Most Effective Use of a Great Artist

[Hayden]

Hello everyone, be nice, Im new here.

Wondering what you guys think the best use of a great artist would be. Should I create a great specialist, get the 6000 culture points, or discover a tech, or alternative wait until I can start a golden age. Has anyone done the stats to work out which option comes out on top in the long run?

[OzzyKP]

Depends on your circumstances, like everything else in the game.

They give 4,000 culture points not 6,000 btw. And I believe as a specialist they give 12 culture a turn. So if you wanted to purely calculate that, then after 334 turns the great specialist gives more culture than the great work. But generally the great work is used in smaller cities not in your core to try and flip some borders in your favor.

But yea, all depends on where you're at.

[Aeson]

The best use for any GP will be largely dependant on the situation. Each option provides value that the other options can't, so choose the option that fits your plans the best.

[DaveMcW]

The best use is to save the artist. The culture bomb is a great weapon that shouldn't be wasted.

When you get into a war, use the culture bomb on a captured city.

If you don't get into a war all game, use the artist to bring your 3rd city up to 50k culture. Or start a golden age to help finish the spaceship.

[Aeson]

The culture from a Great Work scales by game speed. It's not always 4k.

Culture from a settled Great Artist is affected by cultural modifiers in the city. Free Speech (+100%), Cathedrals (+50% each), and the Hermitage (+100%) can increase the cultural per turn value of settling several times over. Plus they do give gold per turn on top of that. On normal, the maximum output per turn of a settled Great Artist is 78c 9g. (7xCathedral, Hermitage, Free Speech, Market, Grocer, Bank, Wall Street)

[Hayden]

Ok so if Im playing on an islands map like I am at the moment then Im probably better off settling the guy, since I dont have any shared cultural boundaries in which to 'bomb'

And yeah, I only play on Epic mode so its 6000 culture points, which begs another question, how exactly does 'epic' make the game last longer. Obviously it makes it harder to get cultural victories since you need 75000 in 3 cities but how else do they make the game more 'epic'

[Sarxis]

I think it increases costs by 50%. Double check unit, tech, culture rates and costs. (worker costs 60 production normally, but 90 on epic, etc.)

[Bhruic]

Originally posted by Aeson
On normal, the maximum output per turn of a settled Great Artist is 78c 9g. (7xCathedral, Hermitage, Free Speech, Market, Grocer, Bank, Wall Street)

Well, yes, if you can manage to hit absolute ideal conditions, then settling him is the way to go. However, it's highly unlikely that you're going to see that in real world conditions. I rarely find that I can make up the culture difference in 200 turns, let alone anything less. So if I want the culture, I always go with 'the bomb'.

On the other hand, I've started to go with tech for them instead (unless I have a good use for 'the bomb'). They'll usually save me about 5-6 turns of research in mid-game, which means I get the tech faster, which gives me a better chance to trade, etc, etc. Seems to snowball nicely.

Bh

[Aeson]

5xCathedral + Hermitage + Free Speech is almost a given if you want to try for it on most difficulty levels. It may or may not be worth trying for given what your goal in the game is, but the option is there. So while the 7x extreme isn't too likely at higher difficulty levels it's pretty easy to be able to have your settled Great Artists at 50cpt or greater by Liberalism/Nationalism if you're focused on it. At that rate, it's still only 80 turns to pay off the 4000, plus the gpt coming in to boot. So for most of the game the question is whether to go with less culture, but up-front, vs more culture, but over the course of the game.

As for tech or settling if you have no plans to use the Great Work or cultural aspirations, it's much the same dynamic. Early in the game, settling can give more commerce over the course of the game than using it for a tech, but you have to wait for it. Having the beakers up-front is an advantage. Having more overall commerce is an advantage. Which is most important is situational.

Saving for the GA is always a good option too.

[Jcg316]

Settling early Great Artists can be worth it, the logistical benefits later are still useful but it will be a smaller total culture gain. In singleplayer as long as you get the Great Artists you need you should be fine, regardless of how you use them. At least that you use them for culture though, I suppose.

The first times I tried focusing on a culture vic I didn't use cathedrals or culture rate, wasn't thereby limited in other facets (from the rate, not the cathedrals), and wound up mid-1900s. Not that cathedrals aren't good but they aren't always necessary especially in city 3 and somewhat in city 2. Going out of your way to get more religions and nine cities for it can be a pain on certain maps. An average of one or two cathedrals per city can get you enough turns in front of other victory types, more is just icing on the cake. Trying to get before the 1700s and the first rival getting off a spaceship in the 1900s you could have been better served with more military "in case" and getting enough culture 100 turns later still having a large buffer over other civs.

Plus with enough spies you could just go to 100% commerce rate and blow up spaceships, then when someone looks like they are near winning fire off the Great Artists and have the victory be all the sweeter. Plus the losses more bitter, but that depends how you feel about your opponents.

Going for a culture victory won't limit your hammer production much, especially outside of the specific culture cities. As it will be a certain small portion, in the long run, you can certainly be doing other things as well, trying to conquer your neighbors for example.

With representation scientists can be really, really good settled. Especially with an academy in that city. Far more beakers over the course of the game instead of picking up some 500 beaker tech early and not getting the several hundred more allowed even used.

Prophets are good in the right numbers, generally matching shrine numbers, and surplus often just winding up being used for GAs. Not that instant techs are bad either. Avoiding the techs than picking up monotheism in the middle of the game would be kinda useless though.

Merchants are good for a lot. Settled they will provide a lot of gold over a game plus add a food. Getting a giant lump sum up front is great as well. Sometimes they'll be good to fire off for a GA with a extra prophet as well, though Artists in a non-culture vic might be much better to use that way.

[Dominae]

Road and tile denial.