COMBAT v. 3.1 (no host)

[Internationalist]

City Walls & other city fortifications:

If hit they have to use production(shiels)to repair their damage[would give more interest in combat if you have to use part of your production to defend yourself instead of using it entirely to produce armies, if you're sieged].By the way sieges would be better potrayed like this IMHO: a city is say a square big.In order to siege it, you should have a MILITARY unit in all 4 sides round it(popup:you have the ability to siege this city,Y/N?).This is after all the meaning of sieging a city:having the city in question cut off on all sides from comm's,supplies,reinforcements,etc.
It is simplistic(again IMHO) to put a unit on top of a city and siege it this way(furthermore i don;t think it can be done without it being destroyed or the city taken).

[Internationalist]

A very good idea.I also think that,say, ancient units should be totally unable to attack certain series of units(e.g. aerial units).Last time I checked it was pretty difficult for a spear to reach flying things more than several dozen feet high!

[Dr Strangelove]

With respect to the complaints that Legions should not be able to defeat bombers I've got an idea. When is the last time anyone heard of a force armed with swords, spears, or arrows taking on a modern force? it just doesn't happen. What happens when a people who lack the ability to make modern weapons fight a nation that can make modern weapons is that the less developed people adopt guerilla tactics. They lay low, steal or buy weapons, and gradually build up their strength.

I propose that military units be grouped into categories as stone aged, ancient, early modern, modern, and futuristic. Any time that a unit that is 2 or more groups more primitive than the most advanced engages in combat, the more primitive unit should have a chance of converting itself to a guerilla unit, and if it defeats the more modern unit, may even acquire the characteristics of the more modern unit. There would have to be at least 2 or 3 different types of guerilla units represnting guerillas engaged against early modern, modern, and futuristic units. Perhaps air and naval units would be exempt from the rule allowing the primitive unit being able to acquire its characteristics, though they should be able to defend themselves on the appropriate guerilla level. It might be considered that if the primitive unit is 3 levels below the more modern unit its chance of converting to a guerilla should be reduced. Anytime that a unit facing another that is 2 or more levels advanced, if it does not convert to a guerilla, it is automatically eliminated unless the more modern unit is an air or naval unit, in which case it takes hits without hitting back.

[Internationalist]

Also one could use it to affect his own units(with use of priests/diplomats) in order to increase their loyalty modifier and persuade them to do suicidal attacks(giving them kamikaze status,at which they would have better attack and worse defence)

[Internationalist]

I'd like to see a psionics attack/defence modifier in game.It would greatly improve scenario building(e.g. in Xcom scenarios) and in normal game could be used in order to justify the existance of a priest/cleric unit an added ability for diplomats and excuse for civs to brainwash their opponent armies in cities.

[Dr Strangelove]

My mistake, but I think that 50-70 by 50-70 would be more suitable.

[Theben]

Strangelove-
I have no idea who wrote the original proposal, but the line before calls for a battle screen 15 by 15 tiles. I assume that the "5x3" spacing was for different reasons: left, center , and right flanks, and 5 types of ranges. Anyway, when you're trying to turn one of these threads into some sort of digestible format, one tend to just hope that what the author wrote makes sense w/o checking too hard (especially after staring at the screen for more or less 8 hours straight). In the end I just hope that Firaxis (or the Clash team, they've been known to peruse these threads) will find the author's point.

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Theben
Co-Moderator of the Civ3 Forums

[Dr Strangelove]

Don't get me wrong, I like the basic idea, I just think that the battlefield will need to be larger that 5 by 3, and you should have some sort of terrain generator that takes into account the surrounding terrain on the strategic map. with regards to formations the designer will need to consider that units in the 20th century and beyond don't deploy in the types of formations used in previous centuries. I suppose yopu could let someone deploy their infantry in line attack formation, just to mimic early WWI casulty rates. In fact, the very scale of the battle map in the 20th century will need to be changed. Battles in previous centuries rarely covered more then 5 miles of frontage, but battles in this century may cover hundreds of miles. Consider that on the strategis map a tile may represnt an area more than 200 by 200 miles.

[Dr Strangelove]

If you're describing what I think you're describing with regards to the battle map and conducting combat thereupon, what you have will be about as much fun as the combat systems in "Imperialism" or "Masters of Orion". You need more room to manuever, and realistic terrain to provide enought variety to make playing the battle map fun. I think what you're describing would become tedious very quickly.

[Theben]

*Bumped* for Raingoon's (and anyone else who wants to) perusal. Check out the very top under Combat Systems.

[Krenske]

I have a quick suggestion to make. Harriers and Helicopters etc are expected to fly from field sights as opposed to bases. They do though have performance and load carrying problems. How about vstol aircraft and helicopters simply acting as fighter bombers that have 1/2 range and 2/3 attack etc for a normal aircraft of the same cost etc but allow them to base anywhere. I assume that the slow incremental away from base damage for helicopters in civ2 is to represent this.

[Theben]

I'll e-mail you.

[loinburger]

Whatever happened with the summaries, Theben? Did your Combat summary get emailed off to Firaxis?

[Theben]

bump

[loinburger]

I'm pretty sure that Maneuver Points got in there somewhere (my summary that is). I'd find out exactly where, but I'm stuffed right now and am probably going to take a nap soon. I'll look for it later.