This game is HARSH at monarch level!

[Son of David]

After having a lot of fun playing at the 'Prince' level, I thought I would try and make my game a bit more competitive - by going up to Monarch.


Wow-eee! The AI has its empires on full-throttle in about half the time it takes me to build 3 or 4 cities! Settlers, scouts, warriors - all ripped to pieces by the barbarian archers that are in abundance by 1000BC. The AI has stacks of units in its cities before I've even managed to build half a dozen offensive units.

All wonders etc built before I get a chance to even think about planning to build one.

All religions founded long before I can get there.

Unhappiness takes away what little productivity I have ....


Well - this isn't Prince level, I can tell you that.

[alva]

Try a archipellago map ( or one with a lot of sea), they tend to be a little easier.

[Datajack Franit]

monarch isn't easy, but using the right tactics can help you a lot


- no barbarians. it may sound like cheating but remember that the AI itself has about 70% more strenght against barbs, and the time you waste building warriors and archer in the early stages of the game can be used for building settlers and workers, leaving your cities completely unprotected. of course this requires good diplomatic skills until you can afford building walls and archers


-no tech trading. the AI has an easy time already, there's no way to catch them once they reach the middle ages and start trading 20 turns technologies between themselves, while keeping you out of the market because they don't like you


-religion is the key. founding a religion is IMPORTANT, as long as it is important to prevent your opponents from spreading their religions worldwide. you cannot afford your worst enemy to found a religion, found a shrine, and get +1 gold from every converted city, plus +1 gold for every temple, cathedral, monastery worldwide. if they found 2 religions or more, you're out. your advantage on the AI is knowing how religion can be important to your game, so if you're planning a war, always aim to their holy cities. if your enemy is too strong to keep their holy cities at the long term, then raze them. always adopt theocracy, as you cannot afford giving the AI the advantage of getting gold and having a "spy" in every city of yours. for getting your own religions, try beelining at the start of the game theocracy (hinduism) monotheism (judaism) then get every tech required before theology (christianity) so you can eventually use your great person to automatically discover it for free, or you can research it using the oracle, if you can get it.


-wonders. at monarch level, the AI focuses on wonders and has some advantages. go for the wonders the AI either doesn't really care about, or just needs lots of time to complete: parthenon, pyramids, sistine chapel, colossus are the easiest to get, by my personal experience. of course you won't have a single tree left on your land, but automated workers (which you will put when you will get tired of managing them) will eventually chop them down anyway during the modern ages.

[Diadem]

beelining for theology is a very good way to die on monarch.

Religions aren't all good. They give a nice bonus, and can really help with relations, as well as income from the Shrine. But ....

First of all, time spent on researching religions is time not spent on researching other useful techs. If you beeline for religions you'll lack techs like archiculture, the wheel, mining, animal husbandry, bronzeworking, etc. All important techs to have. If you build massive missionaries to spread the word (which you have to do if you want your neighbours to have your religion) that means you'll have less military, less buildings, less workers / settlers...

I'm not saying religions aren't worth it. But like everything in this game, it's not a simple matter of them always being the best choice. It depends on your civilization, your starting position (which resources you have near), even on what neighbours you have.

Isabella for example always founds buddism and is a real zealot. If you're next to her, either spread your religion faster than her (which is hard), adopt her religion, or prepare for war.


And anyway. Beelining for theology ... That simply won't work on monarch. You'll be so far behind with other important techs...

[Datajack Franit]

you're supposed to have already bronze working, agriculture and animal husbandry BEFORE going for Theology- either from research or from goody huts- that's what I meant. you can't beeline without the basic terraforming tech- irrigation, pasture, mines and tree cutting are your working tools, so you begin the beelining AFTER you get all of these, hoping some goody huts help you out

[mgdpublic]

It seems odd that with so many difficulty levels it's necessary to have such a huge jump in difficulty from Prince to Monarch.
Anyone have a good way of making Prince a bit tougher but still fun?

[Datajack Franit]

the funny thing is that I never won a civ4 game until I jumped to monarch (from noble, then prince)

[oxmonsta]

If you start on the coast, especially if you have access to clams / fish / crabs, then fishing is a great tech to get as early as possible. Working those sea tiles gives you lots of early commerce, which can then give you an early lead in science. If you then get sailing and build lighthouses in your cities you will get 2 food from each sea tile, so as your cities grow you can work more of them without stifling your cities' growth. Then building the Colossus will give you even more commerce from sea tiles. All of which can be really useful in getting the relgious techs ahead of the AI civs.

In monarch I usually research fishing first (if I don't start with it), place most or all of my cities' population to work sea tiles, then research Mysticism then Polytheism to get Hinduism. Monotheism (for Judaism) is the backup plan if I don't get Hinduism. I usually play Archipelago with Snaky Continents maps which does tend to help.

[Mujadaddy]

I played a Duel Pangaea with 9 AI's on IMMORTAL... I lasted seven turns

[Falconne]

Originally posted by Datajack Franit
you're supposed to have already bronze working, agriculture and animal husbandry BEFORE going for Theology- either from research or from goody huts- that's what I meant. you can't beeline without the basic terraforming tech- irrigation, pasture, mines and tree cutting are your working tools, so you begin the beelining AFTER you get all of these, hoping some goody huts help you out

On Monarch though, by the time you research those base techs, AI's would have founded the early religions already (at least, with 18 civs in the game they certainly will - maybe with less civs there might be a chance).

If you choose a Civ that starts with Mysticism and go for Meditation, there is a small chance of getting there before the AI (and you get to build monastaries, so you won't have to spend any more early research on Theology).

[Datajack Franit]

well, having 7 to 10 opponents in the game, competing against you for religion and great wonders makes it still possible. actually it depends on you playing style, if you do like me, you build a settler as first unit of the game, then, either another settler or a worker. by the time you set your first worker on the queue, that's the time to begin research on terraforming tech. after 15-20 turns, when the worker is ready, so is your basic terraforming tech, let it be agriculture or bronze working, while wheel, mining (which the Germans get for free anyway) and animal husbandry can wait a lot more.

By the time you found your second city, you should be somewhere around 10 turns away from polytheism, so a good tech+citybuild path would be

capital starts settler (I was strongly against this but it's the best thing I ever switched to)
research mysticism
discover mysticism
research polytheism
discover polytheism
capital produces a settler, production switches to worker/settler #2

then

-if you go for a worker, then be sure to have agriculture/animal husbandry/bronze working ready in those 15-20 turns needed

-if you go for another settler, skip those techs and research masonry, then monotheism, found city #2 and set it to produce a worker

[Son of David]

Excellent suggestions! Yes, it seems really important to have a plan when considering what technologies to research.

I'm addicted to small pangaea maps because I love no-fuss warmongering but on monarch that means usually no more than three cities before you have to start conquering. And it's hard to conquer when there's only three cities to pump units out with!

So yes - small pangaea monarch maps are probably too hard for me.

[playshogi]

Try using low sea level, and start the game with 1 fewer AI than normal for that size map. You have more room to expand that way and you can keep barbs in the game. I like conquering their cities because it saves me from making a settler. Try to build the oracle and finish it when you have both writing and priesthood. Taking Code of Laws founds Confucianism for you.

[xxFlukexx]

Barbarian archers at 1000 B.C. ? Man, you are lucky, I see Axemen barbarians by then at Monarch.

Just FYI, you don't have to turn on/off all these weird settings to win at Monarch. I am finally done with Monarch(won 5+ games in a row) and played several different styles and start-ups and I use pangaea/balanced and everything on. You can't turtle in and out-boom the AIs to space age in Monarch and above anymore, you have to go out and start conquerin', that's the key.

Oh yeah, try doing a worker first, then chop forests to pump out 1-2 settlers quickly.