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  • #16
    Super? Yes, that's a good point. Super ironclad, the best vessel of its time. Cool.

    If only it could carry land units. Dah!
    -- Academician Prokhor Zakharov,
    "For I Have Tasted The Fruit"

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    • #17
      Hey Carolus Rex,

      My OCC strategy is out of need, unfortunately. But I will say that I already have the Freight for the launch (not for appollo though arg.) My coffers are usually very low at the point of developing Apollo. But my enemy AI's are way too advanced to ignore. So I use the bomber tactic before I develope Apollo. I got to. the rivals have howitzers about the time I get my 15th structure. And howitzers can't be ignored and I dare not stop production of SS parts.

      Right now, my philosophy in OCC is "Win baby Win." With this done, I can try and break the 1900 barrier. (btw, I have never had the fortune of getting monarchy early! I'm not sure how to ignore the first contacts request for science trade while working toward monarchy...I always feel compelled to trade science as I want to make friends or demand tribute--kind of frustrating.)

      Anyone taking up OCC has got to read Paul's guide. And in it, he says that the 'invisible folks' voted approval of bombers and stacking. I can see the 'cheat' in it though--AI can't figure it out.

      So what is the super ironclad? I would have called it the Aegis, but you might mean battleship. I like the Ageis in my One City with Sam.

      My last game was done without a port. I won but it was hard. (1954) I had alot of mountains to terraform as well. It was getting kind of late in the game to found a city and I had to choose river and one whale and wine and wheat oh...and buffalo on a river! I had about 5 mountains with no good gold or iron! Atleast it was a good defensive position. By 1850, I had the thing plastered with fortresses. Then the great reduction to hills commenced. The game was fun. Tight. Managed three wars with two allies. And at the right moment, I said 'no' to the science jealous allies--then it was 5 wars

      Thanks, Ol' Chit Chat Aurelius!
      Do Androids dream of Electric Sheep? [--Inspiration of Blade Runner]

      "> > Sarchasm: The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the reader who
      >doesn't get it."--don't know.

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      • #18
        The AI is a little better than you think. At least handling this stacked formation. I sometimes build these 'battle group' fleets. http://www.i2k.com/~density/fleet.jpg

        The carrier in the center can carry a large number of planes. I've had 50+ aircraft on that one carrier. This setup does take a minute or two to move but it's tough. Parking 30 stealth fighters off the coast is neat. This picture was made in cheat mode. You'd probably want the AEGIS ships vet. There are 8 more bombers on the carrier that replace the bombers on -stack- duty. You can even use old bombers for this. Against a king or better AI you would also probably want more than one ship per sqaure as the AI will hammer away on one sqaure only with stealth fighters. I've lost a few of these groups as the AI one time attacked with 60+ planes. It finally opened a hole and nuked the carrier. It happens. For the most part this is a kick ass formation. I'd hate to move this in a MP game!!!
        If I never respond to you it's probably because you're on my idiot/ignore list.

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        • #19
          The ai nuked a ship? I have never seen that happen. Is it possible they do a cost analysis of the potential kills?

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          • #20
            I was wondering about that because I was surpirse at the number of stealth fighters it used to open up a hole. But yes, seen it 2 times. Believe me, I cried the first time... so many units lost.

            another thing the AI does is surround the entire battle group with 20-30 cruise missiles. You need stealth fighters to clear them out.
            [This message has been edited by My Wife Hates CIV (edited December 27, 1999).]
            If I never respond to you it's probably because you're on my idiot/ignore list.

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            • #21
              Aurelius ("the golden man", right?),

              I think it's safe to refuse trading techs before monarchy. The AI rarely declares war on me for declining, especially if I have a couple of NONE units to flex my muscles with.

              The Super Ironclad is a vet ironclad with 7 movement points (Lighthouse and Magellan's). In the post-gunpowder/pre-conscription era when musceteers behind walls rule, an armada of Super Ironclads is the way to go.

              Carolus

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              • #22
                Nuclear weapons are actually my preferred form of coastal defense, supplemented with stealth fighters and bombers. If the target in question is a Battleship, Carrier, or AEGIS crusier, or any kind of stack, while a Nuke is costly, it is the most reliable way to ensure that a target gets taken out. Water seems to be immune to pollution anyway. With a range of 16 squares, nukes are also ideal for reconnaisance. For the smaller ships, stealth fighters are a good way to take them out.
                When you laugh, the world laughs with you.
                When you cry, the world laughs at you.

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                • #23
                  Ah Carolus Rex,

                  Sometimes a bit of circumspection is smart. A very hasty pen-name, Aurelius. Atleast I didn't put Marcus in front. That would have been like Suraman (sp?), from Lord of the Rings, donning white robes and 'the wise'. But in civ, I take the peaceful route and feed the people well (not via food caravan trick though.) Still, in this game, I can't remember a campaign in which I have not been a tyrant at one point.

                  Carolus, I like the classics, though I plead innocence through ignorance on the matter. I'm sure AU is not accidental in Aurelius. Quite awhile ago, in d&d days, I had a character named Aurelius. He was anything but golden

                  And that Aurelius was more predisposed to speaking Orc than, "Friends, Romans, countrymen, lend me your ears.... [another Mar[k] of course!]"

                  But if I may Caroluslly say, of C., I know less?

                  A. (I'd rather cherish the pirite in my coffers than be confused for someone I am not but I do love the name--all three!)

                  (Favorite Quote of the day:

                  This was the most unkindest cut of all,
                  For when the noble Caesar saw him stab, Ingratitude, more strong than traitors' arms, Quite vanquished him....--where did Shakespeare get this stuff! )

                  Do Androids dream of Electric Sheep? [--Inspiration of Blade Runner]

                  "> > Sarchasm: The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the reader who
                  >doesn't get it."--don't know.

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                  • #24
                    I build a large navy as well. But I'd recommend AEGIS cruisers. They are amazingly cheap and fairly strong at coastal bombardments (not as much as battleships of course), and they don't get any cruise missles or aircraft launched against them.

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                    • #25
                      I enjoy Maintaining a large Navy.
                      I find you can almost entirely prevent any enemy from invading your lands with a gigantic fleet.
                      I mix it up, 6-8 battleships, 10-15 Cruisers and Destroyers, 5 Carriers, 10 transports and lots of subs(cruise missles).
                      I generally haven't built too many AGEIS Cruisers, I'll have to try them out.

                      Carriers are essential. Say you shore bombard a city and land in a few transports. You move your Howies across their railroads in a stunning Blitz. I'll use carriers offshore to mop up partisans that will pillage the squares they occupy. I'll rush build an airport in a central city of my invasion and just move my planes from there. The Carriers are great as they provide a great number of powerful srtikes deep behind enemy lines. You still have to worry about fighters, but if they only have a few, your vet. bombers will eventually prevail because of the nearby airport.

                      Navy is essential. It is part of the Modern War Triad. Plus it's fun to rule the seas, nothing gives me more satisfaction than sinking a fat transport full of enemy troops bound for my homeland.

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                      • #26
                        A big navy is not necessary in CivII. All you really need are some Transports and a few AEGIS to escort them. The best tactic to deal with the AI's navy is too simply avoid and go around them.

                        While Battleships and Carriers seem glamorous, there isn't a more pathetic sight than watching them spend spend 6 turns limping back to port at speed 2 after an attack.

                        Once you can build Coastal Fortresses, the AI's navy will never seriously bother your cities again. If the AI's navy hangs around your coast too much, Cruise Missiles take care of 'em except for AEGIS of course. For AI AEGIS, I will sometimes build a couple Subs, leave them in my port cities and wait for the AEGIS to get close enough.

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