Quick question on UN victories...

[mattcj]

When the secretary general proposes a vote for victory condition (as I read in Sullla's walkthrough since I don't yet have the game myself), why would the not-nominated voters do anything but abstain? They are attempting to win the game aren't they... so why not abstain and force a nominated player to win with only his votes. In Sullla's walkthough, only 1 of the 3 AI civs abstained... am I just missing something here?

[Ansaga]

People don't realize Civ4 AI isn't really there to 'win'. They are there to survive. The AI sees themselves surviving beyond the 'whatever win' or past 2050 time line.

Let us use a example from real life. Let us assume that China, USA, all of Europe, and Russia became one nation. When the UN vote comes about the new combined nation wins the secretary general. Then the next one the secretary general calls up a vote for world victory. Brazil stands up and says no. The new superpower nation isn't happy about that and decides to blow up Brazil into little piecies. The other countries learn their lesson and says yes and they survive to see another day. Or atleast that is how I see it.

+ Diplomatic victory would be REALLY hard otherwise.

[Martinus]

That's why it is called a diplomatic victory - you need to get enough other Civilizations like you enough to vote for you - otherwise it wouldn't be much different from a domination victory, since all you would need is a large population.

Incidentally, it's not that the AI always votes for the player and the diplomatic victory is a peace of cake. I have been in several games when the AI banded and voted for the strongest opponent candidate, even though I built the UN, effectively causing me to lose the game.

[mattcj]

Uggg... sounds like I'll probably be turning that victory condition off again... just like Civ III.

[]LoL[Harm]

I have yet to have the AI win enough votes to get elected. On the other hand I've never won enough votes to win the game under that victory condition either, it isn't quite as easy as it was in CivIII. At least so far as I've experienced.

[Pachabel]

I love the UN aspect. You can be elcted once, not garner enough votes for victory, come up for election again and lose. I've had this happen twice.

Usually someone wins space race though before enough votes for a victory are collected. At least in my games.

[Mayfield]

It will never work.. the AI will never vote you in as it is not in their interest to lose, and the only way to do it would be to completely dominate the map anyway. This victory condition is only useful for the AI.. again.. *sigh*

*Maybe* it would work if you are a dominant Civ and have brow beat two other Civ's into submission, and their survival depends on your good graces.

[Pachabel]

It will work based on how friendly the AI is toward you. The votes are based on the relationship points.

[quinalla]

I have yet to win a dimplomatic victory, but the 2 times I have built the UN I was always elected secretary general every time it came up and got tons of resolutions passed. And both games I had me and another civ who was my buddy voting for me for diplomatic victory and one civ voting against. It is possible to win, it is just difficult to get your relations high enough sometimes so they will vote for you.

[Azuarc]

Every game I have won so far was a diplomatic victory. On the road to space race or cultural, I happened to get Mass Media, and built the U.N. myself before anyone else did. In the course of things, I say "Eh, what the heck" and call the vote, and I either win and the game is over, or nobody wins and the game goes on until I try it again 30 turns later. Took me a few tries one time - literally the turn before I would have finished the spaceship - but I have not won a game through other means as yet.