Does Anyone Know Why You Can't Open A Airplane Door Mid Flight?

[Wiglaf]

I want to buy new computers for my office (not using government money -- As many of you know, I make over $150,000 a year because of my dead father's investments), and am wondering whether Macbooks are better than Dell Adamos for this purpose? If it helps , I am planning on spying on my employees using software.

But the reason I am starting this thread is that my scheduler asked me today what would happen if someone tried to open an airplane door mid-flight . I am actually thinking that it is because it is locked, but then it would not be very useful in an emergency where the captain was disabled now would it? Is it a pressure thing, or are the doors really not meant to be open, visa vee fight Club? If this is the case how did the HUDSON RIVER MIRACLE happen?

It is chilly in DC and will snow this weekend. I look forward to the opportunity to try out my new fire place.

[Asher]

You wouldn't be able to open the door at cruising altitude due to pressure differential.

[DaShi]

Aircabins are pressurized. If you opened the door, everyone's head would explode from the sudden drop in pressure. -FACT!!

[Asher]

More accurately, it would get windy for a bit and some people may get sucked out. Then everyone else will suffer from hypoxia, if the fuselage remains intact.

[SlowwHand]

Which is why they have oxygen masks drop down. Trying to put the masks on will give them something to do as they're being sucked out of the airplane, taking their attention away from their dire circumstances.

[Asher]

There's only a few minutes of oxygen for the passengers. The pilots need to put the plane into a steep dive to get to low altitude.

[SlowwHand]

They won't even have the masks on before they're sucked out. The masks are merely a diversion. The pilot can do whatever he wants. Unless it's Captain Sully piloting, they're dead.

[Legend]

You wouldn't be able to open the door at cruising altitude due to pressure differential.

WIth the doors that open outwards, you could. Or are you saying that the pressure holds the locking mechanism.

They won't even have the masks on before they're sucked out.

You should wear your seatbelt even when the sign isn't on.

[Asher]

WIth the doors that open outwards, you could. Or are you saying that the pressure holds the locking mechanism.

They are all plug-style doors on modern airplanes.

[Theben]

Whoever opens it will definitely take a tumble.

[SlowwHand]

You should wear your seatbelt even when the sign isn't on.

You're counting on a seatbelt? You're pretty funny. Why don't you leave me and/or Asher your next of kin information? The news will be handled properly.

[MrFun]

The reason why I can never open a thread by Wiglaf in the middle of sitting on the toilet while taking a dump is because I have enough **** to deal with at the time.

[Asher]

And there goes the thread.

[SlowwHand]

Pretty much, yeah.

[MikeH]

Even if you could blow the door off, you probably wouldn't get sucked out of the plane unless you were standing right next to the door. It'd just be really windy for a short while whilst the pressure equalised. Mythbusters did an episode on explosive decompression I think. Certainly the movies do lie to us about that.

Ah yeah.

http://mythbustersresults.com/episode10

[Kuciwalker]

Whoever opens it will definitely take a tumble.

Not if he were Bruce Willis.

[Theben]

The reason why I can never open a thread by Wiglaf in the middle of sitting on the toilet while taking a dump is because I have enough **** to deal with at the time.

Then don't put your computer next to your toilet.

[Asher]

Even if you could blow the door off, you probably wouldn't get sucked out of the plane unless you were standing right next to the door. It'd just be really windy for a short while whilst the pressure equalised. Mythbusters did an episode on explosive decompression I think. Certainly the movies do lie to us about that.

Ah yeah.

http://mythbustersresults.com/episode10

I think people's perceptions were altered by the Aloha airlines incident in the late 80s, where the stewardess was sucked out of the plane.

[MrFun]

Then don't put your computer next to your toilet.

It's not there - hence why I would not be able to open Wiggy's thread at that time, in the first place.

[Tuberski]

Sure you can open the doors, parachuting anyone?

ACK!

[rah]

Here's an interesting summary of the issue that seems quite reputable.

http://www.salon.com/tech/col/smith/...skthepilot184/

In summary: Two weeks ago, a disturbed man aboard a United Airlines flight out of Chicago had to be subdued after claiming to have a bomb and attempting to open a cabin door during flight. Passengers, along with three Secret Service agents en route to join President Bush's entourage in California, wrestled Jose Manuel Pelayo-Ortega to the floor of the Sacramento-bound Airbus A320. The jet was diverted to Denver, where Pelayo-Ortega was taken into custody.

A few things are wrong with the AP's rendering. First off, there's no such thing as an Airbus "A-320." Lose the hyphen; it's an A320. This may strike the average reader as an eminently excusable infraction, but it's one newspapers and wire services make repeatedly.

But getting to the meat of the issue: Despite the reporter's every attempt -- intentional or not -- to suggest otherwise, there was virtually no way for Pelayo-Ortega to open a cabin door while aloft. The facts and fallacies of airplane doors are a topic addressed in my book, and I touched on it in a column many months ago. (Judging from the mail I receive, this is a surprisingly common concern among airline passengers.) Now that the press has gotten hold of an incident and made mush out of the facts, it's worth revisiting.

Essentially there are two types of cabin doors: the larger kind, like the ones that passengers use to board and deplane, and the simpler, hatch-type emergency exits, normally found over the wing. All commercial airliners have the former. Others -- generally smaller types like the 737, A320 and various regional jets -- have both.

During flight none of these doors can be opened, for the simple reason that cabin pressure won't allow it. Think of an aircraft door as a drain plug, fixed in place by the interior pressure. With very few exceptions, aircraft doors open inward. Some retract upward into the ceiling; others swing outward or downward against the fuselage; but they all open inward first, and not even the most musclebound human will overcome the hundreds of pounds of pressure holding them shut. At a typical cruising altitude, as many as 8 pounds of pressure are pushing against every square inch of interior fuselage. That's 1,152 pounds of weight against each square foot of door. Flying at low altitudes, where cabin-pressure levels are lower, even a differential of 2 pounds per square inch is still more than anyone can displace -- even after six cups of coffee and the frustration that comes with sitting behind a shrieking infant for five hours.

For good measure, cabin doors are held secure by a series of electrical or mechanical latches, or both. So, while I wouldn't recommend it unless you enjoy being pummeled and placed in a chokehold by panicked passengers who don't know better, a person could conceivably sit there all day tugging on a door handle to his or her heart's content. The door is not going to open -- though you might get a red light flashing in the cockpit, causing the captain to spill his Diet Coke.

(If you're wondering about the infamous D.B. Cooper, he ordered the crew to depressurize the cabin, then parachuted out the rear tail-cone exit, which on the old Boeing 727 did not include an in-flight lock.)

On the ground -- and as one would hope with the possibility of an evacuation -- the situation changes. In most cases, opening a door on the ground -- while taxiing, for example -- will also activate a door's emergency escape slide. As an aircraft approaches the gate, you will sometimes hear the cabin crew calling out "doors to manual" or "disarm doors." This varies somewhat, depending on the type of plane, but it has to do with overriding the automatic deployment function of the escape slides. Parked at the terminal, you don't want the slides billowing into the Jetway corridor or onto a catering truck.

But, you ask, What if in the very first (or last) moments of flight, screaming down the runway at 150 knots, when pressurization is minimal or at zero, a man leaps up and grabs for the door? Will it open?

It might, yes. But unless he then hurls himself through the opening and directly into the path of a rear stabilizer, damaging it severely, nothing catastrophic is going to happen. Even if he's ingested by an engine, the plane will still fly.

Now, let's assume the worst. Say Mr. Pelayo-Ortega has a hydraulic jack hidden in his luggage and is able to pop the exit of that United A320, fully pressurized at 37,000 feet. At the very least, depending on exactly how fast the door opens, it's going to be excessively noisy and confusing, with oxygen masks dropping from the ceiling and people's belongings flying around. The aircraft might be damaged if debris strikes the wings, engines or tail. But there's a decent chance that the only person ejected from the jet will be Pelayo-Ortega himself, and possibly any occupants who aren't wearing their seat belts. (When the fuselage of an Aloha Airlines 737 ruptured during flight in 1988, only one occupant -- a flight attendant -- was pulled overboard.)

Passenger Donna Bell's observation, "Had he opened the door, we'd all be dead," is totally without merit, as was the AP's contention, in the very first sentence, that passengers "had to take matters into their own hands to prevent Jose Manuel Pelayo-Ortega from bringing their plane down." The plane wasn't going anywhere -- except to Sacramento. Instead of seeking out expertise from somebody who actually knows something about airplanes, the reporter used a scary-sounding account from a frightened passenger who couldn't have been expected to understand what would or wouldn't happen.

As perhaps you've gathered, airplane doors can be a lot more complex than people might assume -- affixed with sensors, complicated latching systems and dozens of moving parts. On one 19-passenger turboprop I used to captain, the main cabin door had an inflatable seal around its inner sill. During flight, the seal would inflate, helping to lock in cabin pressure while blocking out the racket from the plane's two extremely loud engines. Every now and then, the seal would suffer a leak or puncture and begin to deflate, sometimes quite rapidly. The resultant loss of pressurization was easily addressed and ultimately harmless, but the sudden noise -- a great, 100-decibel sucking sound backed by the now unbuffered throb of two 1,100-horsepower engines only inches away -- would scare the living daylights out of everybody on the plane, including me.

As for the United Airlines incident, you may take further comfort in knowing that a pair of F-16s were scrambled from Colorado's Buckley Air Force Base to intercept the A320, just in case.

There is, or there used to be, a big difference between so-called air rage and attempted acts of air piracy or terrorism. Thanks to our perpetual Sept. 11 hangover, that distinction is now usually made afterward. Last December, federal air marshals shot and killed an unarmed man at Miami International Airport. These days, even a minor in-flight disruption is liable to result in a pair of supersonic fighters hanging outside your window. Speaking in the above AP story, a NORAD spokesman cites an astonishing 2,300 military intercepts of civilian airliners since the 2001 attacks. That's more than one every day. The government won't verify an exact number, but even a fraction of that total would be unnerving.

During an intercept, military pilots follow a careful, step-by-step protocol to avoid accidental shoot-downs, but still there's the risk of a tragic mistake -- to say nothing of the vast amounts of fuel and labor these missions entail. All for the sake of posturing, if you ask me. With the threat of a copycat Sept. 11-style takeover all but off the table, what these sorties are intended to accomplish seems ambiguous at best. Put it this way: The likelihood of errantly shooting down an airliner is probably the same as or greater than the chance of successfully intercepting a commandeered aircraft headed for a skyscraper or U.S. landmark.

Some notorious military shoot-downs of civilian aircraft:

2001: As a U.S. surveillance plane watches, a Peruvian fighter shoots down a planeload of suspected drug smugglers. The aircraft is actually ferrying missionaries.

1988: Distracted by an ongoing gun battle, the crew of the U.S. Navy cruiser Vincennes mistakes an Iran Air flight for a hostile military aircraft and destroys it with two surface-to-air missiles. All 290 occupants of the Airbus A300 are killed.

1983: Korean Air Lines flight 007, a Boeing 747 carrying 269 passengers and crew from New York to Seoul, is downed by a Soviet fighter after drifting off course near Sakhalin Island in the North Pacific.

1980: In a tragedy shrouded in controversy and coverup, an Itavia Airlines (Italy) DC-9 carrying 81 people crashes into the Mediterranean after being hit by fire from a Libyan MiG-23, according to one theory. It is later alleged that American fighter jets engaged in a NATO exercise provoked the Libyan pilots into firing their rockets, which struck the nearby jetliner.

1973: An off-course Libyan Arab Airlines flight bound for Cairo is fired on by two Israeli F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai. All but five of 113 occupants are killed when the damaged 727 attempts a belly landing in the desert.

GO-AROUNDS

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

The correct answer is "because flight attendants will cosh you unconscious and handcuff you to your seat."

[Ming]

The correct answer is "It's silly to answer any question Wiglaf posts "

FIXED

[Theben]

The really correct answer is "chain your scheduler down immediately with handcuffs as they are probably terrorists seeking sensitive information about airline doors. If she is a hot female, use the fluffy kind and administer punitive action yourself."

[Wiglaf]

So you can open the door while going 200 MPH down the runway. This is terrifying. The douchebag Rah quotes thinks it's not, but what if someone opens the door and throws some metal object, like a Kindle, into the engine? That is what happened to the Concorde. It can happen to your Canadair Suckfest 2000 Easy Jet.

And I do not see it being too implausible that suicide engine terrorists could jump for each emergency exit, get ingested into both engines, and cause the plane to crash unless Sexy Sully is piloting it.

Let's face facts: No one's mentioned anything about what computers to buy for my office, or even considered the possibility that even mid-flight, the doors can be opened during a thunderstorm right? Because in a high pressure weather system you need much less than the normal amount of force to open the door. And people wonder why no one visits this site.

[rah]

Paranoia running rampant.

[Wiglaf]

Did you and Asher sign a pact to have penis avatars

[rah]

Yeah, but mine's more strokeable.

AW, come on it's so cute. It just screams "pet me, PET ME"

[Joseph]

Here's an interesting summary of the issue that seems quite reputable.


1988: Distracted by an ongoing gun battle, the crew of the U.S. Navy cruiser Vincennes mistakes an Iran Air flight for a hostile military aircraft and destroys it with two surface-to-air missiles. All 290 occupants of the Airbus A300 are killed.


GO-AROUNDS

A friend of mine was on the Enterprise CVN-65 during that shoot down. He was in CIC Ops, and he told me that the Iranian Airplane did fly an attack profile and was headed right for the big E. He said the Vincennes try to call them several times, but the Iranian airplane would not respond.

[Asher]

THE AIRLINER IS GOING TO ATTACK US! LOOK AT THAT, A BLATANT ATTACK PROFILE OF LEVEL FLIGHT. WHAT MORE EVIDENCE DO YOU NEED. FIRE, FIRE, FIRE.