The Romans--Civ 4 on Easy Mode?

[jdog2050]

Hey all, 1st post.

Is it just me, or is the Praetorian unit insane? I mean, it has 8 power at a time when every other unit is 2-6, and it can stay relevant even in the gunpowder age. I found that as long as some initial damage was done, a group of praetorians could take down a grenadier.

[Arrian]

There are many UUs that are designed to be pretty powerful in their era/category. I think there are one or more counters to any given unit, though.

Keep in mind you are on easy mode (chieftan?).

-Arrian

[jdog2050]

lol, no, the difficulty setting was left in normal (noble?).

It was just that there didn't seem to be a counter to the praetorian. Axeman? effective on melee, but still had 2 less power. Crossbowmen? Nope.

I was just steamrolling the other civs last night, it was kind of sad.

[Arrian]

Oh, I misread, sorry. I get it now. Romans on noble = easy mode.

Hrm. Praetorians are strength 8, right? Axemen are actually str 5, IIRC (Swordsmen are 6).

It would seem to me that Axes/Swords fortified in cities ought to be able to hold back Praetorians. Of course, that would leave you free to pillage. But pillaging isn't steamrolling, really. I assume you mean you were taking down cities left and right?

-Arrian

[Martinus]

Plus axemen are +50% against melee units, are they not? So it's 7.5 vs. 8 of preatorians. That's some advantage, but not that much.

[Arrian]

Don't Praetorians also have the bonus, resulting in a cancelling out of the effect? They have some bonuses, anyway... don't have the manual here at work

-Arrian

[Tuberski]

This is where unit experience makes a difference.

An Axeman agains a Praetorian is basically at an 8 to 7.5 disadvantage. A level 2 axeman withincreased strength is at an 8.25 to 8 advantage.

ACK!

[Solver]

Axemen counter Prateorians pretty well. Crossbowmen do that even better. Praetorians are expensive, and it's not a good idea to rely on them exclusively.

[Tuberski]

Originally posted by Arrian
Don't Praetorians also have the bonus, resulting in a cancelling out of the effect? They have some bonuses, anyway... don't have the manual here at work

-Arrian

Not according to the manual. However if they do have it then the abilities don't cancel each other:

Axeman 7.5 Strength

Praetorian 12 Strength.

ACK!

[Fried-Psitalon]

The Praetorian is an iron-based unit that has 8 str standard. It has no other bonuses.

The Axeman is a copper OR iron-based unit that has 7.5 str meeting it in open field, and is cheaper, and comes from an earlier tech.

The Crossbow is a copper or iron based unit that has 9 str when meeting Praetorians, and has a first strike. The unit is more expensive and comes one tech later.

An archer behind city walls has 6 str, comes several techs earlier, and is noticeably cheaper. Put it on a hill, and it has 8 str.

The Praetorian is a powerful unit, but by no means broken.

- You must have iron.
- You must have the industrial capacity to build more than one or two.
- You must have the initial finances to support war (which Rome's traits don't help with until later in the game.)

The first Longbow, Crossbow, or War Elephant you meet signals the end of the Praetorian dominance, and none are all that far after Iron Working. To dominate with the Praetorian, you need to beeline to the tech, which is a gamble - if you end up without iron, you're really up the creek. If you want to wait until you can enjoy lots of promotions by using Vassalage or Theocracy, you're pushing their usefulness even further into the danger zone of more advanced units.

Sounds like an interesting choice.

(Side note- The Praetorian makes one VERY effective defender for awhile, though, when you stick one behind walls...eeek!)

[Arrian]

I'd go with the manual, then, and it's 7.5 vs. 8. My knowledge of the game is still pretty limited. What extra abilities do the Praetorians have other than the +2 strength over swords?

edit: Ah, Fried knows more than I.

-Arrian

[hotcoffeedude]

Elephants. I was pretty much giving the AI the old "roll over" with my Praetorians (on Noble) until I ran up against his elephants. I couldn't even hold towns against them (of course I'd made the mistake of promoting them as city raiders 2-3 across his empire, which hurt my defense points).

It didn't end well...

[Tuberski]

Praetorian are simply beefed up swordsmen accordling to the manual, so they have +10% attacking cities if I am reading correctly.

ACK!

[Arrian]

That sounds good (not for you, of course, but in general)!

-Arrian

[Arrian]

Originally posted by Tuberski
Praetorian are simply beefed up swordsmen accordling to the manual, so they have +10% attacking cities if I am reading correctly.

ACK!

Ah, so Axemen should fair pretty well against them. I imagine the problem, if any, is that the AI doesn't build enough Axemen. Then again, I got into an early war a couple games back and Napolean hit me with several axemen (early).

-Arrian