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[Mod] NORMAL game pace: SLOWER TECH but more normal unit building! (Other fixes too)

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  • Ghen:
    WOW! I've tried diplo many times but never managed it- even with non aggressive AI's.

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    • Thanks for a great mod; I love it.

      You asked for some feedback from an "epic"-mode player:

      Epic Mode

      Technology seems to be gained too quickly, still. I'm playing a "huge" game, and have only nine cities (my opponents have 12+). I am gaining technology every 5-8 turns, which results in a the usual quick-obsolescence of units.

      I wonder if it might be worthwhile extending the time taken to gain technology in epic mode? Is there an easy way that I could do it myself? Having every technology taking twice as long as it does currently would be great.


      Toodles,

      Penfold

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      • Dearmad, have you tried this utility?

        EDIT 2007/07/27 Reworked the tool (v1.1) to work with all official Civilization 4 expansions (Warlords, Beyond the Sword) and mods. You should still note that the tool defaults to the original Civilization IV Civ4TechInfos.xml file when launched from the main program folder. Navigate manually...


        It allows you to multiply the tech cost for every era, haven´t tried it yet but it might be useful.
        The Party seeks power entirely for its own sake. We are not interested in the good of others; we are interested solely in power. Not wealth or luxury or long life or happiness: only power, pure power.

        Join Eventis, the land of spam and unspeakable horrors!

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        • i've now tried a game on prince, standard map size, normal speed, inland ocean, high water, aggressive AI with dearmads mod.

          havent gotten too far, I'm in the mid classical era and I'm having a blast. I have built lots of soldiers, and they're draining my economy, but I also have great potential for my cities so its only a matter of time before I can crank up the science rate again. My neighbours have been expanding rather aggressively, but it doesnt matter since all my cities are on flood plains... well most anyway. I feel like ancient egypt. except I'm playing greece...

          long rant short. the mod dearmad made has made the game far better IMO. I'll post again later on when I get further down the line, but so far the early and classical eras have been great. not too long to be boring and not too short to be stunned by techprogress.

          great work dm
          Diplogamer formerly known as LzPrst

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          • This mod is EXCELLENT!
            One thing. Have you updated the "Sid's Tips" for technologies? Alphabet still says you get the ability to trade resources, for example.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by DavidClifton
              Thanks for a great mod; I love it.

              You asked for some feedback from an "epic"-mode player:

              Epic Mode

              Technology seems to be gained too quickly, still. I'm playing a "huge" game, and have only nine cities (my opponents have 12+). I am gaining technology every 5-8 turns, which results in a the usual quick-obsolescence of units.

              I wonder if it might be worthwhile extending the time taken to gain technology in epic mode? Is there an easy way that I could do it myself? Having every technology taking twice as long as it does currently would be great.


              Toodles,

              Penfold
              I tottaly agree. Either that or slightly extend game time even more...

              Comment


              • I played this mod and I like it. But upping the max xp from animals and barbarians to at least the double would be nice (5->10 and 10->20).

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                • Definatly gonna check this out. I just have to find a way to blend this into my changes to the game.

                  Only gripe I do have is the Cav to tanks. I liked that cav upgraded to gunships. Especially since it gave variety since basically modern era combat was mostly tanks and mech inf. With everything basically upgrading to mech inf in that era ( or SAMs) there is too much armor IMHO.

                  But I will give it a shot and see if I like the change. Thanks for taking the time to do this!

                  Comment


                  • EPIC players:
                    I see no reason not to increase the epic game time if that's what you guys are asking for. I play Normal pace- and so work on fine tuning that. I appreciate your guys' input. I was looking over the numbers (game pace) last night and thought, just mathematically, that they could be improved. So expect a change in EPIC length with the next release.

                    TELL ME any other fine tunings regarding EPIC game pace that you experienced as well, if you have some.

                    Unspeakable Horror:
                    THANKS! That may work really well. I reordered the XML from cheapest to most expensive techs, so I hope this util parses thing without regard to relative positioning... I'll check it out.

                    David Clifton:
                    What era (roughly) did tech start to come too quickly?

                    Gikkuriman:
                    AGH! more work... but seriously, the tech tree and pedia update automatically, so use those for now. Tips and such will be done once this mod is stabilized better for balance. I'm still seeking input from players (especially for EPIC games) and making changes here and there. I have noticed the changes are less dramatic with each iteration, however. Short answer: I may change those eventually- but honestly, I turned off Sid's tips and jsut use the dynamic tips.

                    Zuul:
                    Tell me a bit more about why- this will make more early experienced units out in the world, but keep in mind you get combat bonuses versus animals and barbs- so it's like gaining cheap experience. I'm open to the idea, jsut tell me more- give me a rationale I can follow through. How do you think it would change the game for the better?

                    Saldrin:
                    Try it out with the rationale I gave you- I've yet to see the AI upgrade cav to copters... in all my games they use the cav until they're all dead because tanks have come into play and totally own them. Then choppers get invented... but who cares? No cavalry left (except to maybe a totally peaceful AI).

                    Anyway tell me what you think after you've played it- the goal there was strictly a game-balancer- let the AI have a way to not waste away its military in a way a smart player would never do.

                    Comment


                    • Okey hare are some things about exp:

                      Extra xp bonuses from civics and such dosen't give enough when you can just have and unexperienced unit defend a city from attacks for a while and get the same exp.

                      After a while it becomes more micromanagement to choose which units that should defend/explore (to get most exp), and who should just be in the center cities to remove unhappiness.

                      Barbarians with same stats as a "real" civ unit is as hard so it should generate same exp. At least a bit more than now.

                      But there is other ways to get the feel of fighting barbarians gives something, like maybe getting a barbarian trait, or can get higher levels but more slowely, only gaining an exp every other kill.

                      There should be other ways to get exp (like exploration, age, training, and so on), but when there are none, making wars just to get more experienced units dosen't make much sence.
                      Last edited by Zuul; November 14, 2005, 15:25.

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                      • Astronomy in my game was the last tech to be a chore to get. I rushed for it because I found a large island that was unpopulated. After that I did 1 or 2 earlier techs and then started rushing for computers with a few side-jobs along the way. Everything after astronomy though came within 10 turns and the game had about 80 turns left when I ended, there were 3 techs left or so.

                        Correction from earlier: that was on Noble

                        Diplomacy was extremely simple in this game because it had two major continents.

                        My one major gripe though with the longer game was that I could build every building in almost every city very easily. This kinda put a kink in the city specialization that the developers were trying to make.

                        Changes I liked in the game were basically everything from the tech changes on down. I expecially enjoyed using caravels more.
                        Last edited by ghen; November 14, 2005, 18:45.
                        ~I like eggs.~

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                        • Ok, let me follow up:

                          ghen:
                          OK, astronomy- let me check into what goes on around then that influences tech cost/speed of research and other stuff. I'll make some changes. I think that's about when things go fast for me too... How did the AI keep up, though? Not that I can help them at this point, but if you just rocked your game (like many many techs ahead of AI) decreasing the rate of research will only hurt your game experience. Know what I mean?

                          The building thing in each city? Let me double check the rates on those- I htink I changed those in my latest version (which I haven't released yet) as I found the same thing.

                          Zuul:
                          Hm. This is alot to think about. You're the first to raise this issue, and I'm torn on it. To me, I see the barbs as disorganized and there's really only so much combat benefits you can get from facing them. Facing another organized CIV is the only way to really hone your skills. Keep in mind, barbs do NOT have the same stats as you until you play emperor or diety level- until then you're getting a bonus in combat versus them- although in my latest version of the mod (not yet released) I changed this to only a -5% bonus or so at Noble.

                          In my games I go through eras where my units get up to 12 xp right when they're minted and eras when they all get 4 or so... depends on many factors. So when you say there's no good way to get xp, I dunno- seems like as the game progresses there *are* in fact a lot of ways.

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                          • I have a concern. Been playing with this mod on the earth18civs map, as germany. Raced to bronze working, killed france, rome and spain very quickly, then proceeded to boost my empire with buildings.

                            So far, and Im at gunpowder, Im kicking everyones but. I mean, sure its only Noble, but my score is about 1700 compared to closest opponent at about 600.
                            I have all wonders, I am 2 ages before everyone else, and I can run my sciencerate at 0% with 7 turn tech discoveries.

                            My question is simply, has anyone else experienced this? I asume it is a bug, specialy considering the 0% sciencerate and still incredible researchrates.

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                            • One more thing I noticed:
                              There is a mod a few pages back on these forums which keeps you from trading away all your resources. It stops the resource from appearing on the trade menu if you have only 1 of the resource. I highly recommend you (ask permission and then) add this to your great mod.
                              Here's the thread:


                              FancyAFrederick, I think you may just be a very good player, or had a good starting point, or both, because I played this mod last night and I didn't have the problems you describe. It was challenging on Noble, and the AI civs were competitive.
                              Last edited by Gikkuriman; November 14, 2005, 20:40.

                              Comment


                              • gikkuriman,
                                not only a great suggestion, but the link to help me out: THANKS! (looking it over now)

                                FancyAfred:
                                Uh... WTF is gong on in that game? I cannot explain that at all- 0% research and 7 turns to a tech?

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