Military over the next ~15 turns

[Kloreep]

polarnomad proposed in the Second City Placement thread that we build the settler before the axeman and send it out with the spear ASAP, leaving AB unprotected until it then produces the axe following the settler. The two build scenarios I proposed in this thread both leave AB unprotected to varying degrees (unless the settler is kept in AB after production). I'm opening this thread to ask two questions:

1. Are we willing to leave AB unprotected at all in order to get the settler out faster?

2. If so, for how long?

[OzzyKP]

1. Yes.

2. Not long. Enough to get that axe built. Shouldn't be more than a few turns based on your projections.

[Kloreep]

Here's my attempt at a turn-by-turn projection based on the "straight for settler" scenario here.

I think we can get the axeman out at Turn 40, not 41 like I stated in that thread. Just move to a forest & chop immediately after the pasture; we should have a road on the pigs by then anyway. So...

Settler is produced on turn 37. The settler has two moves, and unless we shift our city site focus away from the southeast of AB, its first move will likely be 6-3-3 out of our borders. That's the point at which we want the spear to meet up with it, but since it'll run out of movement on the pig, it'll have to leave a turn early. That means the spear moves out of AB onto the pigs by turn 36, and must be in AB ready to make this move (or already on the pigs) on turn 35. So, its ability to defend the city essentially becomes hamstringed around turn 33-34, and it leaves the city altogether on turn 35, like I said. This means AB is essentially without protection for about 5 turns (though for one or two turns it may be possible to turn the spear back, though the settler would have to follow for its own safety, meaning a costly delay in the founding of its city.)

AB has borders 3 tiles long now, giving us a sight range of 4. However, something moving along a diagonal could reach a tile adjacent of AB in 3 turns, then able to sack the city on the 4th turn. (Less time for a 2-move unit, but unless someone produced a chariot surprisingly fast and sent it hurtling for us, it's unlikely we'd face a non-animal 2-move unit anytime soon - and animals won't enter borders.) If a unit can sack us in 4 turns, I believe we have a 1-turn window where the spear would be forced to hold up should a potentially hostile unit be sighted on the right tile along AB's borders. Past that turn, however, I believe the axe would be produced in time to save AB (though not to save our pasture being occupied & possibly pillaged, so our pigs tile is vulnerable longer than 1 turn).

Overall, I think the ~5-turn vulnerability is a gamble worth taking, since for the 1 turn the city itself is truly vulnerable, the spear would be capable of simply stopping on top of the pigs and seeing what happens next turn, meaning the settler is only held up 1 turn rather than the many turns delay entailed in first backing up and then moving ahead again. Depending on the timing there is some risk to the pigs, and the worker might have to flee the area, but it's overall not a huge risk in my eyes.

[Togas]

1. Yes.

2. 5 turns is RIGHT at the limit of what I would be willing to take ... of course, the units COULD move back in the first few turns if we spot some danger. Our culture is rather helpful for intel.

--Togas

[Kloreep]

Bumping this in light of UnO's comment about being wary of becoming a target ourselves.

We'd be set up to not lose AB and to put up bad odds for any one archer out there, but a squeeze tactic would be quite effective on us if we're still finishing our sole military unit in the area as they're entering AB's borders.

[UnOrthOdOx]

I don't think we need worry about them entering THAT quick. What I'm more saying is someone was suggesting we go Settler, Axe, settler, axe as a general rule.

This is just asking for the Horde to attack us if they are to our south. If they are further away, however, it's not a big deal. One thing we have going is we'll be sealing off the south, creating a single front. All troops can go to that border and AB left undefended.

If the Horde is to our south, though, I urge 2 axes prior to the 2nd settler being built

[Kloreep]

Of course, if we have a longer-term concern about the Horde, the sooner we get a barracks town up and running near good shield resource(s) the better.

[polarnomad]

Seeing as the consensus is turning towards settling the site 4 of wheat south of AB next, then the spearman should leave two turns before completion of the settler, and move 2232. Settler and spear would then meet, and move 3 together leaving the settler with one movement point left to settle the same turn.

[UnOrthOdOx]

I'm throwing this out for the builderers to tell me how wrong I am.

I propose Axe, Axe, worker, settler be our build order following the settler completion.

[Kloreep]

I'm not sure we really need a second worker before our third settler; our current worker could always move to improve the next city. AB will have a little bit of growth, but I'm not sure how valuable it would be to have a worker covering that growth to 4/5 compared to getting our next settler out quicker.

Axe, axe does sound good though. AB will need a garrison and a settler escort both before building the next settler.