'Nationhood' needs an upgrade

[Strategist83]

That was precisely one of my suggestions, Marvin.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Yosho
Yeah, if you could draft forever with no population loss, a civ with 3 cities using nationhood could produce more units then a civ with 15 cities without it, with no real long-term cost. It'd be totally, absurdly, insanely overpowered.

Not true. Each draft increases unhappiness. The draft could continue only for a short period before unhappiness made it impossible to continue.

[Gherald]

Originally posted by Ned
Not true. Each draft increases unhappiness. The draft could continue only for a short period before unhappiness made it impossible to continue.

No, it could easily be true. One could have Globe, and it's possible to create a city with an extra +10 happiness. This is important because AFAIK nationhood unhappiness goes away after 10 turns like slavery, and you can only draft 1 unit per turn per city anyway.

Of course, those parameters could be made more stringent, but it'd still be a ridiculously overpowered civic w/o pop loss.

[marvinkosh]

Here's another suggestion, don't know if it's any good but it's along the lines of Partisans. How about having Nationhood prime your Civ against pillaging, so that units (especially pillagers) sometimes take damage from people defending the land using booby traps and whatnot. Plus the longer Nationhood is switched on, the more profound the effect becomes. It's not going to save your Civ from someone bent on wiping you from the face of the planet, but it will make war a more ugly prospect for the aggressor.

In addition the time (in turns) that your cities resist the enemy should be increased, to reflect the unwillingness of your people to submit to another nation's will. Of course this assumes that your city was mostly your nationality to begin with.

[Ned]

Actually, Nationhood just saved my ass. I had to boost culture to 40% to deal with the unhappiness, but survived the surprise attack by Julius Caesar.

[Harrier UK]

Originally posted by Strategist83
So, does anybody use nationhood in the long term? This is what I was initially going at: Making nationhood a viable long-term civic solution rather than a 'wartime only' civic.

What is wrong about it being a short term 'wartime only' civic?

Or is that to close to real life for you?

As others have already said - If you are not prepared for war (to weak militarely) and are attacked (as you well be) - then the nationhood civic can help keep you in the game, assuming you can select it.

Choosing a civic and sticking to it - come what may. Seems a bad idea to me, so why should a given civic need to work long term?

[Ned]

In this same game where I was attacked by Herr Caesar, I checked the civics of my neighbors when I got spies. Most of my neighbors were running Nationhood even though they were not at war. It might be they were taking advantage of the happiness that comes from Barracks.

[Son of David]

On the subject of civics, I'm always baffled that free speech and bureaucracy are considered mututally exclusive.

Or maybe Firaxis are making a political point.

[Strategist83]

Well, well, well! Looks like the patch just gave Nationhood the upgrade I asked for!

[Gherald]

And not just any upgrade, but the one I suggested!