Open Letter to Apolyton CS and the Greater Civ Community

[Imran Siddiqui]

I'm just letting you know of the visceral reaction that results from that... to some, feeling like a ripping off of a part of Poly, since that's the name of the podcast.

[Robert Plomp]

All Dan said is true and we (Jeroen and me) do fully support Dan in all of his decisions.
Of course we hoped that PolyCast would remain on apolyton, and it's only to us to blame that this didn't happen, but that doesn't mean that Dan has the full right to move it to somewhere else. Especially if you know that Dan did this with the intention to help Apolyton moving on.

I'm proud that it'll continue to be called 'PolyCast'!
For the record, Dan could also have decided to close all of Apolyton and continue PolyCast only. From that perspective he allows Apolyton to continue to be named 'apolyton', even when it isn't bound to Dan anymore.

once again: good luck Dan! You deserve it.

Robert

[Cartimandua]

I'm just letting you know of the visceral reaction that results from that... to some, feeling like a ripping off of a part of Poly, since that's the name of the podcast.

This is ridiculous and immature, to say the very least.

[Asher]

This is ridiculous and immature, to say the very least.

Was certainly far more mature than this post of yours.

[DrSpike]

One point I want to clarify in preface: I transferred ownership in Apolyton -- I did not sell it. (If I had sold it, I would have said I sold it.)

As for my retaining ownership in the PolyCast series of podcasts, including its name, this was part of my transfer of ownership agreement with Robert. Not only is PolyCast the series' established name, but the name reflects its roots. Roots that I am proud of. I find it unbelievable that I am now being labeled by some as a "traitor", a deserter, and an all around someone who does not care about Apolyton. That could not be further from the truth; I guess that there will be always be critics who try to find fault with anything that others do.

As Robert or Jeroen would tell you, I have been quietly behind the scenes continuing to make this transition as smooth as possible. I am providing my time, energy and experience, to the extent that they wish, along with sufficient financial support to cover current operating expenses for the next several months. Before this, I put a considerable amount of time and emotional energy into ensuring new, clear ownership was set in place as I stepped aside. I did what I did because I care about ACS. Had I not cared about the continuation of Apolyton, I could have simply shut it down.

If you are disappointed in my decision to move PolyCast off of Apolyton's server, I can understand that. Nonetheless, I find that using that as a basis for calling into question my integrity within the Apolyton community, given my many years of freely devoted service to its development, is unfounded and disheartening to say the least. I believe that my record demonstrates that all I have done has always been in good faith and for the benefit of this community.

I have gone out of my way to explain my position on this matter because I want to impart, to the best of my ability, my reasons for it. It has been an emotional rollercoaster for me for months with regards to my decision to leave the Apolyton staff and administration, while aiming to stay involved in the Civilization community. As I have alluded to before, I would be disappointed if people were not disappointed that I was leaving my leadership position on Apolyton. But I am at a loss to understand why anyone would attack me or anyone else, personally, who made a similar decision.

There's nothing more that I can say to explain further what has been an extremely painful process for me.

Dan, we've disagreed on a few things (and I hope you learnt from each of them ) but I want to say please don't feel you have to explain yourself further. The worse thing you can do is get into a long debate with trolls here who care more about creating drama than they do about building community - something you have done far more to support than all of them put together.

[Hercules]

I broadly agree with Dr.Spike.

[Dinner]

The worse thing you can do is get into a long debate with trolls here who care more about creating drama than they do about building community - something you have done far more to support than all of them put together.

Jesus Christ, so now anyone who disagrees with your point of view is a troll? That's brilliant, that is.

[OzzyKP]

As I said to Robert and Jeroen, I came to the conclusion that it should be easier for them to establish themselves as Chief Owners/Administrators of Apolyton if I am more "out of the picture" publicly.

I'm still not entirely clear why continuing to host PolyCast on Apolyton would be harmful to the site or to the new administration. Is it a bandwidth issue?

I'm not suggesting you change the name of it, it is entirely yours and you retain full ownership and can do what you like with it. I think some of the feelings that you are turning your back on Apolyton would be mitigated by a clearer rationale for why you made the decision to take PolyCast to another site.

[Asher]

Jesus Christ, so now anyone who disagrees with your point of view is a troll? That's brilliant, that is.

DrSpike should read -Jrabbit's thread in the OT. His technique is obsolete, trolls in the 21st century have moved on from calling other people trolls and now call them liars.

DrSpike, if you cared about creating community you would do something for this site aside from asskiss the people who have decided to leave. Yes, Dan did a lot over the years and in a lot of ways I am grateful. But that's not relevant to this discussion. It is perfectly reasonable for Imran and others to explain why a lot of the people -- many of which are not what you dismissively call "trolls" -- feel that this is the wrong decision. The fact that Dan has done a lot for the site doesn't mean we can't discuss this or ask him to reconsider.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Especially if you know that Dan did this with the intention to help Apolyton moving on.

I'm not sure how much I buy this. I will echo Ozzy. How does this help Poly move on? I don't think our administrators would be intimidated by Dan being somewhere on the site.

[Straybow]

Fair winds and following seas, Dan.

[Krill]

While I'm the last person to comlain about PolyCast leaving and no longer tying up resources on Apolyton, I do feel the name should be changed; DanQ notes that PolyCast elludes to the beginnings, fair enough. But the name should also ellude to the present if that's the case.

ie PolyCast Emeritus etc

[Lancer]

Funny how the same people who berated the PolyCast are the ones who seem to most regret its loss. :drama:

Ahh well, life can be a little bit funny sometimes.

DQ Happy trails.

[Asher]

Funny how the same people who berated the PolyCast are the ones who seem to most regret its loss. :drama:

Ahh well, life can be a little bit funny sometimes.

DQ Happy trails.

Imran's the co-host and nye is a fan, last I checked.

I don't really care about it. As I've discussed in the OT, my opinions on Polycast are not favourable.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Yeah, really.. I don't see how I necessarily berated Polycast, when I've been trying to pimp up the show I'm on for years .

[DrSpike]

Yes, Dan did a lot over the years and in a lot of ways I am grateful. But that's not relevant to this discussion. It is perfectly reasonable for Imran and others to explain why a lot of the people -- many of which are not what you dismissively call "trolls" -- feel that this is the wrong decision. The fact that Dan has done a lot for the site doesn't mean we can't discuss this or ask him to reconsider.

You know, you're right, we should be able to have a mature discussion about it. That doesn't change the fact that several of the most active posters in 'splitter' threads are only in them because they like creating drama, and don't actually care about the issues other than through that drama. Quite frankly if I were Dan I wouldn't engage in such discussions, at least for now.

You yourself have continuously mocked 'PolyCast. Now it's gone and all of a sudden you are aghast. Sorry, it doesn't wash. I actually think you do genuinely care - but it's constantly fighting with your desire to score points against Dale and others.

If you really want an open debate, try not being an ass for a couple of weeks and I think you'd be more successful.

[Asher]

You know, you're right, we should be able to have a mature discussion about it. That doesn't change the fact that several of the most active posters in 'splitter' threads are only in them because they like creating drama, and don't actually care about the issues other than through that drama. Quite frankly if I were Dan I wouldn't engage in such discussions, at least for now.

You yourself have continuously mocked 'PolyCast. Now it's gone and all of a sudden you are aghast. Sorry, it doesn't wash. I actually think you do genuinely care - but it's constantly fighting with your desire to score points against Dale and others.

If you really want an open debate, try not being an ass for a couple of weeks and I think you'd be more successful.

I don't like PolyCast at all. I've made that very clear. That has nothing to do with the obvious impropriety involved in taking PolyCast and hosting it elsewhere.

Dan can do what he wants with it -- I've made that clear, too -- but it's increasingly apparent to me that Dan does not comprehend the social dynamics of this site. There's a ton of people upset by this, and he should hear why. Your solution to basically shut up and kiss ass does nothing but let certain people keep their 'ignorance is bliss' philosophy.

FWIW, you are being an ass in this thread by calling anyone who is questioning what is going on here a troll. If you re-read the thread, you'll see I was not being an ass. I was being serious and not calling any names or going overboard. I was explaining the general sentiment among a significant portion of the site's population. It was you, DrSpike, that came in with offensive characterizations about the intent of people who questioned what's going on here. You are not contributing to an honest, mature debate and you are being an ass. Strongly recommend you re-read the thread and reconsider the direction you are dragging the thread.

[DrSpike]

No, some people are striving for a mature discussion. They are not trolls. The ones who are trolling are though (it's important not to just look at this thread)

And they are spoiling it for the first group, which is a shame.

[Asher]

No, some people are striving for a mature discussion. They are not trolls. The ones who are trolling are though (it's important not to just look at this thread)

And they are spoiling it for the first group, which is a shame.

PM me if you want to troll this discussion further. I'm done with it.

Again, re-read the thread. Imran and notyoueither (NOT TROLLS by any reputation) were politely and pointedly describing the sentiment in the community at large. You came in and essentially name-called everyone participating in the discussion as:

trolls here who care more about creating drama than they do about building community

which was the first troll of the entire thread. You're now contributing further by continuing this assertion that isn't relevant to the thread in any way.

If I were Cybershy, I'd seriously reconsider making you moderator of any forum here considering you're demonstrating an ineptitude with forum protocol that should be inconsistent with administrative standards.

[DrSpike]

Lol, cut the righteous indignance. The fact of the matter is you are a victim of how you choose to act. I don't think you should change that - it's quite entertaining - but don't squeal like a stuck pig when it closes off avenues you might otherwise have had.

[Asher]

@ DrSpike. Can't leave well enough alone.

[Robert Plomp]

I do not want to close this thread.
Can we please stick to the letter of Dan and respect him because of everything he did?

Everybody has been able to make his point.
From now on I'll delete all posts that refer to the name of Polycast, implicit or explicit.
If you want to discuss this topic create a thread in the OTF.

Thanks to all.

Robert

[Zoid]

I do not want to close this thread.
Can we please stick to the letter of Dan and respect him because of everything he did?

Everybody has been able to make his point.
From now on I'll delete all posts that refer to the name of Polycast, implicit or explicit.
If you want to discuss this topic create a thread in the OTF.

Thanks to all.

Robert

I have a better idea, permaban Asher. It's all his fault anyway...

[Ben Kenobi]

As for my retaining ownership in the PolyCast series of podcasts, including its name, this was part of my transfer of ownership agreement with Robert.

I was under the assumption that you would continue to host it here. You created Apolyton. It made perfect sense to me that you'd keep your own little nook and keep up-to date with the goings on here.

Not only is PolyCast the series' established name, but the name reflects its roots. Roots that I am proud of. I find it unbelievable that I am now being labeled by some as a "traitor", a deserter, and an all around someone who does not care about Apolyton.

We find it inexplicable that you would take Polycast anywhere but here. Frankly, I don't understand or accept your rationales. You are always welcome here, and there is no 'conflict' between you and Cybershy with you staying on at Polycast and hosting it here. None whatsoever.

That could not be further from the truth; I guess that there will be always be critics who try to find fault with anything that others do.

Dan, have I ever said a word negative about PolyCast? Ever? I thought it was a good idea, which is why I expected you to continue hosting it here as PolyCast.

[Ben Kenobi]

If you want to discuss this topic create a thread in the OTF.

Hence the reason I created a discussion thread yesterday for this topic, so that it wouldn't make this tribute thread drift.

It is a question for the administration. Why don't you let my thread come back again, or shall I start another one here?

[Ben Kenobi]

The name "PolyCast" still has something to do with Apolyton. PolyCast is a Civ community podcast, and Apolyton is a member of that community.

So why not host it at CFC and call it Polycast?

Dan, it's already acquired the nickname of PandaCast so it's in your best interests to ditch the Poly name altogether for something that is more appropriate with your decision to host it elsewhere.

Further, PolyCast began on and, up until the start of this month was, as an official podcast of Apolyton. To me, changing the name from "PolyCast" would have in great part been trying to restrict, possibly even remove, acknowledgment of that proud association.

You made that decision Dan, when you chose to take it with you. I'm sorry, but you chose to throw that association in the trash. Taking the name won't change the reality, which is that PolyCast has nothing to do with Poly anymore, no moree then it has to do with CFC.

I like you Dan, but I think this is a terrible decision on your part, and I wish you'd reconsider.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Pandacast