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Making Cradle 3+ fully compatible with the Apolyton Edition

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  • So yes, I checked out your art site, and it has some interesting stuff. Kind of "M.C. Escher meets the Mandala", lol. Kudos to you for following an artistic path. It's undoubtedly fulfilling, but I can't imagine that "easy" is part of the equation. As a personal aside, I recently took the plunge and bought a small ranch on a river in southern New Mexico. LOTS of manual labor needed to resurrect a neglected gem, but working with your hands all day long is its own reward. Modding is kind of a relief after spending a week getting well water running properly and bringing 50 year old windows back to life!

    Anyway, to answer a few questions:

    1) Yes, the Source Code version of the game works with the GOG download. The SC guys did some amazing work and there's a great deal of additional functionality (over and above bug killing), and I've endeavored to make use of that. Unfortunately, it wasn't a seamless effort, and a few new bugs were created (I've highlighted several of them in this thread), but overall the game is now extremely stable.

    2) This mod is focused on a single version of Cradle 3 (Phoenix?), so I can't really speak to the rest. The main purpose was to get one version of Cradle running perfectly in synch with the Source Code version of the CTP2.exe. As you can well imagine, trying to convert multiple versions simultaneously would have been an exercise in frustration.

    3) I like a lot of what was done in Cradle 4, and while I know the Mongol/China scenario was near and dear to your heart, that was a "bridge too far" (and then some) for this project. That said, I did incorporate some elements of Cradle 4, but not all. I REALLY like the effort you made to give a different look (units in particular) to the various civs, especially the non-horse approach for the Ancient American civs. However, that was something I looked at as a "next version" project, as the level of complexity was beyond the immediate goals of this one. That said, if you do not have access to the "Horse" good? Kiss cavalry goodbye!

    As for the AI? Well, its definitely better, and on higher difficulty levels it will punish a careless player. In my experience it is really good on defense, and with enough advantages it can grind the human down (which isn't a lot of fun, actually). One of my main focuses has been on been on the "special attacks", and I can assure you the AI is REALLY good at using those. The whole spectrum. Not war winning stuff, of course, but it keeps the human player on his toes.

    In the final analysis, everyone has a different goal in games like these, but for me it isn't "winning the game". I enjoy the discovery of new terrain, meeting new civs and figuring them out, and the eternal quest for new Advances and building cool wonders. As the man once said, "it's the journey, not the destination", and I'm hoping that the new Cradle will be a visual feast and a source of great fun along the way. My current set of projects are new and improved "visible wonders", and greater variation amongst the food/commerce/mining tile improvements. Look at the posts showing all the new ocean-related TIMPs, and it will give you some idea of what's to come.
    To La Fayette, as fine a gentleman as ever trod the Halls of Apolyton

    From what I understand of that Civ game of yours, it's all about launching one's own spaceship before the others do. So this is no big news after all: my father just beat you all to the stars once more. - Philippe Baise


    • Thanks for looking at my site. Everything is for sale too…

      Your life sounds interesting. It seems that you are doing what you want to do too.l went to NM several times as a kid (on our way to AZ), but now with a camera in hand, that would be a cool place to take photos.

      When my computer crashed, l lost all of my working CTP files, including all of the base art templates and the templates for the videos. I had backed everything up too, but that drive also crashed. All told, it was a lot of hours of lost work, which is a shame because l could have sent you those graphic files. My job in the early 2000s had a lot of downtime, so that was how l filled the time. Getting paid for Modwork was a nice side benefit, and l will be honest….it was a LOT of downtime.

      What l did enjoy about the modding process was incorporating a bit of history into the Mod. I was always drawn to Ancient history, and l tried as much as possible to get the details right. One of my favorites was incorporating Golden Ages in each civ as well as the Genghis Khan sceneries with all of the Great Leaders (children and grandchildren of Khans family). And trying to get my tech tree to make sense…

      As for playing, how you play is how l played….exploring, researching, tying all my cities together and then trying to coordinate my thinly spread forces to counter incoming enemy stacks. I tended to play defensively as opposed to aggressive offensive, but that is my personality.

      I noticed in one of your comments that you are still dealing with long time lags. That was something l had noticed, although l though it had to do with the goody huts.
      Yes, let's be optimistic until we have reason to be otherwise...No, let's be pessimistic until we are forced to do otherwise...Maybe, let's be balanced until we are convinced to do otherwise. -- DrSpike, Skanky Burns, Shogun Gunner


      • It is unfortunate that you lost all the templates and base files - that would have been helpful, although I've had to create my own versions along the way. Even though this new mod features a TON of new art, it's not anything I have a natural gift for. More of a mechanic than an artist, although the end result is usually "good enough". If nothing else, I have a keen eye for "what looks crappy", so I've been judicious in borrowing from other mods. Totally agree that many of the AOM units were painful to look at, although I've been able to fix a few of them.

        As for the time lags, the Source Code (SC) version fixed the goody hut lag, so it's no longer a factor. In the post you refer to, I was talking about the effect of the "Frenzy" slic file. Without that, an entire AI turn (12 civs) takes about 30 seconds, and that is consistent down to 0 AD (and thus probably beyond). Anyway, I'm currently back in civilization for a while, and hence able to work on the mod again. Should have some fun new stuff to announce soon.

        Oh, one more thing. The number of changes has been so extensive that this version of Cradle has progressed far beyond "3 plus", and since v4 is already taken, I'm probably going to call it "v5", unless you object.
        To La Fayette, as fine a gentleman as ever trod the Halls of Apolyton

        From what I understand of that Civ game of yours, it's all about launching one's own spaceship before the others do. So this is no big news after all: my father just beat you all to the stars once more. - Philippe Baise