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  • Neanderthal or Neadertal?

    Neanderthal or Neandertal?
    The first such fossil was discovered in 1856 in the Neander Thal, or "Neander Valley" in German, and became known as "Neanderthal Man". In 1904, German spelling was regularized to be more consistent with pronunciation, and "thal" became "tal". In 1952 Henri Vallois proposed that it should be spelt as the Germans spell it, and the "-tal" spelling has become widely used since then. The "-thal" spelling persists most strongly in England.

    'Neanderthal' can be pronounced with either a 't' or a 'th' sound - both are acceptable and widely used in English. The German pronunciation, however, has always been 't' (German has no 'th' sound).

    None of this affects the taxonomic name of the Neandertals. William King proposed the name Homo neanderthalensis in 1864. Since then, opinion has fluctuated as to whether they should be considered Homo sapiens neanderthalensis (a subspecies of Homo sapiens) or a separate species, Homo neanderthalensis. For the first half of the 20th century, they were usually considered a separate species. For the last few decades they have usually been considered a subspecies, but recently Homo neanderthalensis has been gaining in popularity again. In either case, the 'h' must remain in the name, because the laws governing biological nomenclature forbid changing the spelling.

    It is fascinating to think that, but for a matter of historical chance, we might now be classifying Neandertals as Homo stupidus! (Or, even stranger, Homo sapiens stupidus: "stupid wise man".) Ernst Haeckel created that name in 1866. Fortunately for the Neandertals, who have a bad enough image problem as it is, King's name was published two years earlier and hence has priority. (Wolpoff and Caspari, Race and Human Evolution, 1997, p.271)

    The Neander Tal was named after a minister, Joachim Neumann, who used to take walks there in the late 17th century. Neumann composed many hymns, some of which are still sung today. Wanting to use a Greek pseudonym, Neumann, whose name means "new man", chose "Neander", a translation of his name into Greek. By a strange coincidence, the "New Man Valley" named for him after his death gave its name to a new type of human that was discovered there.

    See also science fiction author Robert Sawyer's page on the 'Neanderthal or Neandertal' question. For my site, I chose the 'Neandertal' spelling, while Sawyer makes a good case for the 'Neanderthal' usage. As he says, it basically comes down to a matter of choice. (I went with 'Neandertal' mainly because Trinkaus and Shipman used it in their excellent book The Neandertals.)
    6
    Neanderthal
    16.67%
    1
    Neandertal
    33.33%
    2
    Who the **** cares?
    33.33%
    2
    We should ask the Neanderwhatsits.
    16.67%
    1
    No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

  • #2
    "t" is the pronunciation I learned from my German (?) nanny
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    • #3
      Yeah, I've been using Neandertal recently on the basis that that's closer to how it's supposed to be pronounced. Not that spelling has ever had a particularly amicable relationship with pronunciation.
      Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
      "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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      • #4
        The CG thread is better.
        Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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        • #5
          Neanderthal or Thal in general for valley is very oldfashioned, Neandertal is the modern form. To add some hilarity Neanderthal is pronounced exactly like Neandertal in German.

          Anyone who confuses the spelling here is thrown into prison for 1 year and gets beaten up at least twice per week during that time.

          Trinkaus = drink up
          Blah

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          • #6
            IMHO it should remain as it is ... i.e. "Homo neanderthalensis".
            After all it was the spelling that was in use at the time the fossils were discovered near Düsseldorf.
            It only causes additional confusion if species names get changed everytime the spelling of their parent word gets changed.
            Tamsin (Lost Girl): "I am the Harbinger of Death. I arrive on winds of blessed air. Air that you no longer deserve."
            Tamsin (Lost Girl): "He has fallen in battle and I must take him to the Einherjar in Valhalla"

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            • #7
              I have said that africans are pure homo sapiens that's why they are calm.

              Europeans have a degree of neaderdal that's why they are agressive ****s

              But as zorba said

              Man is a brute [...] It seems everything's been too easy for you, but you ask me! A brute, I tell you! If you're cruel to him, he respects and fears you. If you're kind to him, he plucks your eyes out.

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              • #8
                It's also a huge pain in the ass if you're searching a database for the term - a lot of times search engines for things like academic publications suck at handling booleans or "misspellings"
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Proteus_MST View Post
                  IMHO it should remain as it is ... i.e. "Homo neanderthalensis".
                  After all it was the spelling that was in use at the time the fossils were discovered near Düsseldorf.
                  It only causes additional confusion if species names get changed everytime the spelling of their parent word gets changed.
                  I see a crusade coming launched by the forces of -tal to teach those -thal heathens the only evar right spelling
                  Blah

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                  • #10
                    I dont think they care

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by loinburger View Post
                      "t" is the pronunciation I learned from my German (?) nanny
                      Did she have a little toothbrush mustache?
                      No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

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