Lego FA thread 1

[Rhothaerill]

Originally posted by Beta


I know. There is absolutely no logic behind my argument whatsover. I am being nostalgic. I need that link to the past to hold onto. And we do need a palace guard - don't we? What happens when jon miller comes in after a night of drinking?

Okay, we'll keep at least one.

[Rhothaerill]

After a short PM to Vondrack about potential email difficulties I was having here is a note I sent to him about the workers

Ah good.

I think I forgot to mention that we will be keeping our own 2-turn pump active for a while. 8 of those first 15 workers needed will be to get that city up to size 12. I haven't decided yet how I want to work it since our pump city is also the one that can potentially grow to size 19. Adding workers is the quickest way, but I'm not sure I want 15 workers hanging around sucking gold while we build them and then a hospital.

I think for now I will have the pump shut off when we have the first 15 workers (and a few more to hang around for emergencies) and then work on building the three hospitals.

Rhoth

[Rhothaerill]

And Vondrack's response.

Building 8 workers is a matter of 5 turns maximum for us - and as we are going to keep ~15 workers around for pollution cleaning duties, we should be able to send you 8 at any time.

Agreed on keeping the pump active until you reach the pre-hospital maximum populations in your other cities. Once you're there, shut it off and start the hospital. We will supply the workers you'll need once you are done with the hospital.

Summing it up, it seems you will need our "newly built" workers for 8 more turns (enough to produce 4 workers of your own and 8+4 of ours). OK, I'll keep that in mind. Unless something urgent/unexpected comes up here in Legoland, the worker supplies should be quite steady - 3 workers every 2 turns.

Cheers,
Radek

[Rhothaerill]

Message from Vondrack

Hi, guys!

> You're up. Our worker joining went well. Our output is now 402
> beakers at 100% science with a 78 gold deficit at the moment.
> Espionage will come next turn. We'll also be picking up some 200 extra gold thanks to the joining.
> :-D

Yay!

The numbers sound awesome - that's Flight in 10t! You may be small in area and handicapped by its roughness, but I believe your impact will be far bigger than what one would expect.

Anyway... be so kind and keep your research at 100% until you discover Flight. We shall see afterwards - we will probably time your research of the Amphibious Warfare so that its discovery coincides with our own discovery of Radio (last industrial tech).

We will keep sending 220g... at least for two more turns. We shall see then - while doing Atomic Theory, we might need to slow down a wee bit, not sure about that.

On another note... GS is probably up to something. Not only they went average strength vs. us in 1080AD, but they have most probably become
#1 in Mil. Service this turn (we've fallen to #2). There is more than one potential target, but I feel it will be us and/or you to get the blow. Do you have a bulletproof naval screen in your Western Ocean?

We probably look a bit weaker militarily than we actually are, as we are not yet upgrading our rifles (just building new infantries), but the next about 20 turns should be crucial. That's the only window of opportunity GS will have to fight us with at least some advantage (tanks vs. infantry). Not sure if others attack us at the same time, too... with our falling powergraph curve, they may actually become more scared of GS than of us.

Well... Mass Production in 2t, right on schedule.

Take care,
Radek aka vondrack
Legoland

[Rhothaerill]

My response

Hi Radek,

We'll keep on going at 100% science.

As to GS, they cannot get by in the west without being seen. The north is another matter however so just this past turn I sent one of our newer units to cover the west to be able to send an old caravel up to cover the northwest. In another few turns we'll be able to cover the northeast too to spot GoW attacks.

Hmm, just had an idea. Now that we're about to hit size 12 in many of our cities we need either a luxury, an entertainer, or the lux slider to maintain the happiness in our cities. I don’t really want to get another of our stockpiled luxury options quite yet so I am using entertainers at the moment, but I wonder if I should ask GS for one of the luxuries they owe us. If they refuse then we'll know what's up. If they give it to us and attack later then they're reneging on a deal and will catch some nastiness in the main forum.

Our new settler will be finished soon as well so that emergency city we had talked about will be ready if needed.

Jared

[Beta]

If they give it to us and attack later then they're reneging on a deal and will catch some nastiness in the main forum.

Reminds me of the good ole' days.

[Rhothaerill]

Further from Vondrack

Hi Jared,

> We'll keep on going at 100% science.

Good, thanks.

Just this one tech and we'll be happy to let you slow down... but The Flight is of a principal importance to us. It's the hammer we need to properly welcome any invaders.

> Hmm, just had an idea. Now that we're about to hit size 12 in many of
> our cities we need either a luxury, an entertainer, or the lux slider
> to maintain the happiness in our cities. I don't really want to get
> another of our stockpiled luxury options quite yet so I am using
> entertainers at the moment, but I wonder if I should ask GS for one of
> the luxuries they owe us. If they refuse then we'll know what's up. If
> they give it to us and attack later then they're reneging on a deal
> and will catch some nastiness in the main forum.

This is actually an excellent idea. 20 turns is a loooong time (we'll be entering modern times in ~20t) - not sure if it is wise to keep saving the lux option(s) "for later times". IMHO, the game will be decided in ~40-60 turns maximum.

I am going to post your email in our forum and ask other guys what they think, but as for me, I believe it's just plain brilliant.

BTW - how many such options do you have stockpiled?

> Our new settler will be finished soon as well so that emergency city
> we had talked about will be ready if needed.

Great. Our caravels-to-be-upgraded-to-transports are already on their way to The Legoon. Everything should be in place within ~5 turns (well, at least the first 3-4 transports... but that's 24-32 units to be transported in case of an emergency).

Take care,
Radek

[Rhothaerill]

And my response

Hi Radek,

That sounds good. I will wait to contact GS about the luxury item until after our next turn. It would look a little suspicious if we did it right now, and I want it to look natural.

We have five more options stockpiled with ND, and two with GS. Hmm, that's actually enough to keep us going without need for the lux slider for roughly 50 more turns counting what we have going right now. I'll definitely be asking them for a luxury item then.

Jared

[Rhothaerill]

And Vondrack's response

Hi Jared,

> That sounds good. I will wait to contact GS about the luxury item
> until after our next turn. It would look a little suspicious if we
> did it right now, and I want it to look natural.

> We have five more options stockpiled with ND, and two with GS. Hmm,
> that's actually enough to keep us going without need for the lux
> slider for roughly 50 more turns counting what we have going right
> now. I'll definitely be asking them for a luxury item then.

Fine - other folks in Lego were of the same opinion. We will hardly gain any information we could rely upon (after all, even GS can learn a trick... they sorta owe you a nice little backstab, right? , but it is worth trying. And if you are fine for 50 turns... well, then you better start using all those luxes, as the world be very different in 50 turns.

Take care,
Radek

[Rhothaerill]

Message from Vondrack

Hi, Jared!

> Thanks for the workers. Gathering Storm did send the luxury item so either
> they aren't planning anything directly against Vox or they are planning a
> betrayal. :-) As to flight, the ETA is now 9 turns like I thought.

I was unable to counter with dyes this turn - not an option yet. I
have sent twice as much of everything this turn (gold+workers) and
will not send anything next turn, to avoid messing with the lux deal.
Just repeat the offer this turn, please.

Mass Production with you, too. Nor Flight, nor Amphibious Warfare
discovered by anyone else yet.

Few things:

Would you block the entrance to The Legoon (S of Memory), please?
Anything, even an obsolete caravel would do. If you have nothing, I
will send a galleon of ours. Subs will soon come into play and we do
not want anyone to see our emergency naval link to/from Voxtavia.

How many units of yours still to upgrade? I am getting worried... a
war is coming... very, very soon. GS went strong vs. us this turn (GoW
went average, ND remained weak). They must be building army/navy like
crazy. GS' Mfg. Goods is now outside our range (1000+). There are only
2 possible targets - us/you and ND. While I'd not completely dismiss
the possibility of a blitzkrieg attack at the weak ND, I am 90% sure
it will be us. We'll be upgrading half of our rifles next turn and are
switching most production to military.

We've got a lot of units to upgrade, even if our upgrades are less
costly than yours (mostly rifles to infantries). It would help to know
how much gold you still need to modernize your remaining defenders
(forget the MIs, usem them as cannon fodder only - upgrading them
would be waste of gold, we better spend the gold on our upgrades).
Sorry for not keeping better records, but it's easier to ask you than
to have yet another spreadsheet...

Flight in 9t sounds great - I do not think speeding the research up
any more would be that important (and possible), so I am considering
sending no more workers for the moment and focus on our own cities
instead now. How many pop points you could still reasonably use ATM?

Cheers,
Radek

[Rhothaerill]

My response

Hi Radek,

I will repeat the offer this coming turn. Sounds good about Mass Production. We intend to have a few battleships roaming the waters too. :-)

We can block the lagoon entrance. We have a couple new destroyers coming out the turn after next. One of those should be able to be the first one there. Also, the settler for that link will be finished this coming turn.

We have about 8 pikemen left to upgrade, two of which we can do ourselves with the gold windfall we got from adding all those workers the turn before espionage was finished. I disbanded the remaining Immortals we had as they are useless and their lone upgrade is essentially useless now too (though Beta convinced me to keep one as a palace guard for old times sake ) Most of our production right now is military, with the exception of Eternity and Panama Vox who are finishing up universities. I plan to build some naval units and then follow it up with more artillery and infantry.

As to flight, speeding the research isn't possible within the time frame. We will have two universities soon, which will give all our cities but our pump city the maximum science output possible for them, but they won't make all that much difference for this technology. If you need to focus on your own cities then do so. We need 9 more pop points to get to our pre-hospital maximum, 8 of those will go into our pump city Hope. I'm planning on getting those workers, and then doing a mass joining to go from size 4 to nearly size 12. Our pump city doesn't have the infrastructure to support that size quite yet, but it can get up there pretty quickly.

Thanks,

Jared

[Rhothaerill]

More from Vondrack

Hi Jared,

> I will repeat the offer this coming turn. Sounds good about Mass
> Production. We intend to have a few battleships roaming the waters
> too. :-)

OK, cool.

> We can block the lagoon entrance. We have a couple new
> destroyers coming out the turn after next. One of those should be
> able to be the first one there. Also, the settler for that link
> will be finished this coming turn.

Fine, that's soon enough (GoW was lacking Mass Production last turn,
1110 AD, so they should not be able to sneak a sub through the strait
before you block it).

One of our ferries is already anchored W-NW of Port Hammer, another
two shall join her this coming turn. Then one more one every other
turn.

> We have about 8 pikemen left to upgrade, two of which we can do
> ourselves with the gold windfall we got from adding all those
> workers the turn before espionage was finished. I disbanded the
> remaining Immortals we had as they are useless and their lone
> upgrade is essentially useless now too (though Beta convinced me to
> keep one as a palace guard for old times sake )

This is good news. Considering I have sent you 400g this turn, that's
2 more upgrades. 4 to go. After establishing that lux deal, I'll keep
sending gold enough to upgrade 1 pike every turn. Means we should be
done in ~5 turns. That should be ok. The war is hopefully to begin not
THAT soon.

KEEP IN MIND YOU WILL GET NO GOLD FROM US NEXT TURN (in 1130AD).

> Most of our production right now is military, with the exception of
> Eternity and Panama Vox who are finishing up universities. I plan
> to build some naval units and then follow it up with more artillery
> and infantry.

Great, exactly what's needed.

> As to flight, speeding the research isn't possible within the
> time frame. We will have two universities soon, which will give all
> our cities but our pump city the maximum science output possible for
> them, but they won't make all that much difference for this
> technology. If you need to focus on your own cities then do so. We
> need 9 more pop points to get to our pre-hospital maximum, 8 of
> those will go into our pump city Hope. I'm planning on getting
> those workers, and then doing a mass joining to go from size 4 to
> nearly size 12. Our pump city doesn't have the infrastructure to
> support that size quite yet, but it can get up there pretty quickly.

Alright... not sure if you considered the 4 workers I have sent you
this turn. It would be great if you attached a brief info on your
progress to every save. We are keeping at least 10 workers around and
producing approximately 2 new ones every turn... and so far, pollution
has been nice to us. So helping you to your maximum population should
be easy once you need it (after you finish the necessary
infrastructure in Hope). In the meantime, I will be adding our new
workers to our cities. It's mostly to raise our gpt income, to pay for
new units entering the service. No big deal spt-wise.

Cheers,
Radek

[Rhothaerill]

And my response

Hi Radek,

Okay, we should be upgrade 4 units this turn then, with only a few more to go. All of our new land units will be infantry and artillery so no need for upgrade afterward.

As to workers this turn, if you have sent 4, then I will likely start a marketplace in Hope next. One can go to finish our other city out to size 12. Hope can grow one size in the next two turns and can then join the three remaining workers to get to size 8 which is about the max without a marketplace. At size 8 with shields maxed Hope is a near 20 shield city so it won't take too long to get the marketplace in. Once the marketplace is finished then we can get it up to size 12, but that is mainly for extra commerce. So probably this is the last bit of workers we could handle for a few turns. I'll keep you informed of when we might need the remaining ones, though in truth Hope can get up to size 12 quickly enough as it is our breadbasket city with the most food and a granary.

Jared

[Rhothaerill]

And the final bit from Vondrack

Hi Jared,

> Okay, we should be upgrade 4 units this turn then, with only a
> few more to go. All of our new land units will be infantry and
> artillery so no need for upgrade afterward.

Perfect. I am already arranging for the last ~500g to be sent soon. We
might slow/stop our own research for about 2 turns to put some upgrade
funds together (for both of us). It seems that getting to tanks may be
a question of getting there in the first place, rather than getting
there 1-2 turns faster. We shall need loads of infantry and artillery
to pin invading tanks/infantry down - and to upgrade all our rifles
and cannons, we simply need more than we can put together while
researching 4t/5t techs and supporting you with 200+gpt.

> As to workers this turn, if you have sent 4, then I will likely
> start a marketplace in Hope next. One can go to finish our other
> city out to size 12. Hope can grow one size in the next two turns
> and can then join the three remaining workers to get to size 8 which
> is about the max without a marketplace. At size 8 with shields
> maxed Hope is a near 20 shield city so it won't take too long to get
> the marketplace in. Once the marketplace is finished then we can
> get it up to size 12, but that is mainly for extra commerce. So
> probably this is the last bit of workers we could handle for a few
> turns. I'll keep you informed of when we might need the remaining
> ones, though in truth Hope can get up to size 12 quickly enough as
> it is our breadbasket city with the most food and a granary.

Excellent. Until further notice, I am going to use all our new workers
for our own cities. Those 4 workers you will need for Hope (if at all)
should be no problem.

Radek

[Rhothaerill]

Sent to Lego with the save.

You're up. I heartily dislike the way the diplo screen doesn't let a
non-gpt deal automatically continue if you want it to continue...and then
automatically sends you into revolution without it. The dyes ran out on us
this turn. I had to go through the cities to keep the size 12 ones after
the first from all revolting on me. Oh well.

I sent a new 1gpt-unaccepted for dyes. The one I sent last turn ended up
being part of the deal to get all those workers and gold to us. No big
deal.

Speaking of that, my numbers of upgrades were faulty. I didn't have the
save open at the time and was thinking that all the upgrades were pikes.
Actually only half of them were. The remaining four are caravels which
don't really need to be upgraded since we're not planning any
intercontinental war. So that means, thanks to your help, we have all of
our military upgrades finished as of this turn 1120ad.

Rhoth