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Thread: The Peyton Manning debate

  1. #91
    Al B. Sure!
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Jrabbit View Post
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    Denver seems like a stretch to me, with young (but good) receivers and a dodgy running game.
    Tennessee has a go-to WR (Britt) and Chris Johnson. Plus, Manning is adored in Tennessee.

    Tennessee's O-line is rated much higher, both in the running game and in pass protection.
    Tennessee's defense game up significantly fewer points, and yardage was basically a toss-up between the two.

    Assuming Manning wants to get back to the Super Bowl, seems like the Titans are a lot closer. Not sure what Peyton sees in Denver, unless it's just someone to force the bidding as high as possible. There must be something I'm missing.
    I think it's the John Elway mystique, combined with Peyton's liking of John Fox, that is keeping Denver in the picture.

    But I'm sure Peyton likes the thought of facing the Colts twice a year with the Titans.
    Last edited by Al B. Sure!; March 16, 2012 at 14:36.
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    Imran Siddiqui
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    Apparently the 49ers with their $20 million under the cap have jumped in. And the entire league has just shat a brick.
    I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.
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    The dark horse 49ers have emerged!

    Even before he worked out for the Denver Broncos on Friday, Peyton Manning threw passes for the San Francisco 49ers and underwent a physical exam earlier this week, according to league sources.
    Damn, Imran! Beat me by a minute!
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    Btw, how scared are you of that happening?
    I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.
    - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Imran Siddiqui View Post
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    Btw, how scared are you of that happening?
    Pssh. My team is the reigning SB champs. I wasn't expecting a repeat this coming season.

    Peyton Manning to Randy Moss, though...
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

  6. #96
    Imran Siddiqui
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    .. what about the next few years?
    I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.
    - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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    It appears that Denver can only offer $60MM/5years with their cap issues. That's probably a problem.

    Adam Shefter reports that the Cardinals have been advised to proceed as if they will not get Manning.

    SF would be pretty scary with a real QB.
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  8. #98
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    Sucks for Alex Smith. Like Tebow, he earned his place (hell, to be honest, Hasselbeck balled out and earned starting consideration for next year), but that won't matter now.
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    Most even semi-contenders have QBs that earned their place.

    But San Fran likely saw losing in overtime in the NFC Championship Game and their starting QB went 12/26 for 196 yards and imagined what if Peyton Manning was under center instead.
    I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.
    - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

  10. #100
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    I think with Peyton under center for the 49ers that I might have to go to Vegas and put a little down on their Super Bowl chances.
    "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imran Siddiqui View Post
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    It's like a homecoming for one
    You have no idea. There has been little else discussed anywhere in the state since this became a real possibility. I would love to see Peyton back in Tennessee myself, but it is like the second coming going on around here.
    "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

  12. #102
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    Arizona is out.

    Cardinals out of Manning chase

    Coach Ken Whisenhunt says Peyton Manning "no longer an option" for Cardinals. Team to pay QB Kolb $7 million bonus.
    7 million will soothe hurt feelings.
    Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
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    Broncos reportedly offered $90million 5 year deal.Article is from the Denverpost.com.

    Looks like they have Manning Fever too:

    This article is the:
    #1 most-clicked article of the hour
    #1 most-clicked article of the day
    #1 most-clicked article among Colorado readers of the day
    #1 most-clicked article among Colorado readers of the hour
    #1 most-clicked article among readers outside Colorado of the day
    #1 most-clicked article among readers outside Colorado of the hour
    #1 most-clicked article among Denver readers


    Read more: Broncos meeting with Peyton Manning, offering roughly $90 million over 5 years - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_...#ixzz1pKQVCcZl
    Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: http://www.denverpost.com/termsofuse
    Last edited by PLATO; March 16, 2012 at 20:17.
    "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

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    $90MM/5 yrs is the same deal he had in Indy. That's said to be the baseline buy-in to be in the conversation.
    Manning is said to be willing to offer the teams protection in case his neck issues resurface.
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    One thing in common among the finalists, all 3 have young QB's that could benefit greatly from Manning being there. It's not just Tebow.
    Alex Smith is still young. Jake Locker could surely use him being around. Matt Hasselbeck is OK, but he's no Peyton Manning.
    Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
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    Too bad being young and playing under Peyton Manning didn't do Jim Sorgi and Curtis Painter much good.
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    Curtis Painter didn't really have the same scenario, and to cite Jim Sorgi illustrates Ming's point in his recent argument with you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlowwHand View Post
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    Curtis Painter didn't really have the same scenario, and to cite Jim Sorgi illustrates Ming's point in his recent argument with you.
    What point? He called me a jackass. What is being a jackass about citing Jim Sorgi?
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    You mean other than never really doing anything? Of course, he met expectations. There really weren't any.
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    Al B. Sure!
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlowwHand View Post
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    You mean other than never really doing anything? Of course, he met expectations. There really weren't any.
    A drafted player out of Division I Wisconsin, Sorgi's stock was about comparable as Curtis Painter's. Both had low expectations, much lower than Tebow's or Jake Locker's, but let's not imagine that being on the bench behind Peyton Manning means you learn and improve or that Peyton is a good teacher/mentor. There's been no evidence for it so far, since neither Painter nor Sorgi have shown anything.

    But Sorgi hasn't even played to show if he's good or bad, you ask? Well, as a FA, Sorgi would've had the opportunity to compete for a starting job somewhere if he were that good because scouts and teams would have seen it. Matt Schaub played as sparingly as Sorgi did but he was seen as being starting caliber. Charlie Whitehurst never even set foot on the field yet the Seahawks were (wrongly) confident enough to trade to get him and pay him. If Sorgi had shown he was even starting caliber, he would have signed on to compete for a starting job somewhere. Instead, only the Manning connection could save him and he signed briefly with the Giants as a backup.

    Whoever is behind Peyton Manning wherever he goes may learn, improve, and/or Peyton may be a great mentor (his mentoring could be independent of the ability of his mentee; a teacher's effectiveness can be limited by the student's capacity; maybe Sorgi and Painter just suck?)... but there's been no evidence thus far that playing behind Peyton does a QB any good.


    Summary:
    Just because a guy is elite doesn't mean he is an effective teacher. Peyton may be or he may not be. You can't assume he is because the evidence isn't there, yet. No one has come out of Peyton's tutelage and excelled.

    I am not saying he's a bad teacher. I'm just saying he's not yet proven to be a good teacher.

    Therefore, I provided a counter-point to your statement that Locker/Tebow/Smith could benefit greatly from Peyton. If that makes me a jackass, I don't know what to say to you.
    Last edited by Al B. Sure!; March 17, 2012 at 18:03.
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    Mentoring? Please. I seriously doubt Peyton Manning has any intentions other than to play every down.

    I'm mystified by the suggestion that Manning was "mentoring" the likes of Painter and Sorgi. It's pretty inane to judge him on the supposed results of "tutelage" that he was almost certainly not doing. Regardless, I sincerely doubt this has any bearing on the signing.

    At the dollars he commands, Peyton Manning will be signed to do one thing only: play.
    Last edited by -Jrabbit; March 17, 2012 at 19:26.
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Jrabbit View Post
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    Mentoring? Please. I seriously doubt Peyton Manning has any intentions other than to play every down.

    I'm mystified by the suggestion that Manning was "mentoring" the likes of Painter and Sorgi. It's pretty inane to judge him on the supposed results of "tutelage" that he was almost certainly not doing. Regardless, I sincerely doubt this has any bearing on the signing.

    At the dollars he commands, Peyton Manning will be signed to do one thing only: play.
    I agree. Which is why I don't think Tebow/Smith/Locker will benefit much from this. Thanks for agreeing with me, Jrabbit

    We have seen mentoring take place, in the league, though. Usually it comes from a veteran backup who doesn't have to prepare 24/7 for games and can actually help the young starter. Mark Brunell has mentored Mark Sanchez, for example.

    A guy like Peyton Manning has too much work to do for himself than give thought to training another guy. If Sorgi/Painter have learned anything it was through observation, not instruction.
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    Rumor has it that Alex Smith is changing agents. His previous agent, Tom Condon, is also Peyton Manning's agent.
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    He doesn't have to say a ****ing word, if he doesn't want to. Watching him up close and personal would be better than who they've had to watch. Other than that, I couldn't disagree more that he would reject the role of mentor.
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    Letting the qb2/qb3 watch you work is not mentoring. And all I'm saying is that it's not part of the signing discussion.
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    One thing I didn't even realize was that Jim Harbaugh-Peyton Manning connection. Jim Harbaugh started 11 games for the 1997 Indianapolis Colts, his 4th year as their QB. Peyton Manning was drafted that May and Harbaugh was traded to the Ravens.

    Harbaugh wound up coaching at Stanford where he coached Andrew Luck... who will be replacing Manning.

    And now, Manning may be playing under Harbaugh.


    Have we just been inceptioned?
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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    This just posted...

    ESPN's Adam Schefter reports free agent Peyton Manning will sign with the Broncos "barring an unexpected snag in contract talks."

    According to Schefter, Manning has directed his agent to "get a deal done with Denver." The move should soon become official. It will have wide-ranging effects across the NFL, as Denver is now expected to shop Tim Tebow while free agent Alex Smith will likely re-sign with the 49ers. From a talent standpoint, no team was offering Manning more than the 49ers, but Denver can offer a strong running game, and has a young No. 1 receiver in place in Demaryius Thomas. Outside a dome and surrounded by less familiar faces than he's used to, a 36-year-old Manning shouldn't be expected to match his historic pre-2011 production, but is still a veritable lock for top-five numbers. The move makes Denver the immediate favorites in a weak AFC West, and elevates them into the top two or three teams in the AFC.

    Source: Adam Schefter on Twitter
    Mar 19 - 11:55 AM
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    Now, if Smith signs with Miami, SF will have just pissed on their boots. That muffled sound you hear is Mario Manningham sobbing in a corner.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlowwHand View Post
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    Now, if Smith signs with Miami, SF will have just pissed on their boots. That muffled sound you hear is Mario Manningham sobbing in a corner.
    Don't forget Randy Moss!

    But no unless Smith pulls a Jay Cutler and whines like a baby, Harbaugh will give Smith a fruit-basket and he'll resign with San Fran.

    Now where will Tebow wind up? Miami? Jacksonville?
    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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