Thread for people to explain how immigrants take jobs

[Tupac Shakur]

If it makes you feel any better, I'm never amazed by your ****ty sense of humor. ...

Given that I'm only the butt of ~20% of your "jokes" yet I find 100% of your posts mind-numbingly dull I don't think that's it.

It's not his fault, dude.

[Dinner]

By the way, there is strong evidence that recent immigrants DO negatively impact the earnings of less-recent immigrants. Because they ARE close substitutes for each other.

In other words, because they're both low skilled workers exactly as I said? If you have more people competing for the same job (like dry waller or gardener or what ever) then the price of someone doing those jobs goes down. Don't try to wiggle out of this because you're wrong and I'm right and even you know it. You can throw around all the personal attacks you want but the supply and demand curve does exist and you're simply wrong (at least over the short to medium term where the market is trying to reach a new equilibrium state). Sure, it would be nice if you'd man up and admit you're wrong but I'm not going to hold my breath. It sure would be nice to hear for once though I suspect you'll have difficulty actually admitting it.

[Kidlicious]

If peer-reviewed studies can't reveal much truth then there's little hope for statements like "immigrant gets the job, you don't, any questions?" made be semi-literate accountants. People who assume a static number of "jobs" while not providing any reasons for their assumption deserve to be unemployed.

What I said was a simple truth. I amazed that you failed to understand it. Hint: I never said the number of jobs is static.

[Dinner]

KH can back track all he wants but he claimed additional competition for a job doesn't decrease wages. He's completely wrong and, as usual, he's refusing to admit he's wrong and even worse he's name calling to avoid admitting he was wrong. Just man up and admit you were wrong already. It's not hard. Grab your balls and do it.

[Dinner]

Bringing in lots of low skilled workers does depress wages for other low skilled workers and that happens almost immediately.

There is very little evidence of this actually happening.

Stop name calling and man up. You were wrong, you're still wrong. Get over yourself and admit it.

[Kidlicious]

I can't believe an educated person would say competition doesn't decrease wages.

[Dinner]

I should change my sig to keep track of how many days KH has avoided manning up on this one. He'll likely keep calling people ***** though and avoid the question when he really could just man up, admit he was obviously wrong, and move on with life. It's just not that hard and shows some character.

[Tupac Shakur]

God, the coming smackdown is going to be fun.

[Kidlicious]

What about the Law of Supply? No evidence?

[Dinner]

God, the coming smackdown is going to be fun.

Thank you for proving, once again, that you're a complete ****, Drake. You don't even understand what the argument is about because you're a mental midget who just posts one liners most of which are nonanalogous and wrong. In short, you're a ****** and you need to go back to your original login and own your retardedness.

For everyone else. So far KH has said low skilled native born workers and low skilled immigrant workers have different supply and demand curves but once someone actually looks at reality instead of theory, he's wrong. If someone works as a hauler who cleans wood scraps from construction sites it doesn't matter if he's inbreed white trash who's family has been here for 300 years or a Mexican or a Vietnamese immigrant. As long as he can pick up the trash and put it in the back of the truck they're competiting for the same job and the extra competition does immediately drive down wages. You can say the same for virtually all low skilled jobs (which is exactly what I said). Supply and demand does not stop being real and even if we're talking about dentists increased supply does decrease wages all things being equal.

As I said, over the long term the increased work force (and lower prices) can help attract more employers or create more work opportunities but it takes time for the new equalibrium to be reached so, yes, it has an immediate negative effect if you're the white trash trying to work a low skilled job and a flood of immigrants come in thus making you compete harder for each job (either by lowering wages or increasing service in some way). Rather then admitting he's wrong, admitting supply and demand is real (and that no losers don't all have their own separate curves nor does national origin matter when it comes to low skilled manual jobs because if you're the dog **** picker upper and suddenly 400 new dog **** picker uppers suddenly show up in your town then there is a lot more competition for picking up dog ****.

Speaking of dog ****, man up and admit you were wrong already. Just be honest and do it.

[Tupac Shakur]

[Dinner]

On the upside it's not like Drake can become a poster of any less substance so we can't point out he's looking like even more of a fool than usual. Stupid is par for the course for Drake.

[Tupac Shakur]

On the upside it's not like Drake can become a poster of any less substance so we can't point out he's looking like even more of a fool than usual. Stupid is par for the course for Drake.

Jesus, this is just abysmal writing.

[Uncle Sparky]

So in my home province of Manitoba, we have immigrants taking jobs all over the spectrum.
Many rural small towns have doctors who started their careers in South America, southeast Asia, South Africa and the Indian subcontinent - my doctor is from India. We actually have a booming furniture manufacturing industry, with many craftsmen from eastern Europe and South America. We have German & French cheesemakers. We have recently had a large influx of 'PIGS' in our construction industries.
And on the far end of the spectrum, many nice households have Filipina housekeepers/nannies.

Manitoba has had a difficult time keeping rural doctors, so immigrants are filling positions. People with special skills, such as craftsmen, brewers & cheesemakers fill positions Canadians cannot. Others fill positions (domestic, construction) positions Manitobans do not want to do.

Chances are, if you are in Canada or the US, you are descended from immigrants who 'took jobs' from people already here. If your family goes back a few hundred years in North America, you are descended from genocidal immigrants who took lives.

[KrazyHorse]

In other words, because they're both low skilled workers exactly as I said?

No, you ****ing idiot. What I said was that low skilled native workers and low skilled immigrants are apparently not close substitutes for each other, while low skilled recent immigrants are close substitutes for low skilled previous immigrants. This is not something that can be determined without some sort of empirical measurement, because placing everybody along one axis ("skill") is insufficiently granular; it disguises substantial heterogeneity.

If you have more people competing for the same job (like dry waller or gardener or what ever) then the price of someone doing those jobs goes down.

Yes, and the price of every other job goes up. The whole point of claiming that low sill native workers and immigrants are not close substitutes for each other, as evidenced by data, is that the low-skill native workers are suited for jobs where they do not have to compete directly with the immigrants. Again, this is not something that a fatuous **** like yourself can somehow intuit based on first principles. It is necessary to collect empirical evidence for this.

Don't try to wiggle out of this because you're wrong and I'm right and even you know it.

This precise question is something that has been widely studied by economists. Unlike you, most of them are not intellectually dishonest cretins whose entire existence appears to be dedicated to reinforcing their priors through liberal use of willful stupidity. They have come to the conclusions I've already presented, through use of empirical techniques, as there are no a priori arguments which provide strong reasons to believe anything about the overall impact on real wages of any given group (other than other low-skill immigrants, who can reasonably be believed to be relatively homogeneous with each other).

You can throw around all the personal attacks you want

Thanks, you ****ing ****, I will.

but the supply and demand curve does exist

Many supply curves and many demand curves exist, even in the low-skill labor market in the US. What you need to know about these curves in order to decide ANYTHING about the impact on the real wages of low-skill native-born Americans is: their demand curves for low-skill labor provided by immigrants, the overall demand curve for this labor, the demand curve of immigrants for low-skill labor provided by native workers, the overall demand curve for this labor, the supply curve of low-skill native labor and the supply curve for low-skill immigrant labor. None of these things are known, and all of them are shifting constantly. Again, empirical evidence demonstrates that the impact to low-skill native workers is minimal.

and you're simply wrong (at least over the short to medium term where the market is trying to reach a new equilibrium state)

You can keep repeating it, but it doesn't make you right; it just demonstrates what an intellectually dishonest ass-bandit you are. It is an empirical question, and the literature on it has spoken already.