Who do you think is the worse Christian?

[Kidlicious]

Do you really think there is no guilt in atheist families? Guilt is about human interaction; it does not require a supernatural entity.

Sure there is guilt in atheist families. What BK is saying is that there are no true atheists. Everyone believes in God. Saying that you don't believe in God doesn't mean that you don't. What happens is that people harden their hearts, and that makes them stupid (double-minded).

[Kidlicious]

So you admit God is not real and thus your poor Christian evangelism is irrelevant?

(Ben is so incapable of seeing another viewpoint on an issue that it is impossible for him to fathom that someone could address a hypothetical without 100% believing that the hypothetical is reality.)

You should explain how you have be guilty before accusing him of this. How can he be guilty of not being able to see your viewpoint if you haven't explained it?

[Kidlicious]

Of course not, and your continued (feigned) inability to parse my post even after I've repeated it several times is quite frustrating, so go ahead and choose to believe whatever you choose to believe. My post was directed at Kidicious at any rate, who may not understand that he is making the world a worse place through his actions; in contrast, I doubt that you care one way or the other.

Why is it important for the world to be a good place, and not a worse place? Jesus said, that He comes to bring conflict to the world. Take it up with Him. If I bring a conflict to you, maybe it's because my Lord brings a conflict to you.

[Aeson]

You should explain how you have be guilty before accusing him of this. How can he be guilty of not being able to see your viewpoint if you haven't explained it?

It's not about my viewpoint at all. It's about his mangling of logic and language in response to loin.

[Aeson]

Why is it important for the world to be a good place, and not a worse place? Jesus said, that He comes to bring conflict to the world. Take it up with Him. If I bring a conflict to you, maybe it's because my Lord brings a conflict to you.

"Jesus made me do it!"

[Aeson]

Everyone believes in God. Saying that you don't believe in God doesn't mean that you don't.

Do you believe in Zeus?

[Kidlicious]

It's not about my viewpoint at all. It's about his mangling of logic and language in response to loin.

You do know that he believes in God, right?

Do you believe in Zeus?

No. Believing in Zeus and believing in an authority higher than myself is not the same thing. Believing that you have committed a sin is believing that there is a higher authority than yourself. Simply denying this, and refusing to explain your point of view is just foolishness.

[Kidlicious]

"Jesus made me do it!"

And? Why is it that you don't believe that anyone should have a conflict with you, when you feel guilty? I'm assuming that you feel guilty, or course.

[kentonio]

Nonsense. From an atheist perspective, why would one conclude that a poor evangelist was a bad thing? I don't see it. It would seem to me a good thing.

Because from an atheist perspective all evangelism is an annoying and pointless waste of time, so if we're going to have to listen to it anyway we may as well get the enjoyment of watching someone do a pointless job well instead of a pointless job badly.

It's like watching a construction crew building a folly. I'd rather watch them do it properly than just half ass the job, but at the end of the day its still a folly.

[kentonio]

Sure there is guilt in atheist families. What BK is saying is that there are no true atheists. Everyone believes in God. Saying that you don't believe in God doesn't mean that you don't. What happens is that people harden their hearts, and that makes them stupid (double-minded).

This is brilliant.

[Aeson]

No. Believing in Zeus and believing in an authority higher than myself is not the same thing. Believing that you have committed a sin is believing that there is a higher authority than yourself. Simply denying this, and refusing to explain your point of view is just foolishness.

Saying you don't believe in Zeus doesn't mean that you don't.

[Kidlicious]

Saying you don't believe in Zeus doesn't mean that you don't.

I didn't say that I did. I didn't imply that I did. You are arguing that it is possible to feel guilt without believing in God. Feeling guilt IS believing in God.

[Kidlicious]

Guilt can not be a reasonable thing, from an atheist perspective. It can only be reasonable for a theist perspective. That is, that the person who feels guilty actually believes in moral principles, and not the idea that society functions better if people believe in moral principles. Believing in moral principles in not reasonable. It takes faith to believe in moral principles, something which is a violation of the very core of atheism. If any atheist says that it's good that people feel guilt, then they are saying that it's good that people are not reasonable.

[Aeson]

I didn't say that I did. I didn't imply that I did. You are arguing that it is possible to feel guilt without believing in God. Feeling guilt IS believing in God.

Feeling guilt is believing in Atë.

[Kidlicious]

You don't seem very enthusiastic about defending your beliefs.