Tartessos? Help me defend Schulten's theories!

[Fiera]

I must confess I read Schulten's "Tartessos" something like two years ago, and there are some things that I don't remember very well, but I've got the book here in my shelf and I'll give it a quick look...

But I seem to remember there being quite definite proofs that Tartessos existed... Several mentions to it in very different sources being one of them...

But let's discuss the thing.

Long live Schulten and Tartessos!

[Jay Bee]

quote: Originally posted by Fiera on 03-01-2001 08:26 PM I must confess I read Schulten's "Tartessos" something like two years ago, and there are some things that I don't remember very well, but I've got the book here in my shelf and I'll give it a quick look... But I seem to remember there being quite definite proofs that Tartessos existed... Several mentions to it in very different sources being one of them... But let's discuss the thing. Long live Schulten and Tartessos!

OK, OK, I'd love it if you convinced me! Proofs, proofs!


PS. Congrats on your ascension to the 'monarchical spheres'. JuanCarlos I-like or Fernando VII-like?


[This message has been edited by Jay Bee (edited March 01, 2001).]

[Fiera]

quote: Originally posted by Jay Bee on 03-01-2001 08:37 PM OK, OK, I'd love it if you convinced me! Proofs, proofs!

Wait, I need to find them in the book!

quote: PS. Congrats on your ascension to the 'monarchical spheres'. JuanCarlos I-like or Fernando VII-like?

Ah, glad you've noticed it! I was thinking about posting in the Worst King thread to let everybody know...

[Chris 62]

quote: Originally posted by Fiera on 03-01-2001 08:49 PM Ah, glad you've noticed it! I was thinking about posting in the Worst King thread to let everybody know...

I didn't notice, Fiera, congratulations! Or should I say: Your Majesty....


------------------
All knowledge begins with the phrase: I don't know.

[Fiera]

quote: Originally posted by cpoulos on 03-01-2001 09:29 PM [QUOTE]Originally posted by Fiera on 03-01-2001 08:49 PM I didn't notice, Fiera, congratulations! Or should I say: Your Majesty....

Thanks, you may just call me King of Apolyton Hispánica...
[This message has been edited by Fiera (edited March 01, 2001).]

[Prometeus]

Lunga vita al re Fiera I°!!!

Hmmmm... Schulten...hmmm... never heard about this one... more infos?
One of the most valuable "hypotesìs" is that in this legend were melted various cultures and activities' images of ancient Hispania.
IMHO, I think that Tartessos existed, not as a town or a kingdom, but as a later idealization of ancient spanish peninsula situation in Bronze Age. Let me explain: like all of the legends, Tartessos possess a deep charge of truth - the problem is to understand when truth ends and legend begins... So - sorry Fiera, no offense - without proofs, no single Tartessos...

[Jay Bee]

I would not have expressed it better. Now Fiera, you've got two to convince (he, he)

[Waku]

quote: Originally posted by Jay Bee on 03-02-2001 10:46 AM I would not have expressed it better. Now Fiera, you've got two to convince (he, he)

I'm not gonna leave you alone Fiera. Gimme some time.

[Fiera]

I re-read some chapters yesterday, and I must say I agree with Schulten because he brings up several mentions to Tartessos/Tarschisch in ancient texts...

I think those are the most decisive proofs. History is made of texts written by people before us.

I think they prove at least that Tarsis/Tartessos is not the same than Tarso in Cilicia/Southern coast of today's Turkey.

Schulten brings up another Carthaginian inscription, Hannibal's inscription in Lokroi, which makes reference to the Tartessian mercenaries.

Furthermore, Schulten talk about some Old Testimony mentions to a city called "Tarsis", which most scholars have translated for Tarso, in Cilicia, or today's Turkey. It may be, but as Schulten points out, all these mentions used Tarsis as a symbol of "something very rioch, as well as "something very far" from Israel, which obviosuly, would exclude the Cilician city...

Well, how about discussing this for starters?


[I did it again, sigh... ]
[This message has been edited by Jay Bee (edited March 02, 2001).]

[Waku]

http://perseus.csad.ox.ac.uk/cgi-bin...s&vers=english

[Henrik]

What exactly is Tartessos supposed to be?
I seem to be painfully un-educated in the ancient times

[Waku]

Do you think altavista will be able to translate this?
http://geocities.com/Athens/Forum/69...ienus_ora.html

[Masis]

Is Tartessos Tarsos? see the post I placed in this topic, scroll down.

[Jay Bee]

quote: I re-read some chapters yesterday, and I must say I agree with Schulten because he brings up several mentions to Tartessos/Tarschisch in ancient texts... I think those are the most decisive proofs.

Ancient texts are made of stories, legends and myths. They may provide us with indications, hints, but let alone, prove nothing.

quote: History is made of texts written by people before us.

Following the same logic, we should all agree that Earth was created in 6 days, that there was a Flood that lasted 40 days and 40 nights, etc, etc.

quote: I think they prove at least that Tarsis/Tartessos is not the same than Tarso in Cilicia/Southern coast of today's Turkey.

see below.

quote: Schulten brings up another Carthaginian inscription, Hannibal's inscription in Lokroi, which makes reference to the Tartessian mercenaries.

Schulten also claimed that Tartessos was destroyed by the Carthaginians. What kind of proof did he have to support his claim? A very mysterious one cos to this date still nobody knows. Maybe it's important to note here that the river Baetis was also known as river Tartessos. Hence the Iberians living near the river might have been called Tartessians. That is just a hipothesis, not a fact.

quote: Furthermore, Schulten talk about some Old Testimony mentions to a city called "Tarsis", which most scholars have translated for Tarso, in Cilicia, or today's Turkey. It may be, but as Schulten points out, all these mentions used Tarsis as a symbol of "something very rioch, as well as "something very far" from Israel, which obviosuly, would exclude the Cilician city...

The idea that Tartessos and biblical Tarshish were the same city is very attractive. But again, there is no proof whatsoever. As you pointed out above, most scholars agree that biblical Tarshish was most likely in Turkey, not in Spain. Ask Masis about that . There is of course much room for speculation

quote: Well, how about discussing this for starters?

Solid proof is what we need! Facts, not hypotheses!


I can't open Waku's links. My browser refuses to open them.

[Waku]

Proofs?

Of course no one has any proofs of the existence of Tartessos, if there were any we wouldn't be here talking about it.