Desert War Issues

[joncnunn]

I tried out the Desert War this weekend; there's a few issues with this one.

The bigest is that every axis & allied unit has the white flag. This basically makes the scenerio unplayable since you can't easily see which units are friendly and which are enemy.

On the city screen, various icons for happiness are being used for health resources.

The rest are lack of realism issues:

1. Forests in Egypt? I don't think so.

2. Costs to build units & structures are way too low for a one turn = one week timeframe, and needs increased 4X across the board.

3. Coastal terrign defensive bonus should be abolished; if any thing, it benifits the attacker, since the outnumbered defenders have less directions in which to flee.

4. WW II era naval ships required substantal inferstructure to build. More over, neither side built many naval units for this theater, mostly using naval forces already present and occansionly a spare ship. Accordingly, all naval ships should require a Dry Docks improvement to be present.

5. WW II era planes & tanks also required some interstucture be in place, accordingly all air units, plus all types of tanks should require a baracks be in place.

[Willem]

Originally posted by joncnunn
4. WW II era naval ships required substantal inferstructure to build. More over, neither side built many naval units for this theater, mostly using naval forces already present and occansionly a spare ship. Accordingly, all naval ships should require a Dry Docks improvement to be present.

5. WW II era planes & tanks also required some interstucture be in place, accordingly all air units, plus all types of tanks should require a baracks be in place.

I don't even think it's possible to have a building as a requirement for a unit.

[Nacht]

Originally posted by Willem


I don't even think it's possible to have a building as a requirement for a unit.

What about missionaries.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Nacht

What about missionaries.

Right, good point.

[Nacht]

Just checked CIV4UnitInfos.xml. There is an 'PrereqBuilding' entry.

[Willem]

Yeah, I never thought of using it for anything besides Missionaries. I might just mod my game so that an Airport is required in order to build aircraft.

[Locutus]

Originally posted by joncnunn
The bigest is that every axis & allied unit has the white flag. This basically makes the scenerio unplayable since you can't easily see which units are friendly and which are enemy.

On the city screen, various icons for happiness are being used for health resources.

Then you have some kind of graphics problem which is unlikely to be specific to DW. It's definitely not how it should work. Do you have this in the regular game or other scenarios? If it's just DW I would recommend reinstalling the game.

1. Forests in Egypt? I don't think so.

Having been to Egypt myself I can assure you that there is indeed 'forest' there, and a fair bit of it too. Of course it's more like patches of forest with Mediterranean trees (which Civ4 doesn't have, it's either conventional Forest or Jungle) intemixed with farm land, but that's exactly what the Forest in DW is intended to represent.

2. Costs to build units & structures are way too low for a one turn = one week timeframe, and needs increased 4X across the board.

That reduces the fun considerably. It could probably upped a little bit, but for one thing the AI does sooo much better with cheap units...

The whole idea that units can be built in Africa, the Levant and Greece is ludicrous to begin with, but not being able to build units at all is neither fun nor very civ-like...

4. WW II era naval ships required substantal inferstructure to build. More over, neither side built many naval units for this theater, mostly using naval forces already present and occansionly a spare ship. Accordingly, all naval ships should require a Dry Docks improvement to be present.

5. WW II era planes & tanks also required some interstucture be in place, accordingly all air units, plus all types of tanks should require a baracks be in place.

See above. Scenario isn't much fun if it's hard to build units, and historically it shouldn't be possible to build units at all (except in Italy, but even then their industry was mostly in the north).

DW is no more unrealistic than the regular game in this respect.

[Tattila the Hun]

Consider the units built re-inforcements from motherland. Easier to swallow.

[_BuRjaCi_]

Originally posted by Tattila the Hun
Consider the units built re-inforcements from motherland. Easier to swallow.

It isn't since you already get reinforcments another way (think allies ). It might be easier to swallow that you are just reasembeling premade parts shiped in from the motherland.

[Zoid]

I love the DW scenario. Rommel has already kicked some serious allied ass, now I aim to do it faster and more streamlined.

And it really helps to have a proper ally in Italy instead of the utterly useless italians with their crappy equipment the RL Rommel had to deal with...

[joncnunn]

I only get this graphic issue in DW. The graphics in non-scenerios are fine and so are the graphics in Rome, so it's bound to be files specific to DW.

The problem with extreme non-realism in a campaign is that those who don't know much about the campaign do much better than those who do. Railroad Tycoon II suffers the same way with regards to auto-dumping all cargo at the next stop.

Originally posted by Locutus

Then you have some kind of graphics problem which is unlikely to be specific to DW. It's definitely not how it should work. Do you have this in the regular game or other scenarios? If it's just DW I would recommend reinstalling the game.

[joncnunn]

I tried it a few turns as the Americans first, and found it completely frusting that the English AI was so bad it lost control of the seas to the d&$^ germans. English AI fell for the 25% naval defening coastal bonus in this scenerio against the starting Italian fleet. Germans sucker punched the remaints of the English one.

Then I tried it as England and didn't even notice the Germans had landed a taskforce near Tobruk after I had pushed the lines back to borders of Tripoli because their flags were the same colors.

Originally posted by Zoid
I love the DW scenario. Rommel has already kicked some serious allied ass, now I aim to do it faster and more streamlined.

And it really helps to have a proper ally in Italy instead of the utterly useless italians with their crappy equipment the RL Rommel had to deal with...

[Zoid]

Originally posted by joncnunn
I tried it a few turns as the Americans first, and found it completely frusting that the English AI was so bad it lost control of the seas to the d&$^ germans. English AI fell for the 25% naval defening coastal bonus in this scenerio against the starting Italian fleet. Germans sucker punched the remaints of the English one.

Then I tried it as England and didn't even notice the Germans had landed a taskforce near Tobruk after I had pushed the lines back to borders of Tripoli because their flags were the same colors.

Ouch!

[Dis]

old thread I know.

My main issue is being attacked by invisible units. I'm not sure why that is happening. I can see the battle reports, just no units. It's not that they have a white flag, there just are no units present. The only thing I can think of is events are placing the units next to my city, they attack immediately and lose.

[Dis]

ack, I defy anyone to get control of the med sea as the allies. Even turkey can build a gazillion battleships. . Very annoying. This scenario is heavily unbalanced in favour of the axis.

yeah, yeah, I know. I'm only in May 1942. I should be getting some events to help me out soon. But so far, it's been tough. The germans and Italians build so many battleships and carriers. Unbelievable.

[Zoid]

It´s fairly accurate, historically. Apart from the fact that the italians don´t suck in this scenario

[Dale]

Let me just point out (since your very early in the scenario) that the US is giving you no help. Historically, as the poms had to do in 1942, you have to hold out and wait for the US to receive a couple of events enabling them to participate in the war.

At the start of the scenario, the US cannot build ships, so cannot help you out.

Dale

[Solver]

Dis, unbalanced in favour of the Axis? Come on, the UK is by far the easiest civ to play with.

[Prussia]

I think I screwed up my DW as well...

I played as Eisenhower, and took over spain (), but I CAN'T BUILD A FREAKING TRANSPORT SHIP. I mean, I have fifty units in Spain ready to attack, and the German Jukers and bombing the hell out of me.

Is something wrong with it?

[Dale]

You can't build transports as USA until after the Operation Torch event. Can't remember the date of it though.

[Zoid]

November 8th 1942 IIRC.

[Older than Dirt]

How much easier can it be than wining as the Axis (Rommel) in early 1942 - have to wait and hold objectives for 10 turns, I guess. What is with the USA having Cairo and Gibralter? As Monty I found that the Italians first suicide assault and then Rommel lands and does the same thing - he lasted about 3 turns after contact. Not much of a challenge. Biggest challenge I have had yet as Monty is the Americans and Free French destroying all the roads and rails in enemy territory so I can't use them after I take an Italian city to bring up reinforcements or redeploy. The Germans build a lot of battleships and no planes hardly at all. Why? This is one of the worst excuses of a scenario that I have seen. WWII planes show up as stealth bombers and fighters! At least artillery serves as anti-tank weaponry against heavy tanks.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Zoid
It´s fairly accurate, historically. Apart from the fact that the italians don´t suck in this scenario

exactly my point. Italy should suck.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Zoid
November 8th 1942 IIRC.

damn, I could have swore it was in the summer. I'm a little rusty in my history. I have to wait 5 more months.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Older than Dirt
How much easier can it be than wining as the Axis (Rommel) in early 1942 - have to wait and hold objectives for 10 turns, I guess. What is with the USA having Cairo and Gibralter? As Monty I found that the Italians first suicide assault and then Rommel lands and does the same thing - he lasted about 3 turns after contact. Not much of a challenge. Biggest challenge I have had yet as Monty is the Americans and Free French destroying all the roads and rails in enemy territory so I can't use them after I take an Italian city to bring up reinforcements or redeploy. The Germans build a lot of battleships and no planes hardly at all. Why? This is one of the worst excuses of a scenario that I have seen. WWII planes show up as stealth bombers and fighters! At least artillery serves as anti-tank weaponry against heavy tanks.

This thread has a graphics fix for the desert war scenario.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...ghlight=desert

Should have been fixed in a patch, but oh well.

And artillery (especially the vichy french) is surprisingly effective against my tanks. .

And the germans in my game are building some planes. But it's the Italians who built the aircraft carriers and planes. They keep destroying my farms.