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  • #16
    Gateway's Crazy Idea, Part 3

    Conclusion

    The above is a simple overview of the research model I prefer. I realize it may sound quiet complex and perhaps confusing, thanks to my semi-coherent writing, I must note that most of the mechanics are "under the hood," i.e. the players won't see.

    From a player's perspective, he/she will know only a few things:
    1) The tech tree vary from time to time, there is no one golden path that would always work, as the pre-quisites may change from time to time. This makes the game more repayable.
    2) It is not beneficial to rush funding a research project, unless it is absolutely necessary. Putting all the eggs in one basket can have serious consequences should a roadblock occurs.
    3) Do not trust the estimates I see on the research screen whole heartedly. They are there to give me some idea of the time the research may take, but are by no mean necessarily accurate, not to mention roadblocks can in principle occur at the final step towards completion.
    4) The Research Model is kind of like blind research when it comes to THEORETICAL FIELD and when any given APPLICATION may pop up. However, I do have control over the specific APPLICATION I want to research.

    Now there are some ideas I am toying:
    1) Technology Shock idea (originally conceived for MOO3, but was not implemented).

    Tech Shock is a feature intended to keep technology research on a smooth pace, rather than the crazy 1-tech-discovery-per-turn frenzy (or even 2 or 3 tech!) that can plague the game (e.g. SMAC/X, Civ2). Basically, the concept is that the society cannot cope/deal with all these new inventions should they arrive too quickly (ethical/moral acceptance, adjustment of world views, etc). As such, should a myriad number of new technology come popping up in a short time, there will be social backlashes. Of course, the danger of tech shock would also depend on the kinds of technology invented. Frontier researches are more likely to scare people than the wheels

    Other games, like Civilization 3, attempts to maintain a smooth tech-research path by setting a minimum number of turns restriction between inventions. Tech Shock can be thought of as a incentive rather than a restriction, compare to Civ3's method.

    2) Complete blind research option

    This shouldn't be too difficult to code. It can be done simply by not allowing the players to adjust the funding level for specific APPLICATION, and allocate RPs for APPLICATION category evenly among all available APPLICATIONS. The player can, of course, still view the estimated progress, as well as click on the tech to see a description of it. This way the same GUI will still be usable, no need to change it. This would, of course, be a game setup option.

    3) Adaptive Blind research option, or Need-Driven model

    This is conceivable much harder to design and may even frustrate players. Nevertheless, the idea is that while the player still retain control over allocation of RPs among various FIELDS and the category of APPLICATION as a whole, the funding level of individual APPLICATION are not even as was in Complete blind research model. The actual funding level of each individual APPLICATION invention is influenced by allocation to each FIELD, as well as the need of the society. Moreover, players aren't allowed to see the individual funding level of APPLICATION inventions, except its description, and maybe progress estimation.

    For example, if the society is involved in an offensive war, offensive military technology may be given priorities (but a major defeat may shift the focus to defensive capabilities). However, when a society is at peace, planet development technology will be given priorities. Now the transition isn't a sharp, but gradual one. Other factors that may influence funding are governmental policies, diplomatic relations, faction profiles, planet conditions, plan randomness, and etc.

    This research model may perhaps more "realistic," but significantly harder to design and balance. In addition, it may lessen player's fun but taking away the control. However, this model can provide very interesting gaming.

    ----------------------------------------
    Just another of my incessant babbling... ^_^

    For some information on the inspiration for the above model (i.e. the original, not the final, moo3 model), follow the link below.
    http://moo3.quicksilver.com/official/tech01.html

    -Gateway103

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    • #17
      Gateway Ras isn't the Moderator Blake is so good luck in getting it deleted. I haven't heard a word from Blake in awhile. Gateway delete all of the post and put "/me" needs a moderator to delete this post.
      -J.B.-
      Naval Imperia Designer

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      • #18
        JB... well, at least the above editing method can save me some embrassement

        -Gateway103

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        • #19
          np Gateway, it has happened to me before.
          -J.B.-
          Naval Imperia Designer

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          • #20
            who cares about the double posting, your techmodel is BRILJANT!! thumbs up!
            Truly great madness cannot be achieved without significant intelligence.
            -Henrik Tikkanen

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            • #21
              wow i will read this soon....
              Bunnies!
              Welcome to the DBTSverse!
              God, Allah, boedha, siva, the stars, tealeaves and the palm of you hand. If you are so desperately looking for something to believe in GO FIND A MIRROR
              'Space05us is just a stupid nice guy' - Space05us

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              • #22
                Why thank you kindly Mark123jansen ^_^

                Although I can't take the credit. I simply "borrow" the original MOO3 Model, altered it and expanded slightly. ^_^

                -Gateway103

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                • #23
                  !!!!!!!!!!!!
                  IMHO, this model is 200% closer to real science progress than any other tech model I know of! Of course, you need both previous achievments and theoretical background! And, don't forget breakthroughs, science sometimes does great leaps due to some bad-known reasons.
                  If you don't see my avatar, your monitor is incapable to display 128 bit colors.
                  Stella Polaris Development Team, ex-Graphics Manager

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                  • #24
                    Shall we call it the "Gateway" model then? I like it, just give me some time to compile some feedback.
                    -J.B.-
                    Naval Imperia Designer

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                    • #25
                      The only Comment is that its GREAT!
                      -J.B.-
                      Naval Imperia Designer

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                      • #26
                        I just had time to read it now. Sounds brilliant! But I have some questions.

                        As I understand it roadblocks can occur with an application when you have only just met the pre-requisites. Roadblocks are less likely when you have a couple more theoratical lvls then the pre-requisites specify. Right?

                        Is it possible to break through the roadblock by increasing the research for the pre-requisite theoratical fields WHILE you are in a roadblock? Maybe you gain a lvl that can break you through? Or something?

                        And if there are also roadblocks with theoratical research, how are they influenced? By other theoratical lvls? Or are they just totally random?

                        And about the tech-shock. While it's an interesting idea, I'm against it. The best part of the game would for me be to research as much as possible as fast as possible. How long will one game last if you have a 1000 things to research and some tech shock-danger is slowing you down? It would take away some of the fun for me. Except if it's a 'mild' shock. One that you can compensate for with ... something. Maybe you can spend some resources by putting the people at ease, inform them slowly. Or maybe to keep the entire research a secret to the public. (which, if discovered, can make you less trustworthy to your people). Something like that. BTW, please explain how 'crazy 1-tech-discovery-per-turn frenzies' can plague the game.

                        From a player's perspective, he/she will know only a few things:
                        1) The tech tree vary from time to time, there is no one golden path that would always work, as the pre-quisites may change from time to time. This makes the game more repayable.
                        2) It is not beneficial to rush funding a research project, unless it is absolutely necessary. Putting all the eggs in one basket can have serious consequences should a roadblock occurs.
                        3) Do not trust the estimates I see on the research screen whole heartedly. They are there to give me some idea of the time the research may take, but are by no mean necessarily accurate, not to mention roadblocks can in principle occur at the final step towards completion.
                        4) The Research Model is kind of like blind research when it comes to THEORETICAL FIELD and when any given APPLICATION may pop up. However, I do have control over the specific APPLICATION I want to research.
                        This is a very complex research-method. I think the player should be able to see more of what's happening if he/she wants.

                        Great work, btw.
                        Michiel Helvensteijn
                        --
                        SPDT Member: Helpmate

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                        • #27
                          Michiel, concerning Roadblocks for Application. Yes, if you made advance in Theoretical Researches, it may indeed help you break the Roadblocks, this can be done via a die roll or two, with a higher chance for success.

                          As to Roadblocks for Theories, they are mostly random, but less frequent than Roadblocks for Applications, and generally have higher chance of yielding benenficial side-effects.

                          Regarding Tech-Shock, well, like I said, it is an idea I'm toying with. I realize that this can be frustrating to techophiles (e.g. me), although it may just be interesting enough to make me think about it.

                          Why is the crazy-one-tech-per-turn plaguing the game? In SP, I suppose it doesn't really matter if the player is happy with it. In MP though, this will likely occur only for the dominant faction(s), and they will get more and more powerful, pretty much denying all chance of the lesser deveoped factions from catching on. But that's just a thought, perhaps the richer get richer is the way of reality, albeit perhaps not the most interesting/fun one.

                          As for being slowed down by tech shock and not being able to research everything... Well, I would hope the tech reservoir is deep enough that unless someone is obsessed with tech research, he/she/it will most likely not have researched/traded for every tech during any given game. Instead, he/she/it may have to specialize on one or two Fields. This would encourage replayability, if just for the "discovering-new-tech feeling". But that's just me.

                          -Gateway103

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                          • #28
                            w00t finally read gateways proposal.........me liking it!
                            Bunnies!
                            Welcome to the DBTSverse!
                            God, Allah, boedha, siva, the stars, tealeaves and the palm of you hand. If you are so desperately looking for something to believe in GO FIND A MIRROR
                            'Space05us is just a stupid nice guy' - Space05us

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