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Which US PResidents were Horrid?: Part II

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  • #16
    Does anyone care to guess my response?

    He even took the "Birth of the Nation" as a factual documentary-based film.
    You're telling me that the movie about the virtuous plunger-men battling the evil bad-makeup-job advocates was fiction?
    "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
    -Bokonon

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    • #17
      So in other words, you see the Constitution as something that is stagnant, and static. A dusty document that should never change with the values and reality of society??
      Basically - only mechanism of change is an Amendment.

      If that is how you view the Constitution, you are mistaken. The Constitution is a document that should be able to be changed without altering its fundamental, basic underlying principles.
      Wrong. See above.

      And of course, you and I disagree with Lincoln. I believe Lincoln did not violate the Constitution, or, at the most, a couple of minimum violations.
      Yes, suspending habeas corpus is a "minimal" violation
      Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
      Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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      • #18
        Originally posted by David Floyd

        Yes, suspending habeas corpus is a "minimal" violation
        Read some books other than your own narrow perspective.

        Such as one that is titled

        The Reintegration of American History—Slavery and the Civil War by William W. Freehling.

        Believe it or not, there are historians who argue both sides of the issue in regards to Lincoln.
        A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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        • #19
          The violation wrt suspending habeas corpus was that he didn't get Congressional approval first (which he did eventually get later in his term). Compared to some of the other violations of the Constitution by Lincoln, it could be thought of as minimal.
          "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
          -Bokonon

          Comment


          • #20
            I voted Andrew Johnson and Woodrow Wilson as really bad presidents.


            I added US Grant to that. He appointed his friends, who were some of the most corrupt people you'd ever see. Great general, bad Prez.
            “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
            - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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            • #21
              Believe it or not, there are historians who argue both sides of the issue in regards to Lincoln.
              Yep, there's a right side and a wrong side wrt 19th century Constitutional law. Apparantly the people who you've read are on the wrong side.
              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
              -Bokonon

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Ramo


                Yep, there's a right side and a wrong side wrt 19th century Constitutional law. Apparantly the people who you've read are on the wrong side.


                Nope, and I'm not going to get into the kids' playground screaming fight, "you're wrong! I'm right!"
                A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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                • #23
                  Good, cause it's 2 against 1
                  Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
                  Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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                  • #24
                    Nope, and I'm not going to get into the kids' playground screaming fight, "you're wrong! I'm right
                    Har har har.

                    Maybe you could point out in the Constitution where it says federal troops have the authority to break strikes. Perhaps you can point out the Constitutional justification for conscription as well. What about railroad subsidies? Et cetera, etc., etc.
                    "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                    -Bokonon

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Or for that matter using the military to influence state elections (and possibly even his own in 1864).
                      Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
                      Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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                      • #26
                        When the Southern states seceded because they could not accept the legitimacy of a majoritarian government, they broke up the United States.

                        This could be seen as an internal violation of the United State's soveirgnty, when the Southern states seceded.
                        A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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                        • #27
                          A)But it isn't
                          B)I'm talking about his use of troops against the Maryland Legislature
                          Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
                          Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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                          • #28
                            In the book I mentioned, the author argued how Lincoln did not violate Maryland's functioning state government.

                            I wish I remembered his points.
                            A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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                            • #29
                              Sounds like bullshit to me - he arrested members of the Legislature without violating MD's government. Ladies and gents: Harry Houdini!
                              Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
                              Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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                              • #30
                                MrFun, I believe I made a post addressed to you.
                                "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                                -Bokonon

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