Getting left behind on Prince. Suggestions?

[axisworks]

I'm in a bit of a dilemma. I play games on noble and I end up being the player with the highest score, biggest military, and most advanced and cultural civ in the game by the time I hit the classical age. I've only lost a noble game once, and it was because I thought I turned Space Race victory off (but I didn't) and an AI beat me to it because I wasn't paying attention to that.

Then I try playing a game on prince using the most efficient tactics I know of, and not only am I almost always the last player score-wise, but also regarding military and techs. As a result, one or two AIs inevitably end up declaring war on me because of my weak state and I'm powerless to stop them.

I generally start out my games chopping for settlers, pyramids, archers, workers, and axemen while trying to grab territory that's both strategic and rich with resources. Any tips would be much appreciated.

[make]

Hi axisworks,

The things you mention should work fine. Perhaps try not to build the Pyramids or any other wonder until you have won a game without.

Vel have written a basic guide here about how you can win the game on Monarch. I dont think I can give any better advide than him, so I recommend reading it.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=144755&perpage=30&pagenumber=4

[Fallenhero]

As make said read Vel's guide.

I found it helped to stick with one civ (Qin in my case) and work the early game over and over. When things bogged down for whatever reason I would start another game and try again.

To each his own, but the more familiar I am with a situation the better I can see my mistakes and improve on them.

[Son of David]

You need to basically just be a warmonger. For me, at least, that's the only way to win at Prince (although it works every time splendidly).

Try and prune at least one neighbour in each age - an early war started sometime in the BCs, then a medieval war with catapults, macemen, knights and pikemen; a 'Napoelon-era' style war with cavalry, riflemen and cannons. By modern age you should have knocked out enough opponents to be so far ahead that you can pick off remaining opponents with stacks of marines loaded into transports.

[axisworks]

I had an interesting experience last night. The computer (for whatever reason) placed my capital so close to Khan's capital that our fat crosses were almost overlapping. If that wasn't asking for war enough, instead of expanding his empire out the other direction (where there was plenty of un-settled space), he started trying to build cities as close as possible to mine, inside the middle of my own territory. He ended up declaring war on me four times, and this forced me to quickly throw together a formidable military. After capturing a couple of his cities, I was quickly going up the ranks on techs and game score. I still lost the victory to one of the AI's though damned space race.

[MadDjinn]

fastest way to slow down a Space Race victory...

Nukes

[axisworks]

I would've done that, but I hadn't reached fission yet, AND the AI that won was my friendliest ally.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by axisworks
I had an interesting experience last night. The computer (for whatever reason) placed my capital so close to Khan's capital that our fat crosses were almost overlapping.

In that case you should have tried an ultra early rush.

[Vinnnch]

I have the same problem as axisworks, ruling everything on Noble, and getting slashed every time on Prince...

I also tried to be warmongering (last game I destroyed spanisj and greeks before 0 AD), but with the 3 cities I had won by war, plus the 2 I had to create early to get resources, I had to set my science rate down to 10% then 20% for a long long long long long long while, thus falling too far behind to recover...
It's really really hard to apply in the games strats I see on the forums...

[axisworks]

Things are doing a bit better, now. I played a Noble game recently where I got up to #3 in the scoring. I thought it was a bit ridiculous, though, as by that point in the game I had about half of the landmass of the world, tons of wonders, the UN, and the largest army. I've found you just have to be ultra-brutal and always be prepared for large wars. Formulating early ally-blocs is a must, as is chopping for settlers and archers at the beginning of the game. The early years are the most difficult, by far.

[PaganPaulwhisky]

Originally posted by fallenhero
I found it helped to stick with one civ (Qin in my case) and work the early game over and over. When things bogged down for whatever reason I would start another game and try again.

I also think this approach will really improve your game. This is what I am currently doing with the Romans and Japaneese on emperor and I am making much better progress. This method also allows you to try many different strategies and tech paths without hashing through the entire game.

For a good start on Prince, I would focus really heavily on commerce in the early game. Get pottery as early as possible and set those cottages down ahead of the AI. Make sure to force your pop to work them and you will be cranking out discoveries ahead of the AI on prince level. Trade COL for anything you didn't get along the way.

Make sure to secure a source of bronze early (I would go for bronze first and then pottery) and start pumping axemen to capture nearby cities. The AI is helpless against this tactic on prince and lower. I suggest trying with Cyrus on Prince. He is really fun to play as you can chop like crazy with expansive and quickly get granaries for pop rushing an impressive army. Creative makes it very easy to secure resources and stifle your nearby neighbors. Cyrus has my favorite trait combo in the early/midgame and can become a superpower on Prince in no time. If you are struggling with early wars give him a try.

[MadDjinn]

Don't forget to build the super-science city (capital is best)...

if you're falling behind early in science, it's likely that you need to devote a city or 2 to just research.

I found that getting a library+Great Library+ National Epic (and fill all Scientist slots) generates a massive number of GS points. especially if you reinvest them into the city. and happen past CS.

though, I'd suggest a second city/acadamy+extras after getting 4 GS's in your capital. while the GS points mount faster when all in one city, the acadamies 50% bonus goes further in another city that also generates lots of coin.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by axisworks
Things are doing a bit better, now. I played a Noble game recently where I got up to #3 in the scoring. I thought it was a bit ridiculous, though, as by that point in the game I had about half of the landmass of the world, tons of wonders, the UN, and the largest army.

Sometimes having a big army doesn't help, because it costs you. How were you doing tech wise?

Originally posted by axisworks
I've found you just have to be ultra-brutal and always be prepared for large wars. Formulating early ally-blocs is a must, as is chopping for settlers and archers at the beginning of the game. The early years are the most difficult, by far.

Prince is not that hard. Depending on my starting city, I am usually able to grab all the early wonders (I usually play Qin, who's industrious). Though the one I really need is the Pyramids, followed by the Oracle for the CS Slingshot. The Colossus, etc. are nice to have but it won't kill me if I don't get them.

[Cadarn]

Playing as Lizzie:

A sound strategy is to neglect farms early and slap down villages on every flood plain and grassland in sight.....you can usually find enough food resources to keep cities growing up to the early (BC) pop caps. This brings in enough money to keep you up in research whilst funding enough units to keep the barbs at bay.

Most importantly, it funds early game city building in great spots.

I've found on Prince and now Monarch that running at 80 or 70% science early in order to pay for more, good location cities pays off hugely in the mid game when they mature. Still running at 70% science at this stage is plenty.

Early chopping for settlers is essential, but I'm sure you have that covered

Good luck.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Cadarn
A sound strategy is to neglect farms early and slap down villages on every flood plain and grassland in sight.....you can usually find enough food resources to keep cities growing up to the early (BC) pop caps.

I am not sure that's a good idea, as ripping up cottages for other improvements is tough. I rather go with things such as fishing villages + harbour and CoL (courthouses).

Founding a religion, building the shrine and spread it to as many cities as you can afford also gives you lots of $$$, esp after you build market, grocer, bank, and Wall Street there.

On this level it is still not difficult to get a grip with your expenses.