Something I don't like about diplomacy...

[TheDarkside]

The diplomacy is vastly improved from previous Civ titles but there's something that bothers me to no end...

You can become best friends with an AI civ ('Friendly' status) and the AI might sometimes come asking you for a free tech. Ok I guess, it's no big deal to help out a friend... then WAIT A MINUTE! He's got some techs that he REFUSES to even consider trading to you! This happens quite often too... Why would the AI even consider asking you for a free tech when he has techs you don't have yet and won't even consider trading? So much for being friends

Also it's too bad that it seems like no matter how good friends you become it's extremely rare- as in, I have yet to have the AI agree in my games- for the AI to give you something for free, as a favor.

AI asks me for a free tech, ok buddy no problem. The AI asks me to stop trading with someone... Hmm, alright I guess I can do that as another favor. AI asks me to declare war on someone- ok that's pushing it a bit but since we're such good friends...

Then it comes time you want help from the AI... Technologies in the red, trade embargo costs you $$$, and declaring war? Oh you better mortgage off your Palace to pay for that one!

The concept of friends seems to be lost here

[LzPrst]

i've experienced some leaders that return the favors. mansa musa on the other hand never does... might be dependent on leaders.

[Shr3dZ]

Hehehe good point - I like having a really good friend I can count on.... count on to take my techs and make me go to war... basically it costs the player heavily for "friendship" and cost the AI nothing

[vmxa1]

Got my vote, I feel the same way. Either have the AI up and call me and give me something once in a while, or stop it asking me for things as a friend.

I am fine with them asking as a not friend as I see that as demand. I can refuse that request.

[kseecs16]

I frequently tell my friends to shove it when they ask for too much - it only gives a -1 and they stilll like me.

[pauli]

this is why i play with humans - it's us vs the world, and we can ignore the ludicrous diplomacy ai.

[Ninot]

i've frequently gone to very friendly allies, asked politely for tech, and gotten it.

[spy14]

Originally posted by Ninot
i've frequently gone to very friendly allies, asked politely for tech, and gotten it.

As long as the AI is generally friendly, I dont worry too much about having it in my pocket. I would however if the old Civ2 permanent strategic alliance was brought back.

[Traelin]

Hrm this doesn't bother me too much, because we as humans automatically have an advantage over the AI. But what DOES bother me is the frequency with which they ask for stuff. It's almost as if the game is trying TOO hard to establish blocs, because if you say no enough times, eventually certain leaders are going to be ticked off.

Oh and the other annoying thing...if you declare war on an AI, it's -3 points. But if they turn around and declare war on you, it doesn't neutralize the -3 that you previously racked up. That seems kinda stupid, that you can never make up for past transgressions.

[Ninot]

Originally posted by Traelin

Oh and the other annoying thing...if you declare war on an AI, it's -3 points. But if they turn around and declare war on you, it doesn't neutralize the -3 that you previously racked up. That seems kinda stupid, that you can never make up for past transgressions.

Uhm.... that seems pretty realistic.

[duodecimal]

If the AI will trade some techs to you and not others, mouse over those techs and see if they grant the ability to build Wonders. As has been noted, the AI will not trade any tech that will let another nation beat it to a wonder.

[kolpo]

Originally posted by spy14


As long as the AI is generally friendly, I dont worry too much about having it in my pocket. I would however if the old Civ2 permanent strategic alliance was brought back.

There is a permant alliance option in custom game. I'm currently playing with it and it works like this:

If you had a joint war with another civilization(both against same enemy) for some time or if you had a defensive pact for some time, might they agree to form a permanent alliance(only when they like you I think).

Permanent alliances can only be created after the discovery of either facism or communism.

Permanent allies get complete line of sign(you can even see there city screens), share technologies(if both research same technology is research shared), share resources, share wonders, share war/peace with third parties and most important share victory.

Permanent alliances are very fun and are really permanent

[pauli]

so, permanent alliances just adds them to your team?

[spy14]

Originally posted by pauli
so, permanent alliances just adds them to your team?

Partially, you can't control their units nor tell them what to do, but from what Kolpo is saying, many benefits. A big improvement on Civ3, which through most of its life removed them completely (I think they returned with Conquests).