Shall we approve Trip to access our forum?

[DeepO]

Not me. I would have still abstained. But my abstain vote would be different then, as you would need a majority of whites to accept the deal. Now, 3 white votes is more then enough, 3 people who have enough trust in Trip that this is going to work is really a compliment to him... he would never get half of our white votes in case of a majority poll.

DeepO

[nbarclay]

Abstention normally has the same effect as not voting. Only a majority of non-abstentions is needed to pass, not a majority of all votes cast. So three in favor, none against, and the rest abstentions would be enough for the motion to pass.

That's why I'm asking whether anyone would vote "no" if this were a conventional poll. I want to see whether the three whites represent the will of the team to the extent that people care, or whether the current vote just indicates that no one objects strongly enough to be the one to veto the idea.

Nathan

[Shiber]

I'd vote either abstain or yes. I'd hate for us to be the only team that doesn't let Trip in.

[DeepO]

Nathan, maybe that's how it works in the US, but in Belgium (and as far as I know the rest of Europe too) that's not how abstention works. You will need a majority of half the parliamant to approve a law. Because we are in a multi-party system (our government consists of 6 parties, another 8 or so are in the opposition), sometimes you get in the situation where people from the opposition agree on a law, but don't want to support it, because that would be support for the current government and they don't want to do that publicly. In this case, they will typically abstain, so that if the government gets a majority without their help, the law will get approved.

This is different from voting against it, because if you vote 'no' and get into government next election, you typically want to revoke that law, and try to find a majority to recall it. If you abstained, you basically agree, and don't want to revoke a law, at most adapt it a little.

There are more cases where you want to abstain, most of them if you aren't convinced, or have no opinion but don't feel bad enough about it to oppose it. This is currently the case...

So, in short, if this was a Belgian majority poll, it would only get approved if half our members voted in favor of it. If some people abstained, or didn't vote, their vote would not be seen as an automatic 'yes', but as an automatic 'no'.

But no veto, of course, in Belgium, only one man has a veto: our King. And the last time he used his veto (because he refused to sign an abortion law out of religious concern), he was officially proclaimed as "incapable of ruling Belgium" for two days (in short, he was temporarily declared crazy, and not fit for his job)... politics can get weird in Belgium, the least you can say is that those guys are creative.

DeepO

[asleepathewheel]

I would have voted "abstain" (I had to go out of town for a few days to a conference and waited too long to vote)

but knowing that the other teams have agreed and with NYE's faith, I would move to a tentative yes. I hate the idea of allowing someone to view our forum but the political ramifications would be too great I fear.


asleepathewheel goes to check his old lux posts for some editing

[FrustratedPoet]

The poll has closed now.

Shall we let NYE approve Trip for entry? Or do we want to decide this a different way?

my 0.02$ = let Trip in.

[Shiber]

Same here. It seems to me that a yes/no poll would produce the same outcome - correct me if I'm wrong.

[nbarclay]

My impression is that we'd have more yes's than no's if we had a regular poll, so we may as well go ahead and approve him.

Nathan

[DeepO]

Originally posted by asleepathewheel
asleepathewheel goes to check his old lux posts for some editing

If you find some of mine that are rather crude, edit them too, please

Welcome, Trip! Now, where's your thread you'll be asking in

DeepO

[notyoueither]

OK. Letting him in.

[alva]

Hi Trip
So what are the others up to?