Is marble completely indispensable?

[Kriegsspieler]

Hi --
I have been playing this game for a couple of weeks now on "prince" level, and I have come to the tentative conclusion that if you can't locate marble close enough to where you would put your first 3 cities, then you might as well close up shop and start over. The early wonders are so useful and so good for generating great people that I always want to try to get the oracle and the parthenon, at the very least.

I have always been someone who prefers building stuff over finding the nearest neighbor to attack, so perhaps my biases make me think this way, but I wonder wherther other players have found this also to be the case. So is marble really indispensable?

[Martinus]

First wonders are neither indispensable nor only buildable with marble.

[Kriegsspieler]

Well, of course they don't require marble, but you chances of completing them are much better with it!
But I'm more interested in gethering opinios regarding how essential those early wonders are. It sounds like you are a skeptic.

[-Ab-]

trees are THE resource in the begining
other stuff is nice but not required
what i have found from playing on monarch is that you will basic get no easily acessable resources to start with unless your very lucky
If i had to choose one resource that you simply cant live without i would say horses
tho i never seem to get em anyway

[quinalla]

Sure, the early wonders are good, but if you can't get them you can always get a later wonder, build up your cities to generate GP other ways if that is important, take a city with a wonder you want by force, etc.

Also, if you plan your tech trees out to go for your favorite wonder tech fast and make sure to have a nicely producing city, you will probably get the wonder first with or without marble/stone.

As for how important early wonders are I have played many games where I didn't even try for any of the early ones because of expansion or war or other things being more important first.

[Kriegsspieler]

Interesting reactions here -- thanks!
But let me push my point just a little bit further. It's not just the earliest wonders that are made easier with marble, it's also a number of "second-generation" wonders such as the Sistine Chapel, too. So if I play on the largest standard map and have about 8 AI opponents, as I commonly do, then it isn't all that common to have substantial contact with other civs before I have 5 or 6 cities. Before then, I want to have some wonders of my own built.

From the responses posted by you folks, it sounds like in your opinion wonders don't necessarily drive this game as much as they did Civ3 or Civ2. And therefore the resources that make them easier aren't such a major consideration.

[aeturneus]

I think that's right; the wonders are nice but they are not essential, assuming you can find other things to spend your hammers on. To some extent, though, the difficulty I seem to have getting marble or stone makes the industrial trait a bit less attractive to me; why go for a wonder building trait when you may or may not be able to leverage it with resources? Financial seems better, at least if you're determined to play out whatever starts you get. It's still not as bad as being roman and lacking, say, iron

[Freddz]

Marble is very potent indeed... almost too potent. I would consider it a sure win on Prince (without any saving of course) if I played industrious trait and got a patch of marble near my starting location

[Andrew1999]

To me the indispensable resources are Iron and Coal, just because they are the prereqs for so many different things. In my last two games I haven't had access to Horses (which I'm currently regretting.)

[kittenOFchaos]

Give me stone over marble anyday of the week.

[Volstag]

I just finished my last game w/o ever having access to marble, and I didn't get stone until late in the game. Basically, you can win w/o 'em. If you're a wonder builder at heart, they're definitely handy.

[-Ab-]

To me the indispensable resources are Iron and Coal, just because they are the prereqs for so many different things. In my last two games I haven't had access to Horses (which I'm currently regretting.)

i dont think i have yet played a game where i didnt have access to iron and coal altho i seen a few where i had no oil

thing about horses is that horse archers are basicly early game tanks,its no wonder the game with holds them
add to that knights and cavlry....horses are a must have

[yin26]

Resources would have no strategic meaning in the game if you always started with access to all of them. They are there to fight / trade over. In fact, not having a key resource for your playing style should give you fantastic pause for re-evaluating your situation and trying another path to victory.

[Stuie]

Originally posted by Andrew1999
To me the indispensable resources are Iron and Coal, just because they are the prereqs for so many different things. In my last two games I haven't had access to Horses (which I'm currently regretting.)

A little oil doesn't hurt either.

[LordShiva]

Originally posted by Stuie


A little oil doesn't hurt either.

Snacks are good in moderation, too.