EC3 Fix #18 - IMPROVED NUKES

[Seeker]

These are great ideas, but would you really put this in a top five?

[War4ever]

i would put permanent pollution in as a flaw for civ 2, ie the lack of it.... cleaning up pollution in general is too easy and unrealistic in the modern age......certainly three turns at 20 years each is realistic for pollution but one turn for an engineer in 1850 is just not right

[The Mad Viking]

I did a little research...

Bikini Atoll (several islands) was subjected to 2 A-bomb tests like Nag & Hiro, in 1946; and 21 more tests in 1956 and 1958, the largest of which was about 15 megatons, while the smallest was around 10 kilotons. TheNag & Hiro were like 15 kilotons.

There were even more tests (about 40) on anothe Atoll in the Marshall Islands group.

The vast majority of the tests were surface or barge detonations. A couple were underground or airborne. They say there is more fallout from surface detonation than airborne, (and less destructive power)

The dangerous level of fallout travelled between 70 and 150 miles, although I'm sure if you were 200 miles away you wouldn't consider it safe. Detectible trace levels of radioactive material were found over 1000 miles away.

They allowed the natives to resettle in 1975, but soon removed them as it was still to dangerous. (17 civ turns) In 1998 the islands were declared safe to occupy, but you cannot safely eat a diet of locally grown food. (40 civ turns)

To me, this suggests that each nuke should only destroy and pollute one tile, and that pollution should have poisoning effects for about 20 years, and eliminate food production for 40 or more years. Engineers can mitigate, but as most have suggested, not make it all better in one turn!

Neutron weapons are tactical in nature and used to kill soldiers protected by armor. Neutron radiation blasts penetrate steel etc. while steel effectively blocks conventional nukes,(depending on proximity to ground zero) The "neutron bomb" that kills people and lets you walk into and use the city does not appear to exist.

There are also, although they may not have been built (trust no-one) cobalt and zinc bombs, which are the gift that lasts, providing a deadly dose of radiation for months / years after the blast. These could have strategic uses in a space game. (poisoning planets that you don't have the resources to develop but don't want your rivals to get)

Joker, you are a scary guy!

[Sir Shiva]

I fully support korns suggestion for diplomatic treaties concernign nuclear weapons... An addition to the list could be the CTBT, which bans all testing of nukes and imposes sanctions if blah blah...

Testing? What's that?
I think that every vic, before embarking on a nuclear program MUST test a nuclear device... The civ must first obtain technology and money and build a Test Device... Then the test device must be loaded onto some kind of truck or train (more on this later) and shipped out to a desert or something.. It should then be detonated, and will cause slight radiation effects..

Later on, nukes could be detonated underground or underwater..
If a civ has already detonated, but wants to build an H-bomb, then a new H-device must be tested...

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-Shiva
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[Tjoepie]

Great ideas here, I hope the developers read this and use it!

I especially like the idea of having different levels of nukes , permanent en "cleaneble" radiation and the fact that with the ICBM one should get a change to or not to launch your own on "PREdetermined" (this will make it a bit trickier since you don't know where they will come from!) targets before the incoming ones hit.

Keep up the good work ... [:-)

Please excuse me if my English spelling is not perfect...

[:) Smiley]

Geez, this is getting to be way to much emphasis on nukes for a history-spanning civ game, don't you think?

Would work great for a "nukleer war" mod though.

[carioca]

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
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</font><font size=1>Originally posted by korn469 on 02-29-2000 11:13 PM</font>
don don

to defend my positions...

radiation: in civ2 you can't use a square if it's polluted, so i think if a square is radioactive you shouldn't be able to use it...unhappiness penalties are SO easy to get around

nuclear winter: i can also say if there was a nuclear winter, though the direct effects might only effect food production, i have a

tactical nukes: make it a special ability like nerve gas pods in SMAC...that would simulate tactical nukes in a good fashion

korn469
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by korn469 (edited February 29, 2000).]</font>
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polluted squares *can* be used in civ 2 Also most of the fallout effect is gone in a couple of weeks.


Nuclear Winter should instead offset global warming [but in RL global warming is the only thing holding off the ice age ]

The tacnukes idea would work.

[Admiral]

Interesting thread, this.

As far as I can tell, tactical nukes and neutron bombs serve the same purpose. Tactical nukes would have been used to assist an attack by destroying enemy strongpoints. Neutron bombs can be launched from mobile launchers, and were designed primarily as anti-armor weapons. They were designed to be launched from howitzers and as an alternate warhead for tactical nuclear missiles.

If both are included, neutron bombs should be an upgrade.

[Admiral]

Interesting thread, this.

As far as I can tell, tactical nukes and neutron bombs serve the same purpose. Tactical nukes would have been used to assist an attack by destroying enemy strongpoints. Neutron bombs can be launched from mobile launchers, and were designed primarily as anti-armor weapons. They were designed to be launched from howitzers and as an alternate warhead for tactical nuclear missiles.

If both are included, neutron bombs should be an upgrade.