creating natural disasters via SLIC????

[Harlan]

This thread has been dead for a bit. Are people still on this? Its needed more than ever, as the following article shows:

Climate change blamed for Mayans' downfall

ANNE McILROY
Globe and Mail

Tuesday, January 30, 2001

Abrupt climate change triggered the collapse of the Classic Mayan civilization in the ninth century and the sudden downfall of other ancient civilizations around the world, a paper in the journal Science says.

New information from lake-sediment cores shows that prolonged, severe drought helped bring about the end of the Classic Mayans, who built elaborate city-states in the jungles of Mexico and parts of Central America, produced beautiful works of art and developed a sophisticated writing system.

That civilization disappeared within a span of a few years near the end of the ninth century AD, coinciding with the most severe drought of the millennium.

Ice or sediment-core evidence also suggests that drought or a sudden drop in temperature were linked to the collapse of the ancient hunting and gathering Natufian communities in southwest Asia-Middle East between 12,500 and 11,500 years ago.

A catastrophic drought and drop in temperature contributed to the death of several societies in the Middle East and Greece around 2290 BC, including the Old Kingdom civilizations of Egypt, the paper said.

In the past, archeologists have concluded that social, political and economic factors brought an end to the Maya and other societies that once flourished. Now, Henry Weiss of Yale University is arguing that climate change was also a factor, and that modern societies should take note, because global warming could radically change our world.

"There is mounting evidence that many cases of societal collapse were associated with changes in climate. These climatic events were abrupt, involved new conditions that were unfamiliar to the inhabitants of the time, and persisted for decades," he writes in the latest issue of Science.

Dr. Weiss says there may be lessons in the past as the governments of the modern world grapple with climate change caused by increased amounts of carbon dioxide and other heat-trapping gases building up in the atmosphere

[Harlan]

Oh, and here's another one.

Analysis: Giant quakes shook human history
Wednesday, 31 January 2001 9:11 (ET)


Analysis: Giant quakes shook human history
By MARTIN SIEFF, UPI Senior News Analyst

WASHINGTON, Jan. 31 (UPI) -- The death toll from the Gujarat earthquake in
India continues to climb, with fears that it may pass the 100,000 mark,
making it the worst natural disaster the world has seen in nearly 25 years.

The tragedy is a sobering reminder of the vulnerability of human society
against such cataclysmic events.

Throughout history, earthquakes and other natural disasters often have
been seen as the wrath of God or signs of divine displeasure on existing
governments. But they have been as good for religion as they have been
disruptive for the state.

The 1976 Tangshan quake in China, which killed 240,000 people, caused the
largest loss of life in more than 400 years of history. It was widely seen
at the time as an omen that the era of Mao Zedong was over after 28 years
and that a new epoch in Chinese history was about to begin. Sure enough,
within two years, paramount leader Deng Xiaoping would launch his
dramatically successful free-market reforms to enthusiastic popular support.

The Richter scale, on which quakes are measured, is arranged
logarithmically so that an increase in magnitude of one unit represents a
tenfold increase in earthquake size. So, a quake of magnitude 8 is 10,000
times more powerful than one of magnitude 4. The Tanghsan quake registered
7.8 on the Richter scale. By contrast, the Gujarat quake had a magnitude of
7.9.

If current estimates prove accurate, then last week's quake was by far the
worst India has experienced this century in terms of the casualties it
inflicted.

The two most destructive earthquakes in human history are believed to have
been the 1556 quake in Shansi Province, China, which killed around 830,000
people, and a medieval quake in Upper Egypt in 1201 that is estimated by
chroniclers at the time to have killed 1 million people.

The French archaeologist Claude Schaeffer, excavator of the Bronze Age
city of Ugarit in Syria, believed that enormous quakes thousands of years
ago periodically wrecked cities throughout the Near East, bringing to an end
the Early Bronze Age and later disrupting civilization repeatedly.

Schaeffer, who held the chair of Western Asian archaeology at the College
de France, documented his evidence in his 1948 book, "Stratigraphee Comparee
et Chronologie de l'Asie Occidentale (IIIe et IIe Millenaires)" -
("Comparative Stratigraphy and Chronology of Western Asia in the 3rd and 2nd
Millennia.")

A massive earthquake in Crete -- still a seismically sensitive zone -- is
believed by many archaeologists to have destroyed the high civilization of
Middle Bronze Age Crete. Half a millennium later, the Minoan civilization of
Crete was devastated again, this time by a volcanic explosion on the island
of Santorini, thought by many to have been the inspiration for the legend of
Atlantis.

The city of Troy, immortalized by Homer in his Iliad, was found by
archaeologists to have been destroyed by earthquake many times and
repeatedly rebuilt.

The most physically powerful earthquakes recorded this century registered
8.6 on the Richter scale and occurred in Kashmir in India in 1905, killing
19,000 people, and Valparaiso, Chile, in 1906, killing 1,500 people. The
contrast in casualties reflected the thin population in the Chilean quake
zone.

However, the most powerful earthquake ever believed to have occurred in
documented history occurred in the continental United States. It was the
1811 New Madrid, Mo., quake, believed to have touched 8.7 on the Richter
scale. It was so powerful, it radically changed the course of the
Mississippi River.

In those days, the region was lightly populated and so the Indian tribes
there were not exposed to death from collapsing buildings. But if a quake of
that magnitude were to occur in that region today, near St. Louis, hundreds
of thousands would die.

In 1923, Tokyo was destroyed by an earthquake that registered 8.3 on the
Richter scale. It is believed to have been the most severe earthquake to
strike a major city in recorded history. Estimates of the death toll vary
from 99,000 to 150,000. It was at least as destructive as the U.S.
firebombing of Tokyo in 1945. Some psychologists and anthropologists have
even theorized that the immense popularity of Godzilla and other monster
movies in Japan in the 1950s and 1960s was in some way a reaction to the
1923 quake and the 1945 fire bombing.

Earthquakes are testimony not only to the wrath of God and the implacable
power of nature, they also bear witness to the sloppiness and stupidity of
humankind. The huge death tolls in most earthquakes are not caused by the
quakes themselves. They are the result of the collapse of thousands of
buildings in the quake zone.

In 1923, modern buildings in Tokyo, including a hotel designed by Frank
Lloyd Wright, rode out the shock.

If a major quake, against all odds, were ever to hit Manhattan, the safest
places to be would probably be the Empire State Building, the Chrysler
Building or the World Trade Center. That is because buildings with modern
stressed steel frameworks move as units when the ground shakes in an
earthquake and do not collapse.

By contrast, the heavy death toll -- possibly as high as 45,000 -- in last
year's Golkar quake in northwest Turkey was due to the casual abandon with
which so many construction companies had run up apartment buildings,
ignoring existing building codes.

The colossal death toll in Tangshan 25 years ago was in large part because
planners had allowed coal-mine managers to extend their tunnels beneath the
city. When the quake came, dozens of blocks of apartment buildings literally
collapsed into the tunnels and were swallowed up by the earth. Their
inhabitants were instantly buried alive and entombed hundreds of feet below
the ground.

A similar fate seems to have befallen Ancient Egypt at the end of the
Middle Kingdom. The Ipuwer Papyrus, now housed in the Heritage Museum in St.
Petersburg, Russia, lamented, "The (royal) residence is overturned in a
minute....The towns are destroyed. Upper Egypt has become waste....All is
ruin."

These are sentiments with which the people of India's Gujarat region
suddenly became all too familiar over the past week.

[Harlan]

Oh, and here's another one.

Analysis: Giant quakes shook human history
Wednesday, 31 January 2001 9:11 (ET)


Analysis: Giant quakes shook human history
By MARTIN SIEFF, UPI Senior News Analyst

WASHINGTON, Jan. 31 (UPI) -- The death toll from the Gujarat earthquake in
India continues to climb, with fears that it may pass the 100,000 mark,
making it the worst natural disaster the world has seen in nearly 25 years.

The tragedy is a sobering reminder of the vulnerability of human society
against such cataclysmic events.

Throughout history, earthquakes and other natural disasters often have
been seen as the wrath of God or signs of divine displeasure on existing
governments. But they have been as good for religion as they have been
disruptive for the state.

The 1976 Tangshan quake in China, which killed 240,000 people, caused the
largest loss of life in more than 400 years of history. It was widely seen
at the time as an omen that the era of Mao Zedong was over after 28 years
and that a new epoch in Chinese history was about to begin. Sure enough,
within two years, paramount leader Deng Xiaoping would launch his
dramatically successful free-market reforms to enthusiastic popular support.

The Richter scale, on which quakes are measured, is arranged
logarithmically so that an increase in magnitude of one unit represents a
tenfold increase in earthquake size. So, a quake of magnitude 8 is 10,000
times more powerful than one of magnitude 4. The Tanghsan quake registered
7.8 on the Richter scale. By contrast, the Gujarat quake had a magnitude of
7.9.

If current estimates prove accurate, then last week's quake was by far the
worst India has experienced this century in terms of the casualties it
inflicted.

The two most destructive earthquakes in human history are believed to have
been the 1556 quake in Shansi Province, China, which killed around 830,000
people, and a medieval quake in Upper Egypt in 1201 that is estimated by
chroniclers at the time to have killed 1 million people.

The French archaeologist Claude Schaeffer, excavator of the Bronze Age
city of Ugarit in Syria, believed that enormous quakes thousands of years
ago periodically wrecked cities throughout the Near East, bringing to an end
the Early Bronze Age and later disrupting civilization repeatedly.

Schaeffer, who held the chair of Western Asian archaeology at the College
de France, documented his evidence in his 1948 book, "Stratigraphee Comparee
et Chronologie de l'Asie Occidentale (IIIe et IIe Millenaires)" -
("Comparative Stratigraphy and Chronology of Western Asia in the 3rd and 2nd
Millennia.")

A massive earthquake in Crete -- still a seismically sensitive zone -- is
believed by many archaeologists to have destroyed the high civilization of
Middle Bronze Age Crete. Half a millennium later, the Minoan civilization of
Crete was devastated again, this time by a volcanic explosion on the island
of Santorini, thought by many to have been the inspiration for the legend of
Atlantis.

The city of Troy, immortalized by Homer in his Iliad, was found by
archaeologists to have been destroyed by earthquake many times and
repeatedly rebuilt.

The most physically powerful earthquakes recorded this century registered
8.6 on the Richter scale and occurred in Kashmir in India in 1905, killing
19,000 people, and Valparaiso, Chile, in 1906, killing 1,500 people. The
contrast in casualties reflected the thin population in the Chilean quake
zone.

However, the most powerful earthquake ever believed to have occurred in
documented history occurred in the continental United States. It was the
1811 New Madrid, Mo., quake, believed to have touched 8.7 on the Richter
scale. It was so powerful, it radically changed the course of the
Mississippi River.

In those days, the region was lightly populated and so the Indian tribes
there were not exposed to death from collapsing buildings. But if a quake of
that magnitude were to occur in that region today, near St. Louis, hundreds
of thousands would die.

In 1923, Tokyo was destroyed by an earthquake that registered 8.3 on the
Richter scale. It is believed to have been the most severe earthquake to
strike a major city in recorded history. Estimates of the death toll vary
from 99,000 to 150,000. It was at least as destructive as the U.S.
firebombing of Tokyo in 1945. Some psychologists and anthropologists have
even theorized that the immense popularity of Godzilla and other monster
movies in Japan in the 1950s and 1960s was in some way a reaction to the
1923 quake and the 1945 fire bombing.

Earthquakes are testimony not only to the wrath of God and the implacable
power of nature, they also bear witness to the sloppiness and stupidity of
humankind. The huge death tolls in most earthquakes are not caused by the
quakes themselves. They are the result of the collapse of thousands of
buildings in the quake zone.

In 1923, modern buildings in Tokyo, including a hotel designed by Frank
Lloyd Wright, rode out the shock.

If a major quake, against all odds, were ever to hit Manhattan, the safest
places to be would probably be the Empire State Building, the Chrysler
Building or the World Trade Center. That is because buildings with modern
stressed steel frameworks move as units when the ground shakes in an
earthquake and do not collapse.

By contrast, the heavy death toll -- possibly as high as 45,000 -- in last
year's Golkar quake in northwest Turkey was due to the casual abandon with
which so many construction companies had run up apartment buildings,
ignoring existing building codes.

The colossal death toll in Tangshan 25 years ago was in large part because
planners had allowed coal-mine managers to extend their tunnels beneath the
city. When the quake came, dozens of blocks of apartment buildings literally
collapsed into the tunnels and were swallowed up by the earth. Their
inhabitants were instantly buried alive and entombed hundreds of feet below
the ground.

A similar fate seems to have befallen Ancient Egypt at the end of the
Middle Kingdom. The Ipuwer Papyrus, now housed in the Heritage Museum in St.
Petersburg, Russia, lamented, "The (royal) residence is overturned in a
minute....The towns are destroyed. Upper Egypt has become waste....All is
ruin."

These are sentiments with which the people of India's Gujarat region
suddenly became all too familiar over the past week.

[Radical_Manuvr]

I'm waiting to hear from Locutus. I sent him the files a while ago. I can't figure out the problem. I will probably try to modify the code so that the earthquakes only hit cities. For my purposes, a quake hitting a city every so many turns will be okay (if I can get that to work, doesn't seem like it will be difficult). I'd like to have it hit non-city areas but I've run out of ideas on how to get it working.

[heardie]

And my code is also not working, but I could rewrite it again properly, this time.

[Locutus]

Radical, I didn't reply to your email? Odd, I thought I had... Oh well, will look at it today then.

[wheathin]

RM - for non-city areas, I assume you want to destroy the tile improvements? How about, for each affected square (3x3 or 5x5 area around epicenter), you terraform the tile into itself, replacing plains with new plains, forest with new forest? Doing this would keep the terrain the same, but would remove all tile improvements.

[Jerk]

Wheathin,

When testing for the infamous event:cuttileimprovements bug I tried a number of workarounds to avoid using the event. One was using Terraform as you mentioned. Unfortunately I did not have the effect of removing the tileimprovements. I tried to terraform to a dead tile and then back to the right terrain. Again, no effect. I even used the event to turn a tile dead, then tried to terraform it back. This didn't seem to work at all either. It would kill the tile, but it would not terraform it back in the same turn. In order to get it to work I had to check for the cell owner, then use the cuttileimprovements event. Problem is that there are sometimes tile improvements on the map that are not owned by anyone anymore. A city gets destroyed but the tile improvements all stick behind. I haven't givin it much thought lately (I took a little break after the fustrating activision announcement).

[Jerk]

I've done some more playing with the quake stuff today. I found that just using CellOwner > 0 did not always prevent crashes in the game. I decided to abandon the cellowner portion of the script and add a function for checking if there are any improvements on the terrain. If the land did have improvements then I went ahead and did Event:CutImprovements. I have yet to crash running it like this. I could just be lucky though. I still need to test it more. To check for TileImprovements I used this:

int_f TileImpCheck(location_t tmpLoc) {
location_t tmpLoc2;
   tmpLoc2 = tmpLoc;
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_ADVANCED_FARMS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_ADVANCED_MINES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_ADVANCED_UNDERSEA_MINES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_AIR_BASES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_AUTOMATED_FISHERIES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_DRILLING_PLATFORM))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_FARMS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_FISHERIES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_FORTIFICATIONS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_HYDROPONIC_FARMS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_LISTENING_POSTS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_MAGLEV))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_MEGA_MINES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_MEGA_UNDERSEA_MINES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_MINES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_NATURE_PRESERVE))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_NETS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_OUTLET_MALL))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_PORT))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_PROCESSING_TOWER))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_RADAR_STATIONS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_RAILROAD))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_ROAD))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_SONAR_BUOYS))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_TRADING_POST))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_UNDERSEA_MINES))) { return 1; }
   if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_UNDERSEA_TUNNEL))) { return 1; }
   return 0;
}

Even easier would be using this (once I bother to figure out whether or not those Terraforming improvements are in the TileImprovementDB.)

int_f TileImpCheck(location_t tmpLoc) {
location_t tmpLoc2;
int_t i;
   tmpLoc2 = tmpLoc;
   for (i = 0; i < [i]howevermanyareinthetileimpDB[/i] ; i = i + 1) {
      if (TileHasImprovement(tmpLoc2, i)) { 
        return 1; 
      }
   }
   return 0
}

[Alpha Wolf]

Another thing that is possible is that if a natural disaster hits an AI and you send money (disaster relief), you would get a big increase in diplomatic regards.

------------------
History is written by the victor.

[Radical_Manuvr]

Locutus, I don't remember getting anything from you about this since I sent the files.

Jerk, the terraform stuff in the improvement db one of the reasons I stayed away from using it. The second was figuring out what number corresponds to what improvement. At least I thought I needed the numbers but it looks like I didn't after reviewing the long version of your code.

[Radical_Manuvr]

Great idea Alpha.

[Harlan]

I'm glad I made those posts a few days ago, it looks like I kick started this thread back to life.

I just came across an interesting statistic:

On any given year, there is an average of 2 quakes greater that 7.7 on the Richter scale, seventeen between 7.7 and 7.0, one hundred between 6.0 and 7.0, and 50 thousand between 3.0 and 6.0.

Of course most of these are in the oceans (sometimes leading to deadly tidal waves, most times not) or places far from significant human habitation. Some areas have tons more than others. I keep up on news about Indonesia pretty closely since I used to live there, and it seems like every other week there's a big earthquake there, usually in a remote place and thus not causing much damage.

For the purposes of this game, I'd say we should stick with quakes 7.7 and over. Even those rarely kill 100,000 people, the effect is more loss of buildings. Perhaps someone mathematically inclined can extrapolate from the above numbers how often a "super quake" (say, mid 8-ish or higher), comes along.

[Alpha Wolf]

it would be cool if we could somehow create fault lines and have the quakes concentrate there. I cant think of any large quake areas that arent near mountains or shorelines. Anyone know any different?

------------------
History is written by the victor.

[Harlan]

Alpha,
I agree fault lines would be great. But pretty hard to do. That's gotten me thinking more about how to implement all this stuff. Howabout this, my ideal disaster setup.

Let's break disasters down into all their possible types:

Earthquake: these are more likely to appear on or near Hills (arguable, but let's say!). Mostly a loss of buildings in a city.

Underwater earthquake: these occur on or near Ocean Trench. Living underwater is pretty precarious- I'd say these could destroy whole cities by causing water to flood in in a major way. Causes a Tsunami for cities within a certain radius, on the coast. Some within that radius would be damaged, some not (since the local geography quirks - protected harbors and whatnot- might favor some). Effect of tsunami would be a loss of life and buildings, but neither too serious.

Volcano: occurs on or near Mountains. Much more damaging than earthquake, more loss of life.

Underwater volcano: occurs near underwater volcanoes. Causes a Tsunami for coastal cities within a certain radius.

Flood: same as tsunami, but only hits cities on river squares.

Drought: can hit anywhere, lasts several turns. Loss of life the longer it goes on, but no loss of buildings. Effects modified if you have Granaries or Food Silos, hopefully. Variable radius that can effect one city or a whole area.

Epidemic: can hit anywhere, great loss of life. Hopefully modified if city has Aquaduct, Sewer System and/or Hospital. Perhaps caused by barbarian Infector unit, so it can spread along trade routes?

Cataclysm: planet hit by large comet or meteor. A major catastrophe causing tremendous damage locally, triggering earthquakes, and a drought globally. Loss of life and buildings in affected cities. Still far, far short of what wiped out the dinosaurs though. Evidence shows this happens pretty frequently, we've just been lucky for a while.

Ocean cataclysm: the large comet or meteor lands on water. This causes Tsunami effect for nearby coastal cities. Earthquakes are triggered, hitting nearby underwater cities. A lot of water vapor is thrown into the atmosphere, greatly increasing the danger of flooding for a number of turns.

Catacylsms would come along about once every 500 years. The epicenter could be any square. If it was a water square, you get an ocean cataclysm instead.

Did I miss anything? Maybe fires? The effects of coastal and river terrain would have to be slightly boosted, or else people might not want to build cities there.

Here's one way I can imagine implementing these. Use the random function to determine the odds of any given disaster happening globally, each turn. So lets say, just for an example, an earthquake can happen once every twenty years, somehwere in the world. A tile is chosen randomly, then you see what kind of tile it is. If its a land type, determine distance to nearest Hill terrain. If ocean, distance to nearest Trench. If within the required distance, and there's a city near enough to be affected, have the earthquake. If within the required distance and no city, then the earthquake passes unnoticed (only give a message that a disaster occurs if it actually causes a damage, otherwise there'd be too many meaningless messages). If not within the required distance, roll the dice and see if the earthquake occurs outside its usual habitat. Odds are low that this will happen, though. If this fails, then pick another spot, and try again, until an earthquake happens, either noticed or unnoticed.

Repeat process, more or less, for each type. Note that I use years and not turns, because the frequency of disasters should be based on years. So as an example, early in the game you may have 1 turn for every 10 years, and there'd be a disaster every year on average. Later you have 1 turn for every year, you only get that disaster once every ten turns on average.

I can't really read SLIC well, so how close does this jibe with what's been written so far? Also, have people figured out a way to factor in buildings that would lessen the damage? If that idea works, maybe other disasters could have modifiers. For instance, cities with Research Labs have the science to give early warning to coming earthquakes and volcanoes. Cities can thus be temporarily evacuated, meaning only building damage occurs. Just an idea. And if nearest building to impending cataclysm had an ABM, maybe the comet could be deflected?

I like the above system, cos some places are more dangerous than others to start a city, but you can't really avoid the disasters. It would be silly to not build near Mountains or Hills, and thus have little mining ability. It also would be silly to not build near rivers and coastline, cos of good numbers there, plus (in Wes' mod) the Harbor building. Other disasters can't be avoided. So you just have to take your lumps. It probably would be smart to avoid building near Trenches and Ocean Volcanoes, though those could be extremely productive in compensation.

I also really like how some disasters cause loss of life, and others loss of buildings, instead of all having the same effect. Extra bonus: have disasters able to destroy wonders? Cos most ancient wonders were destroyed by natural disaster before they fell into disuse. There could be a problem of distinguishing between physical building wonders and abstract wonders though.

Also, what would happen if you get hit by a disaster, don't like it, and decide to go back one turn to just before the disaster hit? Would the disaster happen the exact same way after you've reloaded the game? I hope it would, so people wouldn't want to do that.

One last random thought: one could have absolute and relative effects, depending on what you want. For instance, a Tsunami could knock out two pop and two buildings. So if its a new city, it would get destroyed. An older and much bigger city, however, would be able to shrug off a Tsunami pretty easily, since most of the city would be more than a few blocks inland. An epidemic however, would naturally take a percentage of the population of a city.