AU506 - DAR3: Five AI civs remaining

[Dominae]

This is the DAR3 thread for AU506: The Power of Early Warfare. This DAR covers the period between turn 80 (the end of DAR2) and the point at which there are only five remaining AI civs. Use this thread to discuss your warmongering strategy, and recount your exploits.

More questions:

1. Which were the first two AI civs to be eliminated? Why them?
2. Did you use combined arms, or did you focus on one unit type?
3. How many of your Workers are native, and how many slaves!?

[Addled Platypus]

Almost there

just a quick couple of rants

Defending on a hill with a Vet Sword, loss to regular Archer ?
Defendind on a plain with Elite Sword, Archer comes within 1 of a kill?

It wil take some more doing to take out 1 civ

more later...going back for more punishment

[joncnunn]

Jon's DAR : Monarch AU Mod PART I of Dar 3.
(Thru wipe out of first AI)

The following restrictions taken upon myself to encourage war mongling:

1. I will not be in a representive form of govt nor may I pick Monarchy.

2. I will not build any libaries. [I may still try to reserach]

3. I will not build any great wonders unless I get and use a SGL. Any SGL may only be used for building wonders that are Military.

4. I will not build any small wonders unless I get and use a MGL.

975 BC : Discovered Code of Laws.
Choose Mapmaking, but half-hoping AI beats me to this. I'm planning on bypassing both Monarchy & Republic in favor of Fedualism.

900 BC : Declare war on Aztecs. Seize the Aztec spice city and flood plains city that turn.

850 or 825 BC : Take Aztec Flood Plain Coastal City

775 BC : Take Aztec Capital. Take Aztec Silk near India
Talk to Aztecs, they'll surrender both non-capital cities and give me all their gold for peace or else give me Monarchy and some gold. Accept the 2 cities and gold for peace.

Spend 35 gold investigating the new Aztec Capital. [Effectively exploring it]

Massive conversion of builds to Temples for culture.
10 turns until Mongolain cease fire expires, start moving Horses over there and note the Mongolains have yet to spawn any settlers. They must be punished for failing to build me cities

730 BC : Mayans build Pyramids

700 BC : Discover Map Making. I note that I could trade with France to enter the Middle Ages, but also note there is still a barb camp according to the military advisor nearby after killing two others. Find the camp. Plan is to kill all nearby camps before making this trade. Start reseraching Philosphacy for Fedualism; cheaper than Fedulaism directly.

610 BC? : A future city of ours built by the Aztecs.

575 BC : Cease fire agreement with Mongols expires. War declared.

550 BC : Suicial Mongols move 2 Spears out of their capital! Mongolain capital captured! We have destroyed the Mongols!

Screen Shots below

[joncnunn]

Originally posted by Platypus Rex
Almost there

just a quick couple of rants

Defending on a hill with a Vet Sword, loss to regular Archer ?
Defendind on a plain with Elite Sword, Archer comes within 1 of a kill?

It wil take some more doing to take out 1 civ

more later...going back for more punishment

: rant : [kill spaces] ->

That's why I went with Horses + Imps as defenders. Imps have possibility of retreat when down to 1 HP.

The odds of the reg archer winning vs the Vet Sword was aprox 15 to 37. In probabilities, that's somewhere around of being dealt a "Jacks or Better" 5 card hand in Poker.

[Dominae]

You guys might want to include a report of when and how you conquered your first two AI civs (including screenshots!).

Just a suggestion.

[Modo44]

AU Mod, Emperor level (part 1 of least 2)

I have set restrictions for myself, to force war. I am not build any Wonders, nor science buildings (Libraries, and on). Also, research is at minimum (a scientist, or 0-10%) all the time.

975 BC
The Maya build the Pyramids.

875 BC
The Zulu heroes capture Tenochtitlan, with the Oracle. Eat this, Montezuma.
Peace is signed with the Aztecs for the knowledge of Monarchy (free), and a discounted Construction.
For Monarchy, China gives us Litarture.
French and Mayan treasuries get drained by selling them techs.
Research switched to Currency, with a Scientist.
Revolution started.
The remaining force moves north-west, to start harassing India.

775 BC
Paris builds Temple of Artemis.
Monarchy established.
With some food (finally!), I decide to finish the REX - mostly into ex-Aztec, and ex-Mongol territory. A Granary gets rushed.
The Mongols are in trouble (Babylon). They sell us 4 Slaves for Monarchy.
The Chinese sell us Code of Laws.

750 Bc
Babylon builds the Hanging Gardens.

710 BC
Beijing builds the Great Library.
I start asking people to leave, or declare. Just to make them jumpy.
Somewhere around this place, peace was signed with India, and some tech bought for gpt, I forget which one.

570 BC
More cities settled.
I ask French people to get out of my territory. They declare war. I ask Babylon and Mongolia for help. Fun and games.
At the end of the turn, someone finishes Currency, and uprisings start. Lots and lots of barbs.
After some pillaging (no actual combat), a new peace is signed with India, buying Currency for gpt. This deal I let last.

Later, China and the Maya were invited to the party by France. Babylon would in trouble, but I did my part to occupy the French.

270 BC
After long struggles, 2 French cities changed hands, to become Zulu.


Two Impi are stalling a nice bunch of units, and doing major damage to French land improvements. The 2 moves allowed them to escape two attacks. They move just fast enough to destroy Roads , to keep the enemy from catching up. This is a powerful weapon. I'm really surprised at the AI. It doesn't try to attack them, except if completely in the open. And AI units seem extremely easy to avoid. It works even against Med Infs in numbers, as you can see below. I have marked pillaged tiles with red spots. There was some unworked space, where the red path is broken.


Status:
Diplomacy: No civ at peace. France, Aztecs, and Babylon have 3 enemies each.
Cities owned: 17
Military: 18 Impi, 17 Horsemen, 5 Swordsmen, 1 Archer
Workers: 11 native, 8 Slaves
Science: we lack Philosophy, Republic, Monotheism, and Feudalism.

Plan:
Finish damaging France. Take their Iron city (Lyons), capital (Paris), and lux city (Rouen) - in that order, or Pikes will stop us. Extort as much as possible, and turn the force to Maya. They grow way too fast.

French invasion, 230 BC:

[Modo44]

AU Mod, Emperor level (part 2 of 2)


170 BC
Lyons is taken from the French, finally cutting them off from Iron.
During this battle, the first MGL emerges. Good, it's about time I got the FP rushed.
Zululand is now first in Land Area demographic. This is unusual for most of my games, especially in the early Medieval Age.
The Zulu culture is a big one. And that with zero Libraries, or self-built wonders. I guess, keeping the AI at war works well.

130 BC
Rouen taken. Dyes will be the fourth Zulu luxury.

70 BC
Ok, so the French still have enough Med Infs to kick the Zulu a bit. Not good.
Instead of looking on a long war, we sign peace, getting a big discount on Feudalism.
For Feudalism, we also get Monotheism from our friends, Babylon.
Troops begin moving north, to begin the Mayan invasion. I hope to get Chivalry, and start kicking them, before they have Muskets.

30 AD
Finally I notice: The Maya have no Iron! Meaning, we can kick them easy with Horsies. More fun and games.
This has "DANGER" written all over it, but what the heck. Off we go, breaking a ROP in the process.

110 AD
Our second MGL, in an Army, finds a Mayan Pikeman. So they bought Iron somewhere.
We sell Iron to the French (that's the Iron we took from them not long ago ), and they join the party.

300 AD
The Mayan party is going on. 5 cities captured, including their Silk location. But, they just sent the first Knights over...
Now, China declares war, breaking a ROP. They take some Workers, and almost take a small town. Almost.

With Chivalry, and the needed resources, China is an enemy to be reckoned with. This is the bad part of not doing research yourself. Normally, I'd have some Knights by now, along with an ssortment of Med Infs, Trebuchets, and lots of Pikemen. What I do have here, is a bit less useful. Zululand is in no position to fight them alone, having mostly Horsemen (1 Army), and very few Med Infs. So, decisions are made. During the AI turn, we pay the Indians to join the fun, while prolonging a ROP, that just ran out. Maybe (just maybe) this will divert some Chinese forces from Tenochtitlan. Naturally, we make peace with the Maya. Didn't take the Pyramids, but oh well - better luck next time. We get Chivalry, an alliance against China, giving a ROP, and paying 30gp to close the deal. The Mayan Knights just entered, very close to China...

Walls get rushed in two towns near China. Those were Mayan towns, not many turns ago.

310 AD
The Chinese do turn away from Zulu cities, following Indian targets. HAHA, diversion succesful.
We're making Knights. Beijing has the Great Library, remember?

360 AD
Maya build Knights Templar.
Irrigation projects close in on Zulu core cities. At last.
Zululand is still first in Mfg Goods, even with the last GAs started. Second in Productivity, and GNP. India needs to go.

450 AD
China under siege, going slowly. Horses cut off, to stop Riders from appearing. A Knight force is being assembled, to go for Beijing.
In the mean time, the Chinese capital finished building Sun Tzu's Art of War. How nice of them.
And here, they sign an alliance with the Mongols, against Zululand. Mongolia has no Iron, nor Horses. More fun and games.

540 AD
Finally, after losses in Zulu, and Indian ranks, Beijing falls. I used a trick - waited for the AI to damage the strongest defenders.
We get the Great Library, and Sun Tzu's Art of War. The Chinese have 2 cities left, having lost many to the Indian/Zulu/Maya alliance.
An MGL emerges during the siege, and is immediately used for the Heroic Epic.
No quick peace this time. We will try to get that Gems city, although there's probably too many Elephants around.
The Mongols are crumbling. They fight with Spears and bows (not even longbows...), and are down to 4 cities.
The Aztecs have just one city left. They had two, but the smaller one flipped to Zululand.

550 AD
The Great Library pulls Zululand to almost tech parity. We're up to Printing Press, Education, Astronomy, and Gunpowder now.
India has Banking on us, darn them. The good news is, they don't own any Iron, nor Horses.
Oracle is off, throwing three low priority cities into riots.
It will cost 2400 gold to upgrade all Impi. An additional 1800 gold will do the same to the Pikes. Who has Leo's? France does.

570 AD
The Indians finish off the last Chinese city. 6 AIs left.

620 AD
So much for the Mongols. They get wiped out, and Zululand gets to own six luxuries.


This is going straight for a Domination/Conquest win. The core makes fast-movers, and they just go and kill things. I decided against bombard, and foot units, because the empire is too big, and can't sustain the numbers for an immobile force. Ruling all important demographics. And most unimportant ones too.


Status:
Diplomacy: Everyone at peace. Well, the five ones left. It's only temporary, really.
Cities owned: 40
Military: 19 Pikemen, 19 Knights (1 in Army), 17 Impi, 8 Musketmen, 3 Horsemen (1 in Army), 3 Medieval Infantry, 1 Swordsman, 1 Longbowman
Workers: 16 native, 31 Slaves
Science: We lack Banking. Running a lone Scientist, pro forma, to Chemistry.

Plan:
I was talking of France, right? Zululand stopped selling them Iron, and they don't have Saltpeter, due to our previous war. Also, they host Leo's Workshop. Next are the Maya (Pyramids, and recently Sistine's - both in undefendable Chichen Itza (close to Zulu borders). Only then - India This one needs to be delayed, because they have the Great Wall, and we have almost no bombard units.

Zulu map, 620 AD. To the south are ex-Mongol lands. To the south-west are ex-Aztec lands. To the north are ex-Mayan lands. To the north-west are ex-Chinese lands. To the south-east are ex-French lands. Of the 40 cities, 19 are native Zulu.

[Theseus]

Watch out for India...

[Modo44]

Originally posted by Theseus
Watch out for India...

They won't get Cavs, so it's no biggie - Elephants I can handle. I'd go for them now, but I figured I really can use both Leo's (in France), and the Pyramids (Mayan), before I go. And, against Muskets behind Walls, I'll need bombard units anyway, which I have to build first. Same goes for India, that's why I'll wait until I have more defenders upgraded. Fortunately, all unit counts were greatly reduced by constant wars, and most AIs lag badly in structure development (Zululand has highest culture, having only Temples and 3 Small Wonders as culture buildings!). This means, that I don't really have to worry about a possible backstab.

Two more reasons, why not killing the AIs early was good. For one, I kept my capital (and thus - my core) relatively close to all borders. With fast-movers, this meant very quick reactions to any possible threats, and reinforcements streaming in very quickly. Also, I can't just wipe out a civ, if I want their technology. This is a dumb thing about Civ3 (no "Spoils of War" option ), because it forces one to leave enemies alive, in order to extort things. Granted my reputation is crap by now, but it's not lowest possible, so I don't want to sign peace, and kill people on the next turn.

[Mountain Sage]

Part III: The Age of Powering-Up / 1

950BC:
The French completed the Pyramids. We declared war on the Aztecs and bopped a Settler’s team.

900BC:
Ngome, our 8th city, is founded.

875BC:
Babylon completed the Great Wall.

800BC:
Swazi, our 9th city, is founded.

775BC:
The short war with the Aztecs ended: 1 town ‘gifted’ and 1 destroyed, plus 57 gold.

750BC:
The Mayans completed the Mausoleum of Mausollos.

670BC:
Tugela, our 10th city, is founded.

630BC.
Traded Literature around for Polytheism, Currency, 3 Workers and 200 gold.

610BC:
With the coming of a New Age we destroyed the fledglining Mongols.
Engineering in 39 turns, 750 gold, still slightly ahead in techs.

[Mountain Sage]

Part III: The Age of Powering-Up / 2

590BC:
Umtata, our 11th city, is founded.

550BC.
Our 12th city, Umfolozi, is founded.

490BC:
Ibabango, our 13th city, is founded.

450BC:
The Aztecs declared war on us! Isipezi, our 14th city, is founded. And finally, FINALLY, we got a Great Leader! Forbidden Palace at last! Oh People, rejoice!

270BC:
Amitikulu, our 15th city, is founded.

250BC:
China completed the Colossus.

210BC:
The Aztecs completed the Temple of Artemis.

190BC:
We completed the Statue of Zeus. The Mayans completed the Great Library.

130BC:
Traded Engineering for The Republic with India. The Revolution can begin…

110BC:
Zunguin, our 16th city, is founded.

10BC:
China declared war on us! We made peace with the Aztecs after their capital fell and got the Temple of Artemis. Babylon completed the Hanging Gardens.

110AD:
India completed the Great Lighthouse.

330AD:
Traded Invention for Monotheism with France. Traded Horses for 84 gold and 6 gpt with India. I hope I won’t regret it… Made peace with China for a paltry 11 gold.

350AD:
China declared war on us (again)! We declared war on the Aztecs.

360AD:
China declared war on the Maya.

450AD:
The Mayans completed Leo’s Workshop. We completed Knights Templar.

500AD:
India completed Sun Tsu. Maya completed the Sistine Chapel.

510AD:
India completed Copernicus’ Observatory.

520AD:
Our Lone Impi gave us our fabled Golden Age.

540AD:
The French invaded our Sacred Soil and declared war on us! We made peace with China for 22 gold.
Good news, the Aztecs were finally destroyed (just after this pic, which shows their royalty trying to escape in a doomed Galley).
Education in 2 turns, then Gunpowder. India already has Astronomy and Gunpowder.

730AD:
The Indians declared war on us!

770AD:
China joined the Indian crusade against us…

780AD:
The ‘Solid French’ were finally destroyed.
Now it’s time to make the Indians pay for their treachery… We signed a military alliance with the Mayans against the Chinese.
Our military: 4 Swords, 8 Pikes, 19 Knights, 6 Med Inf, 4 Crusaders, 11 Ancient cavalry.

The Master’s Questions:
1. Civs eliminated. Why?: Well, because they were the nearest and the less powerful. With the Aztecs and Mongol lands, we got a ‘land-continuity’ and safer borders. Now the invasions could only come from the north (a bottleneck), the east (no roads and jungle) or the west (the most problematic border, but only 1 civ there). The Babylonians were kept happy with gifts of luxuries.
2. Combined arms?: Yes, definitively. This is why we went to such great pains to build the Statue of Zeus and Knight Templar. Horsemen/Knights auxiliary FAST units and auxiliary garrison units.
Our army: 6 Swords, 6 Archers, 8 Horsemen, 8 Knights, 7 Pikes, 12 Med Inf., 10 Ancient Cavalry and… 1 Crusader.
3. Workers: 17 native (the most trustworthy) and 38 slaves.

[Swissy]

AU506 - DAR3: Five AI civs remaining (AU Monarch)

1. Which were the first two AI civs to be eliminated? Why them?

Mongols and Aztecs, both would have been troublesome if left alive to cause problems during wars with other civs.

2. Did you use combined arms, or did you focus on one unit type?

Impi/Horsemen stacks basically to prevent horsemen from being weakened on defense.

3. How many of your Workers are native, and how many slaves!?

I have 6 native and 11 slaves, 3 of the native workers were built as most of my slaves were Aztecs and to far away from my core.

925BC Aztec Capitol Falls, renamed Aztec's Folly

875BC Another Aztec town destroyed.

800BC Aztecs down to two towns.

730BC First to Philosophy, took Map Making as freebie. Traded Philosophy to Maya for Construction. Made temporary peace with Aztecs got there remaining towns, they'll be dead as soon as my elite horsemen are healed. I raze the new Aztecs towns as they don't fit into my empire well.

670BC Goodbye Aztecs. Trade Writing to India for 130g and a worker. Trade Writing to France for 150g.

Zululand

105g(-8gtp)
12 towns
7 barracks
1 granary
15 Impi
14 Horsemen(5 elite)
6 Warriors
6 Workers
11 Slaves

[Addled Platypus]

Ahh, the short joy of victory

Mongols went down for the count.


still getting details, more info and screenies to follow

[Addled Platypus]

Score so far

my luck so far

800BC
Traded Alpha/Poly for the Wheel with China needed items to sell to other civs

Oracle built at Ulandi

730BC Intombe and Mpondo built

690BC Mongol City Kazan razed

110 BC Swazi Built

lost and gained a city same city a one point
interlude of peace with all but Mongols

10AD Tegela built
130AD Umata Built

Did not take notes on when I got Philosphy went for Lit

? Traded Phil to French for Currency and Horseback Rididing

Currently working Greta Lighthouse and temple of M
Hope to get at least one of those.

[Addled Platypus]

the map

my world so far

The red dots being several large stacks of Barbaians 6-8 per stack
out of what little shadow areas are left.

Strange how they really dont pick on the other civ workers?


And most of the other civs decide now is a good time to go through my territory..and I have asked them several times to leave, cant declare war on everyone

Should your capital that has a temple and Oracle at size 6 still riot? With about 20 turns to go for GL, I panicked and made a settler (dont hate me).