Abstinence Bush Admin's Answer to AIDS

[St Leo]

Experts attack Bush's stance in Aids battle

US promotes abstinence as global conference opens in Bangkok

Peter Gill
Sunday July 11, 2004
The Observer

The US faces condemnation this week from leaders of the worldwide struggle against Aids over the Bush administration's reliance on sexual abstinence as a response to the intensifying epidemic.

With a major international conference on Aids being opened by UN Secretary General Kofi Annan today in Bangkok, there are fears that lives are at risk in some of the world's poorest countries because of American objections to a 'safe sex' approach to combating Aids.

Hillary Benn, the UK's International Development Secretary, who spearheads Britain's fight against Aids overseas, told The Observer that an abstinence-only approach would not work. 'We need to have all the means at our disposal to fight the epidemic,' he said. 'People should have access to condoms.'

In Brussels, Poul Nielson, the EU's outspoken Commissioner for Development and Humanitarian Aid, criticised America for 'preaching one line only and denying people's rights by trying to push them into abstinence. It will weaken the battle against Aids, and the unfortunate reality is that it will directly endanger the lives of millions of women.'

Under the influence of the Christian right, Bush has adopted the so-called ABC approach to Aids prevention - A for abstinence, B for being faithful and C for condoms. But condoms are to be promoted only for use by 'high risk groups' such as prostitutes and drug abusers, with sexual abstinence the objective for all unmarried young people.

Unusually open criticism of US policy has also come from Unaids, the UN body responsible for co-ordinating the global response to Aids. Dr Peter Piot, executive director, said: 'We know condoms save lives. We are not in the business of morality. Condom promotion should be part of education about sexuality for young people.'

Bush's policy was laid down earlier this year in a 100-page document entitled 'The President's Emergency Plan for Aids Relief'. It is backed by a $15 billion commitment over five years and targets 15 countries, 12 in sub-Saharan Africa. References to condoms - for decades heavily promoted in the US drive for population control in the developing world - make clear that they are to play a marginal role. They can be distributed 'near areas where high-risk behaviour takes place' such as brothels, but they are not to be promoted for the general population, which should receive 'a clear message that the best means of preventing HIV/Aids is to avoid risk altogether'.

In Bangkok this week almost 20,000 delegates will review the faltering progress made in stemming the Aids tide since the last conference in Barcelona two years ago. The US interpretation of the ABC approach is to be challenged in a debate tomorrow by Steven Sinding, director-general of the London-based International Planned Parenthood Federation, which had official funding withdrawn for refusing to accept the US administration's views on abortion.

Later in the week the American campaign group Population Action International is running a session entitled 'Abstinence is Coming Your Way', designed 'to challenge the substitution of science with ideology in the policy-making process'.

Britain's Department for International Development last week pointedly announced an additional £80m funding over four years to the UN Population Fund, which has also had US funding withdrawn over the abortion issue. 'We are unashamedly a strong supporter of the UNFPA and the work they undertake,' said Benn. But he would not make any direct criticism of US policy. 'We speak up, we make our position clear and we have a different view.'

The EU has been fighting a rearguard action against US efforts to overturn key international commitments on sexual and reproductive rights. Europe has stepped in to fill what Nielson called 'the decency gap' by funding both the UN Population Fund and the International Planned Parenthood Federation after America withdrew financing.

A realistic approach had to be adopted, Nielson said. 'I think it was Groucho Marx who was asked his opinion on sex and said, "I think it's here to stay.' "

The US delegation to Bangkok will be led by Randall Tobias, former chief executive of the pharmaceutical giant Eli Lilley, who was appointed global Aids co-ordinator by George Bush last autumn. The number of US delegates has been cut back and there are signs that Tobias is adopting a mollifying, low-profile role in the run-up to November's US presidential election. But the administration will stick to its controversial stand. At a recent meeting in Washington, Tobias told sexual health experts: 'Whatever historians of the future write about President Bush's plan, they can never say it was the "same old, same old".'

The same meeting heard from Janet Museveni, wife of Ugandan President Yoweri Museveni, who initiated the ABC strategy which led to dramatic reductions in Uganda's Aids prevalence. She said: 'Giving young people condoms is tantamount to giving them a licence to be promiscuous; it leads to certain death.'

As the US steps up funding for Africa, Christian organisations are responding to its emphasis on the role of 'faith-based organisations'. One US Catholic pressure group has sent circulars to bishops throughout Africa, advising them how to secure funds for abstinence-only Aids projects. Government officials are supposed to be professional and courteous, says the circular. 'If this is not the case - if, for example, anti-Catholic or anti-abstinence sentiments are expressed or implied - please report this to us.'

I would like to reiterate my view that Bush is a mass murderer and that lifetime internment in solitary at a maximum security facility would be his lot if the world were fair at all.

[Harry Tuttle]

"They can be distributed 'near areas where high-risk behaviour takes place' such as brothels, but they are not to be promoted for the general population, which should receive 'a clear message that the best means of preventing HIV/Aids is to avoid risk altogether'."

Well yeah. Not ****ing would be a good way of avoiding AIDS.

[Kuciwalker]

/me feels similarly to DD

[St Leo]

Yes, telling descendants of a line that has been ****ing since the Cambrian diversification of a billion years ago and whose ancestors' success and failure depended on ****ing to not **** is bound to get them to not ****.

People are very obedient when ordered to not ****. After all, a pro-abstinence apparatchik is much more persuasive than the battle cry of a billion-year-old primal drive.

[Kuciwalker]

Was that responding to me or Tuttle?

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Kucinich
Was that responding to me or Tuttle?

Tuttle. I do not have DinoDoc's (DD's?) position memorized.

[Kuciwalker]

See my sig.

[Harry Tuttle]

Well then maybe we should just airdrop condoms by the ton and say: "Hey, just keep banging! Don't worry about all that famine stuff either. We'll be dropping some Cream O Wheat next."

Cmon, there has to be a point where those trying to help Africa stop throwing everything at the population and try teaching them.

The real problem is that the majority of Sub-Saharan Africa still adheres to the thousand year old way of life including tribal warfare, religious wars, and out and out not caring about the future.

Yes, the epidemic is terrible, but throwing $15 billion into condom usage will not destroy AIDS in Africa. Education about the disease and transmission might give these people some hope. The article itself alludes to the fact that consom usage has been promoted for decades. Has it curbed the spread of AIDS? Not nearly enough.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Kucinich
See my sig.

So, you don't give a **** that the Bush Administration is condemning hundreds of millions of Africans to a hellish death?

Après nous le déluge?

Well, I think you'll find that this planet is smaller than you think. This might well bite you in the ass locally before your death.

[Whoha]

My answer to aids is quaruntine.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Harry Tuttle
Yes, the epidemic is terrible, but throwing $15 billion into condom usage will not destroy AIDS in Africa. Education about the disease and transmission might give these people some hope. The article itself alludes to the fact that condom usage has been promoted for decades. Has it curbed the spread of AIDS? Not nearly enough.

Well, education about the disease and transmission does fall under the promotion of condom usage. Both macho culture and the demon-possession theory of disease are impediments in the fight against AIDS in Africa.

Males aren't using condoms because only pansies use condoms and because everyone knows that AIDS is transmitted via demons rather than via a virus that lives by attaching to sperm cells.

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by St Leo
Well, education about the disease and transmission does fall under the promotion of condom usage. Both macho culture and the demon-possession theory of disease are impediments in the fight against AIDS in Africa.

Males aren't using condoms because only pansies use condoms and because everyone knows that AIDS is transmitted via demons rather than via a virus that lives by attaching to sperm cells.

Umm, ok, so we tell them Joboo ain't sticking to their dongs?

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Harry Tuttle
Umm, ok, so we tell them Joboo ain't sticking to their dongs?

Joboo? Well, and Satan, and Mephistopheles, and Beelzebub, and Flibbertigibbet. The demon-theory of disease has plenty of Biblical support. I assume that the Qu'ran also has plenty of stupid things to say about diseases.

[Pekka]

About AIDS anyway, where is the research at right now? What kind of medicine we now have, any interesting projects going on as far as cure goes? How long do you think until we find the cure?

[Harry Tuttle]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/HEALTH/condi....ap/index.html

[DinoDoc]

'a clear message that the best means of preventing HIV/Aids is to avoid risk altogether'

The fault with this msg is?

[Pekka]

Harry Tuttle, thanks for the link. That's pretty recent too LIke always, there's been lot of these in the past but yet I'm hopeful for this one. The fact is, the cure, or some kind of prevention drug is bound to be developed in our lifetime, so it just as well could be now.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by DinoDoc

'a clear message that the best means of preventing HIV/Aids is to avoid risk altogether'

The fault with this msg is?

It doesn't prevent the spread of AIDS. You might as well be telling people that the best way of preventing terrorism is to not build skyscrapers and airplanes.

The goal of the movement to stop the spread of AIDS is the actual stop of the spread of AIDS. Talking people into using a condom is hard, but it's much more likely to succeed than talking people into not having sex.

Even if you hate sex for some reason and wish people didn't have it, it's very hard to argue that, given equal funding, AIDS would spread less after a pro-abstinence campaign than a after a pro-condom campaign.

[David Floyd]

So, you don't give a **** that the Bush Administration is condemning hundreds of millions of Africans to a hellish death?

Actually I don't give a **** - those people are condemning themselves to death by having unsafe sex with multiple partners of questionable health. I shouldn't have to ****ing pay for their bad decisions - they sure as hell don't pay for mine.

[cia]

I had my first child with the form of AIDS control some of you syncophants agree with, so abstinance might just be the best policy!

[St Leo]

Originally posted by David Floyd
Actually I don't give a **** - those people are condemning themselves to death by having unsafe sex with multiple partners of questionable health. I shouldn't have to ****ing pay for their bad decisions - they sure as hell don't pay for mine.

Sure they do. They pay for your decision to live in the suburbia, to waste water watering an ugly lawn, to drive an internal combustions vehicle, to use electronic appliances when a rolled up sleeve and some sweat would do, to buy cash crop groceries, and to buy sweat shop manufactures.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by cia
I had my first child with the form of AIDS control some of you syncophants agree with, so abstinance might just be the best policy!

Abstinence isn't a policy. Abstinence is the absence of policy.

Also, assuming you meant sycophant in the sense of suck-up, brown-noser, ass-kisser, flatterer, and yes-person, who's sucking up to who in this thread?

[cia]

Abstinence is merely a lack of policy in your eyes St Leo. In mine it is merely a scientific fact if you do not place your schlong in a woman's happy place, you do not catch cooties, to use the vernacular. It is impossible to catch a communicable disease by not being in communication with one who carries the disease. Also known as, DUH!

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by David Floyd


Actually I don't give a **** - those people are condemning themselves to death by having unsafe sex with multiple partners of questionable health. I shouldn't have to ****ing pay for their bad decisions - they sure as hell don't pay for mine.

Quite apart from the point that many African AIDS victims had precious little choice about engaging in unsafe sex, you're gonna pay anyway when collapsing societies drags the world economy down.

[cia]

Um, note to self Last Conformist. Please list the world trade figures for any country in Africa and let me know how much the world economy is dragged down. Any issues with the world economy are due to the first world attempting to help Africa out of its death spiral.

[David Floyd]

St Leo,

Sure they do. They pay for your decision to live in the suburbia

No they don't - that's something I pay for. And I don't actually live in suburbia - my parents do. And that's something they pay for. But it makes no difference to some poor dumb bastard in New Guinea if I live in South Central LA or the suburbs of Chicago - they're still poor.

to waste water watering an ugly lawn,

As if that water would be shipped over there anyway
Besides, I don't have a lawn

to drive an internal combustions vehicle,

Hell, if you wanna use the argument that pollution harms them - well, I live in it, so it harms me more. If you wanna argue that competition for oil harms them, then my answer is free trade and globalism. And yes, I freely admit that not everyone will benefit equally from it - the same as anything else.

to use electronic appliances when a rolled up sleeve and some sweat would do,

Again, not hurting anyone. I'm paying the electric bill. I could NOT pay the electric bill, but that'd be stealing. Or I could not have electricity, which would just make me weird. And hot. Buying electricity is simply paying for a good/service that happens to be plentiful. I'm sorry that there is no electricity in the average home in Botswana, but that really isn't my problem - and I'm not sure you can export electricity, anyway

to buy cash crop groceries,

Yes, I suppose starving would be better, or eating substandard food when I can easily afford the good stuff. Whatever.

and to buy sweat shop manufactures.

So having a job that pays a little as opposed to having no job is somehow harmful?

Look, there are starving people in the world. There are poor people in the world. They're getting ****ed by life. Actually, they're mostly just getting ****ed by their authoritarian governments, whether it's in the guise of communism, socialism, or a military dictatorship. If they'd grow some balls and do something about the corrupt pieces of **** ruling them, then perhaps they'd be a little better off. But don't ask me to (excuse me, force me to) help people who aren't really even trying to help themselves in the long term.

And don't ask me to feel guilty for living in the US and being extremely wealthy relative to 90% of the world's population. Save your breath - I don't feel a bit bad about my situation. There are people better off than me, and people worse off than me. Guess how many of those people I'm ultimately responsible for - NONE! I'm responsible for myself and my own actions - I'm not responsible for others or their actions. When I'm a warlord in Somalia taking food from starving mothers, you can hold me responsible for perpetuating poverty. But I'm not that - I'm simply a college student in a country that has maintained a tradition of freedom (relative to much of the world) and as a result, is prosperous. That tradition is also largely in place elsewhere in the world - you know, oddly enough, the more free a nation is, the more prosperous it tends to be. Look at the 20 poorest nations of the world - I bet none of them are free, liberal nations, are they? Uh-uh. They're shitholes run by *******s populated by people who are apparently not trying to do anything about their situation.

And before you go off on a tangent about colonialism being the root of all those ills, it bears mentioning that without colonialism, most of the world that was colonized would be quite a bit worse off. That doesn't justify the ills of colonialism, but blaming colonialism for starvation and poverty is not the logical connection you probably think it is.

Abstinence isn't a policy. Abstinence is the absence of policy.

You can't deny that abstinence would stop the spread of STDs, now can you? Given that fact, it also stands to reason that increased levels of abstinence and abstinence based education would also reduce the spread of STDs, right? Now, don't get me wrong - I don't oppose telling people to use condoms, but it's only honest to tell them that the only way to GUARANTEE they won't get an STD is to, well, not have sex, or at least not have sex with multiple unclean partners. Duh.

LC,

Quite apart from the point that many African AIDS victims had precious little choice about engaging in unsafe sex, you're gonna pay anyway when collapsing societies drags the world economy down.

Sorry, but I don't think that the collapse of Ethiopia or the Sudan is going to cause me to miss any meals, or even to have to buy sirloin instead of filet mignon

Liberals

[David Floyd]

Even if you hate sex for some reason and wish people didn't have it, it's very hard to argue that, given equal funding, AIDS would spread less after a pro-abstinence campaign than a after a pro-condom campaign.

People make their own decisions. Ain't my fault they make the wrong ones, especially when I freely give them all the information they need to make the right one.

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by cia
Um, note to self Last Conformist. Please list the world trade figures for any country in Africa and let me know how much the world economy is dragged down. Any issues with the world economy are due to the first world attempting to help Africa out of its death spiral.

If Africa were more prosperous, they'd buy more of our stuff, leaving us all better off. Right now, they're mostly a sink.

Africa, as such, isn't, btw, in any "death spiral", altho some bits are.

[cia]

Please inform me of the countries in Africa performing in a growth phase economically and a decline phase healthwise and I will be glad to send some help in the form of economic aid for more condoms.

[David Floyd]

If Africa were more prosperous, they'd buy more of our stuff, leaving us all better off. Right now, they're mostly a sink.

And I thought you were talking about how the world economy would be grossly affected by the collapse of African nations. But then you turn around and say that they aren't prosperous enough to import much, meaning that the economic collapse of Eritrea would concern the world economy not in the least.