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How the big boys use Arty?

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  • Zero
    replied
    Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior

    Have you ever done an attack where you've killed the three spearmen and there's just some puny little guy holding the city, but you don't have anyone to attack it with? And you know that next turn he's gonna pop-rush a new spearman and you will have to attack it with a wounded swordsman? That's when you use the Numidian Mercenary. Fortunately, the one unit you manage to take the city with can defend at three.
    All too familiar....

    [quote]

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  • Jaybe
    replied
    Originally posted by player1
    So why are you using Cavalry at all.
    ...
    Yes, it does make cavalry useful only in situations they can get in and back out of. Haven't built cavalry for quite some time.
    My guerillas (partisans) are becoming more and more necessary as bombers and battleships are destroying my communications and infrastructure.

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  • player1
    replied
    Originally posted by Jaybe

    *Guerillas modded to 2MP, all terrain 1MP.
    So why are you using Cavalry at all.
    Your guerrilas are both mobile (and even more in hills and Mountains) and have good defense.
    Much better thing then Cavalry.

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  • Jaybe
    replied
    In my current debacle (being slowly crushed), surgical use of artillery allows me to knock attacking unescorted tanks to 1HP, after which I finish them off with cavalry/guerillas.*

    I never thought I would get such entertainment from losing a game!

    *Guerillas modded to 2MP, all terrain 1MP.

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  • player1
    replied
    Originally posted by GusSmed
    I played my first game as Korea tonight, and lo and behold, you can't upgrade Catapults to H'wacha.
    That bug, which is reported and will be corrected.

    By the way, 2Hwatcha == cost of one Arty.

    Bombard effectiveness of 2Hwatcha == 1 Arty.

    Only bad thing: range of 1.

    So for defenseive purposed you get Arty much earlier then anybody else.

    Of course, probelm with Atry is that it's not too much usefll if enemy has not Infantry (Cabalry are enought then).

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  • GusSmed
    replied
    Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior
    In the case of Korea, it is fun to stash hordes of bombard units so that you can do a mass upgrade to Hwachas and kick everyone's ass. A lost HP is almost garaunteed with a Hwacha.
    You know, I hate it when someone talks about a theoretical strategy that they've never tried as if they've pulled it off several times.

    I played my first game as Korea tonight, and lo and behold, you can't upgrade Catapults to H'wacha.

    H'wacha are awful. Not only are they a poor alternative to massed Cavalry, they don't trigger a Golden Age. Which means as Korea, you're stuck hoping to build the right wonders to get a Golden Age, which is largely a matter of luck if you're playing on Deity.

    - Gus

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  • BRC
    replied
    I am not sure if I understand what you mean. Last time was about a year ago, but I have currently no trip planned. Perhaps I will visit a conference in New Orleans in October 2003. Why?
    Sorry Olaf. Just a joke in reply to your "I'm not a lady!" remark.


    I am usually at war. Not to exterminate anyone else usually, but to generate Leaders. I like to send well defended groups of elites into enemy territory and fight until a leader emerges. Stacks of Musketmen and Elite Knights and Elite Swordsmen as an example. Does anyone else do this? Do you bring along cannons? Even with Infantry and Cavalry, as Leaders are useful for TOE, Hoover, and Suffrage. Thanks

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  • Chemical Ollie
    replied
    Originally posted by Arrian
    ...

    Knocking a counterattacking AI unit to the red and then hitting with an elite unit is a good combo: the chances of you losing that elite unit to a bad RNG roll are very low.
    ... -Arrian
    Using the stack of doom for "target practice" is also useful to train your units before you send them into enemy territory, so they are all elite. I did that in one of the mini-tournaments.

    Lock the stack in, preferably by putting infantry on high ground all around it, but try to keep one tile open. They will try to move the wounded units home through the open tile. Those poor, crippled guys will be sitting ducks.

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  • Arrian
    replied
    I will use artillery, I just rarely build it. I almost always end up capturing about 5 catapults from the AI, and I will hold on to those, and upgrade them.

    I'm a fastmover user, so I typically don't find that catapults (or even arty) are particularly useful on offense (though what Jag Warrior does makes total sense). I will bring them along and use them to thwart counterattacks. Knocking a counterattacking AI unit to the red and then hitting with an elite unit is a good combo: the chances of you losing that elite unit to a bad RNG roll are very low.

    Late in the game I will probably build some more arty, along with capturing some more bombard units from the AI (usually cannon). I seem to end up with 15-20 arty by the endgame.

    Artillery are solid units, and are very useful if you want to break a certain road, soften up incoming attackers, damage AI ships, or - if you must - fight in the period between infantry and tanks.

    -Arrian

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  • jshelr
    replied
    "A question with this. What do your homeland defenses look like at end of the game? What per city? Do you ignore your inland cities? I know that this is different against humans, but assume all opponents are AI. Railroads allow you to decrease the number of Mech Infantry needed for defense, but if you have Arty too, does it make sense to "defend" with MA. Assume you're in a representative govt."

    Railroads take the geography out of defense. I keep defensive units stacked in cities that can be surprise-attacked and in coastal cities in case marines show up. Otherwise, as a practical matter, it simply doesn't matter where the units are. This is actually sloppy thinking since you ought to do everything possible to make yourself blitz-proof. But the AI has not blitzed me and I've lost my edge of worry about it.

    Inland cities hold whatever tank/MA stacks they have built since I'm too lazy to move them until necessary. However, good housekeeping requires that you put all your arty in one stack whenever possible or movement/firing gets a bit complicated and you may lose bombardment turns. (If you were really worried about surprise attacks, you should use the arty to prevent that as well. But, again, I just opt for convenience.) The build list gets exhausted late in the game and you can sometimes find yourself with silly numbers of units without real planning.

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  • Chemical Ollie
    replied
    Originally posted by BRC

    ...

    Olaf: Appreciate the advice on the cruise missiles. My impression is that catapults just aren't worth the upkeep either.

    And to think, I was going to ask you if you would be in the U.S. anytime soon.

    ...
    I am not sure if I understand what you mean. Last time was about a year ago, but I have currently no trip planned. Perhaps I will visit a conference in New Orleans in October 2003. Why?

    Leave a comment:


  • BRC
    replied
    Dave: Thanks. I am wondering if I produce too much culture (on Monarch) and ignoring other important aspects. I am always almost 2x ahead, even on the not so great maps.

    Olaf: Appreciate the advice on the cruise missiles. My impression is that catapults just aren't worth the upkeep either.
    Don't call me a lady!
    And to think, I was going to ask you if you would be in the U.S. anytime soon.

    jshelr: I saw Moonsinger's thread. Good stuff. I just have yet to run across a situation where that much coordination is necessary to get a jump. I'll keep it in the back of my head, though.

    In games where you have had problems and are not overrunning the world with cavs, then arty are the best defensive units after RR. You can wheel up a stack of 40 arty to any spot in your civ and fire in just one turn. This power makes you virtually invulnerable to any AI attack.

    A question with this. What do your homeland defenses look like at end of the game? What per city? Do you ignore your inland cities? I know that this is different against humans, but assume all opponents are AI. Railroads allow you to decrease the number of Mech Infantry needed for defense, but if you have Arty too, does it make sense to "defend" with MA. Assume you're in a representative govt.

    Gus: I understand where you are coming from, but leaders can be used on completion of SS if you hit some bad luck. I agree though that late leaders are not anywhere near as powerful as Ancient and Medievil ones.

    Alva: Yet to play Emperor or Diety, but feel like I am ready to try it. Will probably pick it up after this thread. Thanks.

    Keep it coming guys, and girls..... I want to be able to contribute to more of your threads, eventually.

    Leave a comment:


  • player1
    replied
    Now, Arty can be good for defense too.

    If enemy has some stack of doom (20-50 units), and especily if those units are something like Infantry.

    Then you just bombard and bombard and bombard and bombard and bombard and bombard and bombard, and after that you'll seee a lot of 1hp units.

    Then take them out with some of your units without casualties.




    P.S.
    On the other hand, with new PtW add-ons Arty could get more use.

    Since Radar Tower gives extra +25% defense and Civild Defense extra 50% defense (for a total of extra +75%).

    A lot of extra defense against Tanks.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chemical Ollie
    replied
    Originally posted by jshelr

    ...

    I'm beginning to think there is a female bias in favor of arty. They will probably teach us a lesson on PTW.
    Don't call me a lady!

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  • alva
    replied
    On emperor, I don't use artilery of any kind, if I capture one , I will disband it, in the nearest city.
    Not that there not usefull, just feels like an exploit.

    On deity I will use it alot. But then again, on deity, I need as much help as I can get

    In games where you have had problems and are not overrunning the world with cavs, then arty are the best defensive units after RR. You can wheel up a stack of 40 arty to any spot in your civ and fire in just one turn. This power makes you virtually invulnerable to any AI attack.
    So very true

    Leave a comment:

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