Iron Civer II

marcuspeddle · July 23, 2006, 23:14

I'm still here but I am leaving on Thursday. I will Cerberus know about this thread.
Do I have 24 hours to play my turn? I won't get home until about five hours from now.

marcuspeddle · July 24, 2006, 04:28

I feel somewhat ashamed to say I have destroyed Unorthodox's Mongolian civilisation.

This is not my style of play at all but because it is Ironciv I felt compelled to take out a potentially aggressive neighbour.
Ugh . . .

tommynt · July 24, 2006, 04:54

oh starts are that close, hm - tiny map normal speed - better watch your cap ...

I had this ashamed feeling twice in the civ3 ironpbm

Rommel2D · July 24, 2006, 11:13

UnO explained to me how it would have taken an extraordinary effort to build a warrior before the Indians arrived. It seems the land apportioning is different from Civ3 or location seeding is not as good as I believed. I will look further into this and consider a restart when Masuro returns, if everyone else would be Ok with that...

tommynt · July 24, 2006, 17:39

UnO took a scout civ .. thats a risk on tiny map imo ... on other hand i guess that no1 want to win a game after 3 days that took 8 month to start

marcuspeddle · July 24, 2006, 18:34

I tend to agree with tommynt. I feel sorry that I took him out so quickly but the scout civ was his choice and it is Ironciv, after all. If he had wiped me out I would not have asked for a restart but if everyone votes against me then I will agree to start over.

UnOrthOdOx · July 24, 2006, 20:42

I didn't realize we were that close. Haven't played this size map in CIV. I don't have any regrets on how I played or who I picked to be honest. It was a difference of 1 turn. Or, from another perspective, of turn order. As you were first player, you also got your warrior to start a tile off your settler, where all other teams settler + unit start on the same tile. The Banana just had it in for me that game, it happens.

I made it clear I wasn't complaining about being removed to Rommel. I'm more concerned that AFAIK you kept the city as well since I was also Creative. So it impacts the other teams as well . Having 2 cities in a few turns is a pretty huge advantage.

And, I would have been fairly pissed had you pulled your punches and not gone for the jugular.

snoopy369 · July 25, 2006, 00:01

Ye, this is a sort of small map

marcuspeddle · July 25, 2006, 03:19

I'm glad there are no hard feelings about it. I got the impression from Rommel's post that you thought it was unfair.
I didn't get the city, by the way. There were screams and shouts and then a pile of dust.

UnOrthOdOx · July 25, 2006, 09:10

Then move along. I thought you'ld be keeping the city, which is why I mentioned it to Rommel.

snoopy369 · July 25, 2006, 11:17

Honestly, I'd probably rather start over ... on a larger map

... I don't think this seems right, playing a game where someone's eliminated, through no fault of their own, this early in the game. This isn't determining who's the better player; the only difference between UnO being elminated and me (another scout civ) was plain luck ...

snoopy369 · July 25, 2006, 11:20

BTW, I can't connect to the PTBS.

marcuspeddle · July 25, 2006, 18:15

I will go with the majority on a restart.

Rommel2D · July 25, 2006, 21:07

UnO isn't trying to weasel his way into a second chance. Judging by his description of the setup though, I'd say from an objective viewpoint that the level of chance affecting the outcome is a bit more than would seem desireable for a normal CIV game. This is largely my fault for not previewing the map thoroughly. I just haven't had spare time to learn CIV worldbuilder and mess around with it. Does everyone think a small map with high sea level would promise a good start or should I figure out how to preview and edit the map? Then again I'm not sure tommy is sold on a restart...

My PC apparently lost power today- I've restarted and it is Mas's turn again in the original game...

snoopy369 · July 26, 2006, 01:48

I believe one size larger map would give a reasonable chance for decent starts. I'd use Lakes, rather than Pangea, simply because it offers MUCH better MP play.

Previewing (and editing) the map is not particularly difficult. Start a SP game, ctrl-W, there's your map. Do what you need to do, save it in Worldbuilder, then go back to the main menu, and load the map under a PBEM scenario. That's it

marcuspeddle · July 26, 2006, 06:05

Well, I don't mind starting again, I guess. And I agree with Snoopy about lakes being a better map than Pangaea.

tommynt · July 26, 2006, 07:38

beh guys
lake is far worst mp map - i know what i m talkin about
pang is usually not that bad but on tiny start are somewhat close - if u dont want set u gotta play small
high sea level pang givs crap never do that - also never forget to set solid coast on pang map or there can be peninsulas.

as said i dont mind a restart even as i just think that dying wasnt due to map but due to not considering settings - i had great land i think i d have won kinda easy - not such a challenge

snoopy369 · July 26, 2006, 11:41

How is lake the worst MP map? Both from personal experience, and testimony of some of the top MP players, lake is generally considered to be the best nonteam map (inland sea or team battleground best for team)... Pangea has significant problems for MP, particularly the lack of balanced terrain. Lake has much more balanced terrain and some water without having too much, and multiple fronts (which makes it good for teams as well).

Rommel2D · July 26, 2006, 12:09

I've been using Pangaea for Iron Civ because it presents the best option for using a navy while allowing normal land conflict.

I just looked at the current game and it looks like something is wrong- it is back to Masuro's turn already, but tommy never logged in. Am I missing something?

Also, has anyone been using the DNS alias I listed?

snoopy369 · July 26, 2006, 13:11

It hasn't played my move (i've been using planned moves in case I can't log in), so although i've logged in it's just been to notice that it's still Masuro's turn.

I've been using the numerical DNS.

snoopy369 · July 26, 2006, 13:12

Naval warfare on a small map like this, btw, is never going to play a meaningful part in the game. Particularly a small pangea, where it's simply faster to walk over there rather than to boat halfway across the pangea. I'd almost say Lakes are better for naval warfare in that you have some chance of going across a lake to get to someone, rather than around the whole landmass...

tommynt · July 26, 2006, 15:19

ok ip seems to be down - i could not connect to host twice now - i set some automoves so i didnt care that much espacially as we will proly restart anyway

lakes is a very bad mp map cause it generates totally random starts - it puts some players 2 tiles apart each others while another is all allone

in pangea starts are usually somehwat predictable at least when u set teams - all start kinda same far away from each other usually and land is decent fair aswell - usually

I wonder from which experience u guys speak off - i played lot of mp games

marcuspeddle · July 26, 2006, 18:05

I use the DNS alias (you mean the word address, right?) and it's been working fine.

How about a random map?

Rommel2D · July 26, 2006, 20:07

Originally posted by snoopy369
Naval warfare on a small map like this, btw, is never going to play a meaningful part in the game. Particularly a small pangea, where it's simply faster to walk over there rather than to boat halfway across the pangea. I'd almost say Lakes are better for naval warfare in that you have some chance of going across a lake to get to someone, rather than around the whole landmass...

The point of the Pangaea is that you can bypass land defenses by shipping to almost any part of the map. It's not likely to be used as a tactic I'd guess, but it would definitely present better opportunities than lakes, where a ship would have extremely limited travel options...

BTW Mas, it looks like you didn't end your turn last time you logged in.

marcuspeddle · July 26, 2006, 20:23

Oh, spit. That's why I had a strange, nagging feeling when I exited the game. My apologies.

I'm getting on a bus to Seoul this afternoon so it looks like CerberusIV will have to start the new game for me. I've given him a link to this thread so he should know what's going on.
How about a 1 continent per civ game? That will prevent any worries about getting wiped out in a few turns and it allows naval battles. Which are kind of fun. It takes longer for us to meet but there's no rush, really.

Rommel2D · July 27, 2006, 01:23

That would make navies mandatory. My aim is to make them a viable tactic, but make sure that focus stays on the land war aspect- to keep everything directly confrontational (for the tournament aspect...)

snoopy369 · July 27, 2006, 02:14

Eh, we can play on whatever you want, rommel ... but i've not ever seen an MP game played on pangaea.

Inland Sea would accomplish what you're looking for navy-wise, and would ensure some starting distance from each other, in addition to relatively little 'poor' terrain, though it takes away some of the fun of searching for people (unless you figure a way to do it with x/y wrap

) Lakes still gets my vote for this size/player count. You might also see if Fried or Sirian have any suggestions...

snoopy369 · July 27, 2006, 02:16

The problem btw with pangaea, really, other than relative player position, is that it has such lousy start positions available to it (ie, ice/tundra starts). In a tiny pangaea, one out of four people, if not two, are virtually guaranteed to have a lousy start in ice/tundra, and it's quite possible only one person gets a decent start... there's just not room on the map, and even if there were, you'd still probably have one in the tundra due to spacing.

CerberusIV · July 27, 2006, 03:05

Hi

I'm ready to take Masuro's turns, or start a new game for him.

My email is cerberusiv (at) eircom (dot) net

It's not my game but I would echo snoopy369's comment that a tiny pangaea will almost inevitably give someone a crappy start.

tommynt · July 27, 2006, 05:48

quote: Eh, we can play on whatever you want, rommel ... but i've not ever seen an MP game played on pangaea

I played lot of games on pangea - pangea is after tbf best mp map for teamgames
ask Fried or sirian but i got more experience then both of em together how mp settings ll work out (i know who sirian is)

the thing is that once a map as pang or balanced is watched over (just doublecheck in worldbuilder cap spots - very easy to do) it allows most options imo.
without watching over inland sea, ring and hub usually guarantee the most "fair" setting as all players are about same far away and no1 got can have crap land. But fair isnt allways most fun imo