Xbox 360 or PS3?

[mrboo123]

I'm planning on finally joining the current gen of consoles, now that I have a monitor that be used for the PC and consoles. The games I plan on playing on the console of choices are sports, racing sim, rockband/guitar hero and adventure/RPGs. If I got any FPS, it would be for the PC. Online is nice, but not extremely important.

What does poly think is right for me?

[Asher]

360 has the biggest and best game selection, and almost always the best version of multiplatform games. But Xbox Live is not free to play online games.

PS3 has less selection with free online games, and usually slightly inferior multiplatform versions of games.

IMHO 360 is the best gaming console, PS3 is behind it.

[DrSpike]

360 exclusives have been better, but PS3 starting to fight back. Sports & Rock Band/GH are multi-platform so no issue there (I'd say most multi-platform games any difference is very minimal so wouldn't base a decision on that) but for racing you have Forza 3 on the 360 compared to GT5 being released in 2010 on the PS3. As Asher says, Live is better for online gaming but will cost around £30 a year, and you don't seem to be that worried about MP.

Only a complete fanboy would fail to mention that the 360 has historically been very unreliable. But reports around the later models are that failure rates are lower, and MS have been really good about replacing consoles.

If I had to choose today, I'd go for the 360 (again).

[Asher]

The 360's historical reliability for consoles that have not been in production for two years, combined with the fact that those failures are covered by a 3-year warranty (vs 1 year on the PS3) makes that point extremely ridiculous. There exist class-action lawsuits pertaining to PS3 failures as well, and they're not as rare as you may think. Quite a few people at Beyond3D have had the "yellow light of death" on their PS3s.

You may as well mention the PS2's notorious unreliability in the same breath, as it's just as relevant.

[Wiglaf]

extremely ridiculous.

[DrSpike]

I think it's a perfectly reasonable point to make in this discussion. And I also mentioned that the later models are more reliable (though still not as reliable as one would hope).

[Asher]

I think it's a perfectly reasonable point to make in this discussion. And I also mentioned that the later models are more reliable (though still not as reliable as one would hope).

I'm curious, just where are you getting these numbers on the latest reliability statistics?

The latest have only been out under a year with the new motherboard, CPU, GPU, and cooling system. There ARE no numbers public.

DrSpike

It's fine to say previous models with completely different motherboards and older, hotter/more power hungry CPUs and GPUs with inferior cooling systems were not reliable. No one disputes this. But to make up bullshit on a brand new design with no reliability numbers public is quite another.

[Asher]

http://www.blasteroids.com/news/news...aretrade_study

Perhaps more notably, the report concludes that the new "Jasper" based Xbox 360s, which began shipping in late 2008, have almost completely killed RROD, and SquareTrade expects the failure rate to continue to fall as 2009 continues.

While they didn't start shipping til very late (Nov? 08) they weren't available in widespread retail presence til Feb '09 because all of the '08 Holiday stuff was built long in advance.

[mrboo123]

360 exclusives have been better, but PS3 starting to fight back. Sports & Rock Band/GH are multi-platform so no issue there (I'd say most multi-platform games any difference is very minimal so wouldn't base a decision on that) but for racing you have Forza 3 on the 360 compared to GT5 being released in 2010 on the PS3. As Asher says, Live is better for online gaming but will cost around £30 a year, and you don't seem to be that worried about MP.

Only a complete fanboy would fail to mention that the 360 has historically been very unreliable. But reports around the later models are that failure rates are lower, and MS have been really good about replacing consoles.

If I had to choose today, I'd go for the 360 (again).

I've had experinces with both franchises. GT4 (PS2) was pretty good, but the braindead AI killed it for me. Also the license started to get annoying.

Forza 2 AI seemed to be much better, but I only got a few hours into it. Could be just as braindead as the cars get better.

But basically there isn't much console exclusive games out there (not mention Nintendo).

Also, I know of the red ring of death, also just read on the yellow light of death.

[Asher]

The bottom line is if you buy a PS3 or 360 today, they have virtually identical reliability.

This is why I didn't mention this in the thread, as it's a red herring and completely irrelevant to someone buying a new console in December 09 or later. DrSpike apparently doesn't know what he's talking about, but I, for one, am not surprised.

[DrSpike]

Odd that you can make such an unequivocal statement when as you've said above there are no stats.

In contrast all I said was that there are (obviously informal) reports the newer models are more reliable, but that failures are still occuring. To what degree it's not yet clear. I'm not sure why this is so hard for you to accept. It's like you take any implied criticism of MS personally.

[Asher]

Odd that you can make such an unequivocal statement when as you've said above there are no stats.

There are no real stats. Just estimations.

However, knowing what we do about the cause of the problems and what's changed in the Jasper models, it's very reasonable to assume it's been solved. All anecdotal evidence and third-party estimations all coincide with this.

To claim reliability is still not where we'd like it vs the PS3 is horseshit, and if you knew what you were talking about you'd know it.

You're wrong. Man up.

[Asher]

Odd that you can make such an unequivocal statement when as you've said above there are no stats.

There are no real stats. Just estimations.

However, knowing what we do about the cause of the problems and what's changed in the Jasper models, it's very reasonable to assume it's been solved. All anecdotal evidence and third-party estimations all coincide with this.

To claim reliability is still not where we'd like it vs the PS3 is horseshit, and if you knew what you were talking about you'd know it.

You're wrong. Man up.

All reasonable reports have shown the RROD issues are, for all intents and purposes, gone. The "informal reports" you are citing are all just going to be random people claiming they've had RRODs. When you're talking about many millions of consoles, having a couple here and there does not constitute a trend or is in any way statistically significant.

Go squirm some more. You know I enjoy it.

[DrSpike]

I haven't made any comparative statements versus the PS3 - I think you need to read more carefully.

I said that the newer 360 models seem more reliable, but there are still failures, even if not RROD. There was a spate of e74 errors earlier this year that go beyond the occasional person out of millions just experiencing standard hardware failure. I've seen claims this is fixed now too - but frankly given the history, and the fact by definition 1 year+ tests cannot have occured, I'm waiting until there's more data before blithely assuming MS are totally on top of the failure issues.

This is called healthy scepticism. Honestly, it's like MS have you on retainer.

[Asher]

I haven't made any comparative statements versus the PS3 - I think you need to read more carefully.

I think you need to read more carefully. Look at the subject of the thread. When you're discussing either console in a thread which is asking for a comparison of the two, the comparison is implicit.

You know, I'm so right that it hurts. You refuse to admit you are wrong. Whatever. It should be clear to everyone reading what just happened, and I was On Top.

[DrSpike]

I think it's pretty clear to anyone that cares (probably no one) that I have a healthy scepticism, and you are an unquestioning fanboy.

[Asher]

More accurately, you don't comprehend computer engineering, thermal dynamics, or what caused the errors in the first place and how the Jasper version fixes them.

[Nikolai]

If you mainly want games, go for the 360. If you mainly want it for its bluray capabilities and media server functionality, go for the PS3.

[DrSpike]

More accurately, you don't comprehend computer engineering, thermal dynamics, or what caused the errors in the first place and how the Jasper version fixes them.

More accurately, I don't have your blind faith that all is now well, after several years of very high failure rates. Perhaps the people at MS who designed the 360 in the first place were also ignorant of the computer engineering and thermal dynamics?

There are good early signs sure - but MS still have everything to prove on this issue.

You are just so blinkered.

[Asher]

It's not blind faith. All signs point to it being the case. This is from feedback from the repair centres, all studies available, results of various informal polls on forums I've seen over the year, an understanding of what caused the original problems and how and why Jasper fixed it.

And yes, the people at ATI (not MS) who designed the interconnects for the GPU and its cooling system did not adequately understand thermodynamics. It required a substantial redesign of the GPU and how it connects, and this was not done until Jasper. All earlier variants of the 360 mitigated the issue by keeping additional heat away from the GPU (by shrinking and cooling the CPU, giving it an independent HSF, etc but these were all bandaids).

So, for the simpletons out there, the reason why the reliability argument is not relevant here is because all signs point to the 360s on the shelves now being just as reliable as the PS3s. We know this from independent studies (sourced in this article), anecdotal evidence, and scientific knowledge as to the cause and fix for the RROD issue.

The summary here is DrSpike did not know what he was talking about. His comment would've been true a year ago, but not now. The rest of this thread has been him trying to squirm out of admitting he was wrong. Now he's relying simply on the argument that "because the earlier revisions of the 360 had issues, we can't know that the new one is different". That is to say, his argument is based on nothing but **** he pulls out of his ass and pretends is a relevant piece for discussion.

[fed1943]

Sorry for disturbing you. I know nothing of computers and never had a console.
My only chance is to pay close attention to the words of experts.
What is actually a console? Is it a computer, but more limited?
Has the console some technical specialization over a normal computer?
Or its field is a legal one, getting contracts of exclusive with some software,
mostly games. What I heard from publicity seems the last, since when they say
a console is good, say nothing about the console itself, instead speak of some
games.
Can someone please teach me?
My thanks in advance.

[DrSpike]

It's not blind faith. All signs point to it being the case. This is from feedback from the repair centres, all studies available, results of various informal polls on forums I've seen over the year, an understanding of what caused the original problems and how and why Jasper fixed it.

And yes, the people at ATI (not MS) who designed the interconnects for the GPU and its cooling system did not adequately understand thermodynamics. It required a substantial redesign of the GPU and how it connects, and this was not done until Jasper. All earlier variants of the 360 mitigated the issue by keeping additional heat away from the GPU (by shrinking and cooling the CPU, giving it an independent HSF, etc but these were all bandaids).

So, for the simpletons out there, the reason why the reliability argument is not relevant here is because all signs point to the 360s on the shelves now being just as reliable as the PS3s. We know this from independent studies (sourced in this article), anecdotal evidence, and scientific knowledge as to the cause and fix for the RROD issue.

I hope you are right, I really do. Time and actual data 1 year+ will tell, for those of us who aren't willing to unquestioningly swallow that 'it's different this time'.

[mrboo123]

If you mainly want games, go for the 360. If you mainly want it for its bluray capabilities and media server functionality, go for the PS3.

thats my generally feeling about the 2 consoles too. Considering I don't watch much movies, another point for the 360.

What is actually a console? Is it a computer, but more limited?

Historically, a console is just a computer that is specifically design to play video games. The PS2 and original XBox (I think) where the 1st to do any thing besides that, having the ability to play DVDs. The current gen of consoles are now trying to be more of a general media hub.

Has the console some technical specialization over a normal computer?

I think the biggest difference is that a console can focus all of its resources to just game play, while a PC also has to run the OS and any other programs your running.

Or its field is a legal one, getting contracts of exclusive with some software,
mostly games. What I heard from publicity seems the last, since when they say
a console is good, say nothing about the console itself, instead speak of some
games.
Can someone please teach me?
My thanks in advance.

Reason why people always talk about the games for a console is that games have to be design and programmed for separate console, the console's OSs, the console's controllers etc.

If consoles where more like a DVD/Blue Ray player, where any game could be played on any console, then the biggest deciding factor would be the actual performance of the console.

Hope that helps.

[johnwall]

360 or ps3? I don't want to waste my money on these 2 consoles.. I'd rather buy a new or upgrade my PC. Just my 2 cents.

[Jon Miller]

I would get a PS3 now, because of my interest in DUST514.

JM

[Nikolai]

Ps3 is the best media center, Xbox is the best gaming console.

[Elok]

Historically, a console is just a computer that is specifically design to play video games. The PS2 and original XBox (I think) where the 1st to do any thing besides that, having the ability to play DVDs. The current gen of consoles are now trying to be more of a general media hub.

Not that it matters at this point, but the PS1 and Saturn could play music CDs as well as games.

[OzzyKP]

I am considering a PS3. It probably won't happen since I don't really want to spend the money on either the console or the games, but... maybe. Turns out lots of my friends have one, and since it is free to play online... maybe.

[Michel Ponting]

My favorite is the PS3 simply because you can still get all these amazing games on it. It's a decent price. Its generally a really good console.

[aadamjohnsons]

Although most of people like Play station gaming console for playing games I rather prefer xbox 360 console. It is more compatible and customisable gaming console than PS3. Moreover it provide wide variety of amazing games.