Reply With QuoteOr to be more accurate you have a tendency to stretch posted evidence to fit what you want the position to be. Sometimes this is warranted, and sometimes not.
It does not always occur to me to post the obvious. Sometimes I feel optimistic about the competency of my opponents.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
Or to be more accurate you have a tendency to stretch posted evidence to fit what you want the position to be. Sometimes this is warranted, and sometimes not.
Your attempt to play referee is simultaneously condescending and amusing.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
Thanks!
Originally Posted by Asher
The evidence was in the article you cited, which showed that Wiis were the second most played console, and not far behind the 360. One doesn't need to own a console to figure that out. Obviously the larger sales of the Wii mean a lower usage per unit. Since when does lower usage per unit than the 360 translate into "collecting dust". This is remarkably similar to the argument wrt to SW sales.
Thanks for bringing in anecdotal data. I was at a party two weeks ago (teens and parents) where the household's Wii was being played, Super Smash Brothers. Of course that was a household that had a PS3 (the kids were playing Rock Band) but no 360, so it was perhaps not typical. The kids were even playing Starcraft on a laptop, so the kids weren't typical either.
"A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber
yes, since thats the principle meme of the 360 fanboys (not saying you are one, but they certainly are widely present in internet discussion) against th Wii, thats hardlty surprising, I dont need to google it to know that. Cue Asher digging up quotes from more respectable sources saying the same thing.
Of course I am not denying the meme exists, whether among mouth breathing fanboys or others. I am instead taking a point from the data source you cited.
"A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber
I neither care one way or another if the wii sells more than the 360 or vice-versa. But as we are talking on this surely you can just look at current software sales to get an idea of the releative 'health' of a system?
Like the PS2's falling software sales would indicate less people buying new games and continuing to play their PS2's? Slow games sales must have some correlation to a platforms usage?
I suspect that 'hardcore' gamers would soon tire of the wii when they have better hardcore games on the other curent platforms? But families and the 'new' market of gamers that the wii succesfuly aimed for seem to keep buying games - software sales are very good for the wii.
The hardcore gamers tired of the Wii long ago. The Nintendo forums on the gaming site are downright hostile during E3 especially when Nintendo trots out endless demos of **** casual games and no mention of "real" games.
I don't think LOTM understands or is capable of understanding the dynamics of console gaming. He's hopeless, and I wish he'd just stop trying.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
I agree on the hardcore gamer front.
Where I don't agree with your position is the enjoyment levels of casual gamers around the Wii. Lower average playtime isn't that surprising to me given that we are talking about casual gamers playing casual games. It's perfectly consistent with the core demographic enjoying games in line with their preferences (and attach rate figures are too). Anecdotally you can prove anything - I have lots of friends with kids who get a lot of use out of their Wii. Pricing is probably a better indicator: in the UK the Wii is still selling well even though it costs about the same as a 360 with a 60GB hard drive (clearly a far superior machine).
So although you (and me) may not like it, it's pretty undeniable that the Wii is a great success at what it is setting out to do. Even if Wiis owned by hardcore gamers are gathering dust this probably isn't replicated more widely amongst the people the Wii is actually aimed at. This is the point that people are tring to make and you are dodging quite unsuccessfully.
Then you DO agree with me.
People can't enjoy something they don't use. Casual gamers play the Wii for a bit then it collects dust for months on end til they bring it out again to play Wii Sports at a drunken party. It's a modern day copy of Monopoly.
Hardcore gamers are bored of it, casuals just don't play it very much. That explains why the Wii is below the 360 in time played even though there's more units out there. Lots are collecting dust.
Ergo, you agree with me. And I was right. And LOTM is clueless.
What else is new?
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
Hold on - how does lower average playtime equal collecting dust for months on end? You spend more time looking at stats so feel free to post more, but I've never seen anything to indicate this. The casual playerbase could be playing each and every week, just for less hours.
Above you posted some anecdotal evidence, and some links to suggest that hardcore gamers leave their Wii to gather dust. But that's not enough to prove your whole proposition.
..........and the PS2 is(still) the most played console in the world, so i'm right to like it so much....if this all about right and wrong
Quiet El Cid - the grown ups are talking.
ok if you say so!
You have to be kidding me, DrSpike. Are you asking for scientific evidence that many Wii consoles collect dust for months on end?
You need to get real. Here's the big picture:
1) There are many more Wiis than 360s, but the total amount of time spent gaming on these Wiis is less than the 360s. That is to say, people who use the 360 use it far more.
2) There are examples of publishers complaining that less than 1/3 of Wii are actually being played with regularity (that is to say, the 2/3 of them are collecting dust)
3) There are MANY examples of people anecdotally in real life, and in this thread, that support the assertion most Wiis are collecting dust
4) There are MANY examples of people online complaining that their Wiis are collecting dust
5) It is obvious that the gameplay of 99% of Wii games can best be described as "short", "shallow", and "repetitive" -- conducive to the notion that console collects dust after its initial use.
Now if you start putting all these pieces together, WHAT DOES IT TELL YOU?
You're being a tool here. Put aside your economics training and SEE THE BIG PICTURE for once.
We can't prove anything here, so drop the incessantly nagging scientific referee act, grow a pair, and analyze the situation from a practical perspective.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
Great - you now realise what the data says, and what you are interpolating based on your own preferences and views. I'd say my work here is done.
Yes, now that you've finally comprehended the implications we can move on. Try to keep up.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
To increase the anecdotal sample base, my brother and I haven't played our wii in so long that I don't know where the sensor bar is. Nor have I had any particular desire to look for it.
Do you have kids?
Hint: He lives with his brother.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
For reference, he is 13. When we first got it he played in excess of 6 hours a day during the summer. I was playing daily but much less. I stopped playing it after I dropped out of my Madden cycle and beat or tired of our game library. Gameplay was higher when we had a third (gaming) family member to make the group games more dynamic (wii play/wii sports/smash brothers/mario party). Later in the summer I may pick up playing Madden again in combination with my ps2 Madden franchises.
We are content with our current gaming choices, warcraft 3 and starcraft against his little friends for him, civ2 for me.
I found this in a gaming site article. The statistics are taken from the American market from october to december last year. I think there are some things Asher will enjoy here...
Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Maybe so if there were any stats.
Btw I always got the impression ColdWizard was older. He must act mature (at least in comparison to some regular posters anyway
Consider me impressed. This is the most correct post I've ever seen from you. Nothing is wrong.I found this in a gaming site article. The statistics are taken from the American market from october to december last year. I think there are some things Asher will enjoy here...
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
Yes, I am the mature 3 year-old amongst the screaming 2 year-olds.He must act mature (at least in comparison to some regular posters anyway
NPD March 2009
PlayStation 2 112K
PlayStation 3 218K
Xbox 360 330K
Wii 601K
RESIDENT EVIL 5* CAPCOM USA 360 938K
POKEMON PLATINUM VERSION NINTENDO OF AMERICA NDS 805K
HALO WARS* MICROSOFT 360 639K
RESIDENT EVIL 5* CAPCOM USA PS3 585K
WII FIT W/BALANCE BOARD NINTENDO OF AMERICA WII 541K
MLB '09: THE SHOW SONY PS3 305K
KILLZONE 2 SONY PS3 296K
WII PLAY W/REMOTE NINTENDO OF AMERICA WII 281K
MARIO KART W/WHEEL NINTENDO OF AMERICA WII 278K
MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL 2K9 TAKE 2 INTERACTIVE 360 205K
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
For comparison from March 2008:
PlayStation 2 216K
PlayStation 3 257K
Xbox 360 262K
Wii 721K
PS2 down.
PS3 down.
360 up.
Wii down.
Revenue grows elsewhere also:
Microsoft has also revealed that the number of Xbox Live users paying for content on the service has more than doubled since this time last year, with 128% growth in unique users purchasing XBL content -- be it use of Netflix, other video, games, or DLC.
Microsoft has also revealed that the first three months of the year have seen 220% increase in DLC purchases, led by Grand Theft Auto IV and Fallout 3, as well as its own shooter titles Gears of War 2 and Halo 3.
According to its internal numbers, there has been a 62% increase in downloadable game add-ons compared to the same period last year, with 516 pieces of game content released via Xbox Live for 63 titles.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "
PS3 needs a price cut, but SONY can't afford it.
Nintendo CAN afford a price cut, but the Wii which is still outselling the 360 and the PS3 combined, does not need it.
"A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber
Nintendo can afford it by far. IIRC, they've earned money on the console from the beginning, and since then the manufacuring cost has fallen with 45% according to an article I read the other day.
Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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