Interview with head of quality assurance at Firaxis

[Fistandantilus]

Originally posted by Tiberius
On the other hand, I find it sad that people who complain about the quality of a product are attacked for this very simple fact.

Sure. And then again we have this kind of posts:

Originally posted by andy_ktoi
I see people talking about that they'd be first to buy civ 5 when it comes out. That kind of idiocy is why the customer gets screwed over in the first place.

And I think that since:
1) The game works just fine on my system, never had a ctd at all
2) I'm having a lot of fun with it

I'm entitled to have my humbly opinion that my 39€ have been a very good investiment without being called an idiot or a fanboy. I just had a different experience with the game and I like it, accept this single fact as I accept the fact that there is someone who do not like the game.

[Capt Dizle]

Well, if Fist likes the game that carries a lot of weight with me. I'm still in the wait and buy later group though.

[Xerxes712]

I just want my ENGLISH Tech poster mailed to me!! How long does it take??

I am the lucky ones who go the French version, I can't read it. I will not pre-order again.

Though on the other hand, I do not have the technical running bugs others experience. Just some slow down on huge maps, and the annoying "stop stutter" of the Wonder movies playing in game.

ATI Radeon 9600 pro 128 VRAM (the real thing not Sapphire), P4 2.8, IDE slow hard drive, basic SB512 pci card. I GIG DDRAM, 800 MHZ ASUS P4P800 Deluxe motherboard.

Just the basics.

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
People have legitimate gripes, and that's fine. It's the unfair ones that deserve to be challenged vigorously.

Why?

Put a movie instead of a game and reread your sentence. If people trash some movie - do they deserve to be challenged vigorously? Why?

[hexagonian]

Most of the people I have talked to privately about civ4 say there are many performance issues with the game. Slow (especially on large maps and later in the game)...stuttering intro and wonder movies...the need to quit the game and relaunch to clear the memory... These are all problems that do leave a bad taste to the casual gamer, and even for me.

And yes, my specs are well above the minimum - and I updated my drivers.

I did expect better, given the time the game has been in developmet. And to be perfectly blunt, I do feel that civ4 is the buggiest game I have played. Other recent 3-d games that I played, such as RTW and CotN did not have the performance issues listed above for me. That surprised me a lot.

As for gameplay elements that are within the civ4 world, I do like them a lot. It's too bad that in it's current state, game performance overshadows the gameplay.

I do hold out hope - and believe - that Firaxis will deal with the issues listed above in a patch. How they handle it will determine my interest in future Firaxis products though.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by VetLegion
Why?

Put a movie instead of a game and reread your sentence. If people trash some movie - do they deserve to be challenged vigorously? Why?

Uh, sure. If people are spreading inaccurate and unfair criticism of anything, they deserve to be challenged. What a dumb question.

[VetLegion]

What about inaccurate and unfair praise?

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by VetLegion
What about inaccurate and unfair praise?

Indeed. But "The game works fine for me" is certainly unchallengeable. "The game doesn't work" is very much challeangeable. Since nobody is saying "The game works for everybody," it seems the bulk of inaccurate info isn't coming from the praise crowds.

[andy_ktoi]

Originally posted by hexagonian
And to be perfectly blunt, I do feel that civ4 is the buggiest game I have played.

No No No! that award simply HAS to goto Take Two's "Hidden & Dangerous". Another damn good game. if only it worked. Civ 4 currently stands in that sector for me.

PS The bugs experienced by many in H&D killed H&D 2's sales, regardless of the time they spent on testing 2nd time round. I still see copies on the shelves for around a tenner.

Is this the future for firaxis? conisigned to the bargain bin "if only it worked" club?

Let's hope the patch works.

[Addled Platypus]

Originally posted by VetLegion
Dale, were you a beta tester?

page 219 Civ4 Manual

[Zinegata]

... Okay, I'm probably going to get shot for doing this, but I have to say this out loud.

Civilization seems to be spiralling down the path of Battlecruiser 3000 A.D. -_-

For those who do not know, Battlecruiser 3000 is a legendary piece of software, though not in a good way. The game, when released (incidentally, by Take 2), was unplayable. It literally would not install out of the box, and those lucky enough to get it installed often found it wouldn't run anyway. It took five years and dozens of patches to make it playable. Even then, the final product wasn't exactly that sterling. At best, it was mediocre.

Worse, the said game had a small, but vocal community of absolutely rabid fans. Whenever anyone would complain about something perfectly reasonable (i.e. "the game won't even install"), they would get flames saying they were stupid. This was not helped by the fact that the game's infamous developer, Derek Smart, took the lead in flaming anyone who dared complain about his game - whether they were reasonable complaints or not.

Now, I've always thought that Civilization was different, and I've even defended beta-testers vigorously from what I felt were unfair accusations. However, I'm sad to say I'm truly beginning to see the same hints of developer/publisher irresponsibility, and the same hints of community arrogance, that have made Battlecruiser the most notorious piece of PC gaming software in history.

Civilization is an honored name in the PC gaming community. It should not be associated with the words "it won't even run after installing it" or "it has features that don't work".

It deserves better QA than what it's getting right now. And it deserves a fan base willing to protect Civilization, the game, and not Firaxis/Take Two, the company. Defending the developer/publisher is not the same as defending Civilization. In fact, defending them for doing something flat-out wrong, such as intentionally releasing a game known to have an unacceptably high number of bugs, is a disservice to the game that we know and love that is Civilization.

Loyalty is more than just accepting something despite its faults.

[myros]

Originally posted by Dale
KittenOFChaos:
Similarly, computer games work perfectly well "in testing conditions". It's when the hit the imperfect PC's, and random user usage that they start to show their problems. This cannot be tested for by Firaxis, or T2, or whoever.

Dale

Not exactly true, there are companies that specilize in beta testing, using 100s of different machines. Its an expensive process no doubt ... there is a difference between not being able to fully test and not having the will to. IMO companies have gotten used to the fact that the general public will tolerate bugs and that the product will sell anyway with the 'sell now, patch later' outlook. If this was to change and the public flat out refused to buy any software until after it is fully tested and the bugs resolved the publishers would change their marketing habits in a hurry.

Instead they lure in a few 'fan boys' to exploit them by getting them to do the work for free, and as the saying goes ...you get what you pay for A few fans (no matter how dedicated) cannot hope to provide a full and complete beta-testing enviroment. With the amount of people who couldnt even install the game initialy this was painfuly proven.

Myros

[VetLegion]

Which series have a traditionally good record with regards to patches (few issues, few patches but long support)? Age Of Empires?

[LordShiva]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Indeed. But "The game works fine for me" is certainly unchallengeable. "The game doesn't work" is very much challeangeable. Since nobody is saying "The game works for everybody," it seems the bulk of inaccurate info isn't coming from the praise crowds.

I find "OMG THIS GAME SUCKZ ITS THE WORST" being challenged alot more and than "OMG THIS GAME IS AWEZOME ITS THE BEST."

[soulfire777]

I bought Black and White 2 the day it was released, and I still can't play it because of some video glitch they have known about since the day it shipped. It's not even a RARE problem.

I also can't return it for anything other than the same game because it was opened. Duh how would I know it wouldn't work if I didn't open it?

I've been out $50 for weeks for a game I can't even play with no recourse whatsoever except hoping SOMEDAY MAYBE they'll fix it.

Talk about sucking ass... =(