible to have missionaries/scouts/explorers/great merchants explore most of the world long before it's possible to really plant large colonies a great distance from your homeland do so in large numbers (Think Marco Polo, for example.) The ships are pretty much just abstractions for how that works.

They are, and it's fine, but a standardized, built-in game OPTION (not mod) for earlier maritime contact/trade/colonization/war would be really nice.

The only thing I regret is that there's no way to beeline for a real navy earlier, though some kind of extreme research effort.

Well there is Liberalism -> Astronomy which may be useful if you've built up a force of knights. Hmm... I gotta try this with Isabella sometime.