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  • A new student baring gifts...

    Greetings all,

    As we wait patiently for the AU to officially kick off the semester, I have by chance brought a game to a point with some interesting possibilities. As I sat and contemplated my options, it occurred to me that the situation is at least in keeping with the spirit of the AU if not technically a structured class. So I offer it as perhaps a primer or mini-course if you will. It picks up mid-game with a very specific (and likely immediate) conquest objective, so the time commitment would be relatively small. Might be a good chance to see a few 'brief' AAR/DARs before the full courses hit the forums.

    -If this is just not on the AU's menu right now...no problem...nuking this thread won't hurt my feelings a bit. I'll be back when the official courses start.


    ...So if you're still reading...here is the scenerio....

    Prince/Standard/Normal/6Civs/Continents
    Player=Ghandi
    AI=Montezuma, Victoria, Cyrus, Saladin, Huayna Cupa
    It is currently 1815 AD.

    Relavent history:
    Saladin and Ghandi share a continent. Saladin has less land mass and poorer terrain on average...so he does exactly what he should...attack. Saladin waged two early compaigns against me. The first was a skirmish, but the second was bloody with Saladin taking heavy causualties before retreating. No territory was excanged. There has been peace for a few decades now, but Saladin is falling further behind...war is inevitable I fear.

    Ghandi has the greatest land mass, culture and is fat with resources. Ghandi has a standing army of some 30 or so mixed units(excluding defensive reserves), many left with upgrades from the last war. Its been a decent start for a Prince game. But the Brits and Incans are overtaking the points and tech race. Thusfar I have managed Ghandi as a builder, but to put this one in the HoF I believe its time for the gloves to come off.

    The objective:
    Saladin's head on a pole! If this were SMACX or Civ3, Saladin would have been toast long ago. But I lack experience with this new combat system. That's where you come in. Saladin is ripe for the picking...but can it be done with enough speed and efficiency to maintain a pace with the other powerful civs by end game? If so, by what stratagy? The shape of the map offers multiple possibilities. And lest we forget, both the Aztecs and Incans are aggressive civs with solid infrastructure. They are almost sure to join the mayhem at some point.

    I am primarily interested in the stratagy variations for taking down Saladin and where Ghandi ends up when the dust settles. But if folks want to take it to the end game, fine by me. Have fun!

    BTW: Just for background...I am a long time SMAC/CivX player, but have yet to take any AU courses. I hope to contribute this time around.

    Edit: hmmm, file attachment failure, I'll try again.

    **Important edit: For those wanting to complete the game...Space Race victory is not allowed.

  • #2
    Once again....
    Attached Files

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    • #3
      Good work setting things like this up
      Proud member of the PNY Brigade
      Also a proud member of the The Glory Of War team on PtW-DG

      A.D 300, after 5h of playing DonHomer said: "looks like civ2 could be a good way to kill time if i can get the hang of it :P"

      Comment


      • #4
        Downloaded, might be a few days before I can reply with my experiences though and usually by then there's 5 replies with the exact same stuff I was gonna say, hehe.

        1815 AD, phew gotta work fast, I've been able to finish apollo program by 1900. I think it's gonna end up with Ghandi winning the war and maybe losing to a space race, mmmm.

        Good post, this forum is a ghost town.

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        • #5
          1815 AD, phew gotta work fast, I've been able to finish apollo program by 1900. I think it's gonna end up with Ghandi winning the war and maybe losing to a space race, mmmm.

          Not to worry xxFluxexx, space race victory is not allowed in this game. I have always thought of space race as a cheesy victory for the AI, especially at higher difficulties. The AI is almost always ahead in the tech tree anyway...its going to have to come up with something more than just beating you to the last techs.

          Comment


          • #6
            Ghandi vs. Saladin 1815-1944

            PLAN OF ACTION

            Ghandi will research rifling and astronomy immediately. At this point, pro-war civics will be adopted and all city production will be switched to military units (galleon/rifleman/siege weapon). When 6 galleons have been built, an expeditionary force will be sent to Saladin's northern flank. At the same time, 2 main armies will attack from the south. Military unit production will be maintained for reinforcments until Saladin is eliminated or the war effort can no longer be maintained.

            EVENT SEQUENCE

            Pre-war (1815-1892)

            1830-Ghandi adopts Theocracy and Vassalage
            1835-Golden Age begins for Ghandi
            1862-Victoria takes over 2nd place in points (Ghandi 3rd)
            1866-Industrial Era begins. [Treasury: 1454+69/turn @ 60%R]
            1878-Sorte 6 galleons/2 frigates from Mycenien/Chittagong (13 rifle/3 cannon/2 catapult)
            1892-Pre-war build up complete..troops in position. Techs researched: rifling/astronomy/chemistry/steel/steam power/Sci. method/railroad.

            Combat actions (1894-1930)

            1894-Ghandi declares war on Saladin.
            Khurasan: Commence naval bombardment, and off-load 18 units onto 4 tiles.
            Damascus: Advance with 6 rifles/1 elephant/3 cannons on 3 tiles
            Fustat: Advance with 6 rifles/3 pike/3 elephant/2 spear/2 catapult/1 cannon on 3 tiles.
            Saladin counters with 3 catapults at Fustat.

            1896-Khurasan taken and fortified..advance on Aden and Mecca.
            Fustat taken and fortified..advance on Bagdad. No counter attacks.

            1898-Damascus taken and fortified..advance on Anjar. No counter attacks.

            1904-Bagdad taken and fortified..advance on Medina.
            Aden surrounded/under seige. Pillage resouces on route to Mecca.
            Ghandi surpasses Incans in points lead. [Treasury: 663 +76/turn @50%R]. Saladin begins hit and run counter attacks on wounded/exposed units.

            1906-Aden taken and razed..advance on Mecca.
            Anjar taken and fortified..advance on Najran. No counter attacks.

            1908-Now at 8 turns of war. War weariness is beginning to affect production in larger cities. Resistance ends in Fustat.

            1910-Saladin retakes Khurasan and reinforces Mecca with cavalry. The northern campaign has stalled...remaining troops begin pillage/draw fire tactics.

            1916-Saladin finally sues for peace..offers 30 gold.

            1920-Medina taken and fortified..advance on Najran. Resistance ends in Bagdad and Anjar. [Treasury: 699 +26/turn @50%R] War weariness is doubling production time is some cities and causing population loss. The war effort is becoming unsustainable.

            1926-Montezuma declares war on Ghandi..lands 11knights/1 cannon near Kolhapur. Anjar revolts!

            1930-Najran taken and fortified. Peace offered to Saladin - receive 50 gold. Techs researched: combustion/biology/mil. trad./liberalism/50%of constitution. [Treasury: 226 +8/turn @50%R]

            STATISTICS

            Pre-war / During war
            Turns: 27 / 19
            Techs: 7 (1/3.8 turns) / 4.5(1/4.2 turns)

            Total unit production (1815-1930): 55 (1.2/turn)
            Starting invasion force: 8 naval/11 siege/35 combat(54 total)
            Gold plundered: 1205 (avg. 172/city)
            Cities taken: 7 total, 1 razed, 1 recaptured....net 5 cities.
            %land mass gained: 9.3
            %population gained: 5 (ugh!)

            Causualties Ghandi / Saladin
            Combat 24 / 62
            Naval 2 / 9
            Siege 11 / 11
            Total 37 / 82

            Unit loss ratio: 1:2.2

            2050 Points Race 1815 / 1944 / relative +/-
            Incan 2062 / 2888 / +.71
            Indian 2008 / 2882 / +.69
            England 1968 / 2696 / +.72
            Aztec 1840 / 2351 / +.78
            Persia 1747 / 2387 / +.73
            Arab 1539 / 1403 / -1.09

            DISCUSSION

            War weariness:
            Montezuma's declaration was predicted and hardly a show-stopper. The AI loves to pick off cities on a pennisula whether it can be held or not..this behavior reeks of Civ3. The AI's perception of making gains for itself vs. hurting an opponent is probably one of those problems that gives the Firaxians sleepless nights . Ghandi retook Kolhapur next turn..it should have been razed. BTW, the loss of Kolhapur was the only instance where combat seemed unbalanced. It only took 3 knights and a cannon to take a size 10 city (60% culture defense) defended by 2 fortified machine guns and an archer. Maybe they got trigger happy and over heated the barrels . This campaign was sqelched by war weariness despite having a wealth of +happiness resources. By 16 turns of war, the drag on production and loss of population were to great to sustain. Ghandi lacked the needed buildings (coloseum, etc.) to effectively make use of the cultural slider.

            Diplomacy:
            Diplomacy was non-existant throughout the campaign . Despite repeated attempts, I was never able to make pacts or incite war among other civs. Causing chaos among the AI civs can free up resources and create diversion which is usually benefical. The only thing I didn't try was declaring war on a Civ I wasn't prepared to attack This aspect needs work.

            Stratagy:
            Opening up multiple fronts on a single turn was a devastating tactic in Civ3, especially against superior forces. You could often 'freeze' the AI for several turns thus avoiding effective counter attacks until it was to late. In this case, Saladin went with an 'Alamo' stance...conceding the perimeter cities with token defense and no effective counter attacks early. When I came within site range of Medina and Najran from the south, they had 17 and 14 units respectively . But by this point my northern army was stalled, and Saladin emptied is central garrisons to retake the north. If not for this, my southern advance would likely have ended at Bagdad and Anjar. So my stratagy wasn't a total failure, but the northern force was not strong enough to both take and hold territory. It shoud have been a slash and burn campaign until the southern force linked up.

            Overall this was a fairly poorly executed campaign...I give myself a C-. As we speak, the AI is devoting computing cycles toward how best to carve up the now severely weakened Saladin. If I don't mop up Saladin myself quickly with a second war, I'll likely be facing new neighbors to the north with superior weaponery. And based on the current point totals, my conquests are not enough to secure victory.

            But I am very pleased with the game experience. This was an old 'tried and true' approach. If this had been a push over, it would feel like Civ3 with a new paint job...its not...its Civ4... Firaxis.

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            • #7
              Very well set up course Skatterbone! I am working on it as we speak and sounds challenging. Makes me want to set my own up...
              "You are one of the cheerleaders for this wasting of time and the wasting of lives. Do you feel any remorse for having contributed to this "culture of death?" Of course not. Hey, let's all play MORE games, and ignore all the really productive things to do with our lives.
              Let's pretend to be shocked that a gamer might descend into deeper depression, as his gamer "buds," knowing he was killing himself, couldn't figure out how to call 911 themselves for him. That would have involved leaving their computers I guess."


              - Jack Thompson

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